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  1. #41

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lv1Sierpinski View Post
    I have little interest in which side of the 'fence' Bullshido puts Duncan, or any of his students.

    Could you provide some more details of the tournament your students won when you were in college?

    What it comes down to is that the stories that have thus far been presented fit the pattern, as far as I'm concerned, of many others that have trumped up the abilities of an individual, or of a group. Now I'm not trying to take anything away from anyone, but thus far it seems to be very vague: he's very tough, his students are very tough, all amazing fighters.

    And I'd be interested to hear more about that standing challenge...and if anyone still has it going. There are a few folks on here that everyone would take as the only needed test to gauge martial skill.
    In trying to be a good "bully" you are confusing different standards of proof. Firstly, if i was being investigated for a claim I made I might be expected to show some proof of a statement I made... But, that would probably take the form of me showing that I was the president of the martial arts club at St Mary's college when I was... which I was btw, not me proving anything about a tournament win.

    Usually a claim like you mention is satisfied with a skill assesment of some sort not as you seem to think. You are confusing standards of proof and how different claims are verified.

    Now rerarding me personally? I don't make any claims presently.... but if there is ever a compelling reason that will serve a purpose I am more than happy to have my skills assessed. I would probably want a training weapon used at this point however because back when i was a crazy fucker and let people come at me with real weapons, trained the Guardian Angels out here and patrolled crack houses in then in the Tenderlion and did other crazy ****.... I was sans a wife and two children which I now have as my major responsability. Under the circumstances I have to play nicely and try to stay alive... at least until the boys get through college... or so big mama tells me!
    This thread never was a high quality conversation - My friend vern Gilbert on the William Acquier thread.

    The fight in question having started over who owns which piece of rubble. Nicko1;2233174 On the Acquier Kim Fiasco slash thread.

  2. #42

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    Quote Originally Posted by maofas View Post
    Haha, I have to take credit for at least the title. I made fun of one of his other videos that was just over-the-top laughably, bizarro-world awful. This one starts looking pretty decent, however, around 3:50.
    Yea but it does prove to soem degree we TEST our techniques and not jus be liek the bujinkan..and we realize that some techniques need more evolution for them to work and most of them went to the ground. we dont deny things like..oh i dotn go to the ground cuz imma super duper ninja..now GIVEN more specialized arts liek bjj can destroy us but we're a self defense course not a course to make u into an athelete. So if you DO put us up against an athelete we WILL lose. however our aim is to defend ourselves against the joe schmo on the street who tries to mug us

  3. #43
    Raging Monkey's Avatar
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    I watched the video... it made my head hurt.

    I have to ask though, why are you calling it Ninjutsu when it obviously is not?

  4. #44

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    The following is taken from a site I assume to be associated officially with Master Duncan. I can not, nor do I care to, confirm this. Through reading the site, however, it seems obvious that this is the same group of people IMO.

    Seiko Fujita was born on August 13th, 1899 and learnt his Koga Ryu Ninjutsu from his grandfather, the13th Generation inheritor of the art. Fujita's grandfather died only a few years after Fujita began to study under him, but the tradition was still passed to Seiko Fujita and he was considered the 14th Generation successor in the art. Fujita, began to study various traditional Japanese Martial Arts indepth ranging from Karate to Shurikenjutsu. In his life time he wrote five books, which serve as excellent resources for Ninjutsu historians interested in the Koga Ninja traditions. Fujita died suddenly on January 4th, 1966. He will always be remembered as "The Last Ninja".
    The value of Seiko Fujita's works, as far as the Koga Ryu Ninjutsu Society is concerned, is that they demonstrate a preserved Koga Ryu sect; which can ultimately be used as a reference guide for our own research and revival efforts. Although Seiko Fujita's works are crucial, they are not the exhaustive measure of our research. Research should also rely heavily on older documents (i.e. Bansenshukai, Ninpiden,etc.) as well personal practice and experimentation.
    The K.R.N.S. does not claim to teach Fujita's Koga Ryu (Wada-ha), but does draw heavily from his influencial works. His various texts serve as a base for the historic aspects of our art, for this reason he must be honored and commended.


    This is from the website: http://www.kogasociety.com/history.htm

    They call it Ninjutsu because that is the martial tradition from which they draw their studies. Any LIVE/living martial art should change over time so why do you think it should look like anything particular.

    Also, each man has the right to call whatever they are doing whatever they like. It should ONLY be considered Bullshido if they call it a specific known name and either claim direct lineage (with proof otherwise) or deceptively ellude to such.

    Master Duncan, and all associated with him appear to have done neither. IN FACT, by what I have read on that site they are VERY open about the fact that they are not doing the same thing and are drawing heavily from research into such honoring the effort by naming in such a way as to give credit as to where they drew their inspiration.

  5. #45
    Raging Monkey's Avatar
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    So Duncan is now claiming lineage through Fujita Seiko (indirectly).

    This guy's story has changed so many times. Rofl-cakes! At least now he is trying to pin it on someone who actually existed (even though historians can show Seiko was not an actual student of ninjutsu and had no lineage himself).

    I remember when his story was that he was shot down over over Vietnam and learned Ninjutsu from some asian guy in a cave. Good times... good times.

  6. #46

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    Quote Originally Posted by jasonbrinn View Post
    The following is taken from a site I assume to be associated officially with Master Duncan. I can not, nor do I care to, confirm this. Through reading the site, however, it seems obvious that this is the same group of people IMO.

    Seiko Fujita was born on August 13th, 1899 and learnt his Koga Ryu Ninjutsu from his grandfather, the13th Generation inheritor of the art. Fujita's grandfather died only a few years after Fujita began to study under him, but the tradition was still passed to Seiko Fujita and he was considered the 14th Generation successor in the art. Fujita, began to study various traditional Japanese Martial Arts indepth ranging from Karate to Shurikenjutsu. In his life time he wrote five books, which serve as excellent resources for Ninjutsu historians interested in the Koga Ninja traditions. Fujita died suddenly on January 4th, 1966. He will always be remembered as "The Last Ninja".
    The value of Seiko Fujita's works, as far as the Koga Ryu Ninjutsu Society is concerned, is that they demonstrate a preserved Koga Ryu sect; which can ultimately be used as a reference guide for our own research and revival efforts. Although Seiko Fujita's works are crucial, they are not the exhaustive measure of our research. Research should also rely heavily on older documents (i.e. Bansenshukai, Ninpiden,etc.) as well personal practice and experimentation.
    The K.R.N.S. does not claim to teach Fujita's Koga Ryu (Wada-ha), but does draw heavily from his influencial works. His various texts serve as a base for the historic aspects of our art, for this reason he must be honored and commended.


    This is from the website: http://www.kogasociety.com/history.htm

    They call it Ninjutsu because that is the martial tradition from which they draw their studies. Any LIVE/living martial art should change over time so why do you think it should look like anything particular.

    Also, each man has the right to call whatever they are doing whatever they like. It should ONLY be considered Bullshido if they call it a specific known name and either claim direct lineage (with proof otherwise) or deceptively ellude to such.

    Master Duncan, and all associated with him appear to have done neither. IN FACT, by what I have read on that site they are VERY open about the fact that they are not doing the same thing and are drawing heavily from research into such honoring the effort by naming in such a way as to give credit as to where they drew their inspiration.
    Yes Jason live and let live but let me also say that as somoene who has trained a while.... you should also be informed. For example regarding Fujita, its not that simple. Fujita was, shall we say, like a good Ninja, known by many names.... He had lineage in Wado Ryu karate, Ju jutsu and a few Kobudo systems.. Often when one of the students in one of these systems was interviewed they would say that they knew him as a teacher in that tradition and that he never mentioned the ninjutsu.

    So somebody could and actually quite a few people of renown ability do, claim they learned under Seiko.... just not that they learned Ninjutsu
    This thread never was a high quality conversation - My friend vern Gilbert on the William Acquier thread.

    The fight in question having started over who owns which piece of rubble. Nicko1;2233174 On the Acquier Kim Fiasco slash thread.

  7. #47

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    Quote Originally Posted by Raging Monkey View Post
    So Duncan is now claiming lineage through Fujita Seiko (indirectly).

    This guy's story has changed so many times. Rofl-cakes! At least now he is trying to pin it on someone who actually existed (even though historians can show Seiko was not an actual student of ninjutsu and had no lineage himself).

    I remember when his story was that he was shot down over over Vietnam and learned Ninjutsu from some asian guy in a cave. Good times... good times.
    When has he claimed Seiko Fujita. I know many people say that he claimed it but do you have actual evidence of HIM claiming it or just other people accusing him of claiming Fujita? I'm from the school and I know we never even talk about lineage (the suuburbanninja's group) we just talk about how we can get techniques to work (in class maybe online or on th ephone we talked about lineage but I wasnt a part of it and I never heard such Seiko Fujita claims).

  8. #48

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    Quote Originally Posted by dachande71787 View Post
    When has he claimed Seiko Fujita. I know many people say that he claimed it but do you have actual evidence of HIM claiming it or just other people accusing him of claiming Fujita? I'm from the school and I know we never even talk about lineage (the suuburbanninja's group) we just talk about how we can get techniques to work (in class maybe online or on th ephone we talked about lineage but I wasnt a part of it and I never heard such Seiko Fujita claims).
    Duncan never made such a claim. He did claim Koga Lineage.
    This thread never was a high quality conversation - My friend vern Gilbert on the William Acquier thread.

    The fight in question having started over who owns which piece of rubble. Nicko1;2233174 On the Acquier Kim Fiasco slash thread.

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by jasonbrinn View Post
    The following is taken from a site I assume to be associated officially with Master Duncan. I can not, nor do I care to, confirm this. Through reading the site, however, it seems obvious that this is the same group of people IMO.

    Seiko Fujita was born on August 13th, 1899 and learnt his Koga Ryu Ninjutsu from his grandfather, the13th Generation inheritor of the art. Fujita's grandfather died only a few years after Fujita began to study under him, but the tradition was still passed to Seiko Fujita and he was considered the 14th Generation successor in the art. Fujita, began to study various traditional Japanese Martial Arts indepth ranging from Karate to Shurikenjutsu. In his life time he wrote five books, which serve as excellent resources for Ninjutsu historians interested in the Koga Ninja traditions. Fujita died suddenly on January 4th, 1966. He will always be remembered as "The Last Ninja".
    The value of Seiko Fujita's works, as far as the Koga Ryu Ninjutsu Society is concerned, is that they demonstrate a preserved Koga Ryu sect; which can ultimately be used as a reference guide for our own research and revival efforts. Although Seiko Fujita's works are crucial, they are not the exhaustive measure of our research. Research should also rely heavily on older documents (i.e. Bansenshukai, Ninpiden,etc.) as well personal practice and experimentation.
    The K.R.N.S. does not claim to teach Fujita's Koga Ryu (Wada-ha), but does draw heavily from his influencial works. His various texts serve as a base for the historic aspects of our art, for this reason he must be honored and commended.


    This is from the website: http://www.kogasociety.com/history.htm

    They call it Ninjutsu because that is the martial tradition from which they draw their studies. Any LIVE/living martial art should change over time so why do you think it should look like anything particular.

    Also, each man has the right to call whatever they are doing whatever they like. It should ONLY be considered Bullshido if they call it a specific known name and either claim direct lineage (with proof otherwise) or deceptively ellude to such.

    Master Duncan, and all associated with him appear to have done neither. IN FACT, by what I have read on that site they are VERY open about the fact that they are not doing the same thing and are drawing heavily from research into such honoring the effort by naming in such a way as to give credit as to where they drew their inspiration.
    I have Doron Doron Saigo no Ninja (and also the reprint Koga Ryu Ninja Ichidaiki) , Kenpo Gokui Atemi Sakkatsuho mekai (I did a partial translation of this almost 10 yrs ago, this is also one of Fujita's most ripped off works), Ninja Hiroku, Shinto Muso Ryu Jojutsu, Zukai Hojojutsu and a few other tidbits by him. I used to have Zukai Shurikenjutsu too but gave it to a friend as a gift.
    Anyone claiming to study ninjutsu by "studying" or "drawing from" his works are full of BS. I say this because he does little in the way of instructing ninjutsu and descriptions on techniques are vague, pretty much the way they are in most actuall densho/makimono on MA.
    Even until very recently most pple claiming to study from Fujita's work didn't even know the school he claimed or its history.
    Fujita was known for many things but the main skills demonstrated and taught were from a Kenpo school. (note that some JJJ schools used the name KENPO but are not connected to Ryukyu Kenpo)

    AFFIK to date NONE of Fujita's students actually claimed to inherit his ninjutus school. Fujita's had also stated his school will probably die with him, AND that he himself never learned everything from his grandfather. So far its mainly non-Japanese speaking/reading westerners that seem to dispute that.
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  10. #50

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    here's an old article listing the arts duncan trained in

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