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  1. #11

    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Xi'an, P.R.C.
    Chinese Kung Fu
    oh yeah, I forgot one of my favorites,

    - downward leopard fist across the eyebrow. That's special for opening a cut.

    One last note,

    A lot of the CMA striking method is built around the idea of punching someone who is trying to grab you. So you have punching techniques where it is assumed that the other guy has already grabbed your arm.
    Last edited by Omar; 1/11/2006 8:18pm at .
    Fighting evil and upholding justice in blue silk pajamas baby!

    Bah!!! Puny Humans.

  2. #12
    Thaiboxerken's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Portland, Oregon
    Omar sure does know lots of gay stuff.

    Here is my guess as to where all of the weird strikes came from. Weapons. In the FMA, many empty hand strikes use the same motions as with a weapon in hand. It's taught that way to keep it simple. The strikes are not nearly as effective as boxing style punches, but those boxing style punches to make an appearance in panantukan because they recognize the deficiency with using your empty hand as a knife . Many other martial arts, I feel, use the same weird strikes but don't understand that they are not very effective without a weapon in hand.

  3. #13
    Thaiboxerken's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Portland, Oregon
    Quote Originally Posted by Omar
    - rising strike with the wrist under the chin.

    That's a pointless strike ..
    Yes it is.

    - inward forearm the the side of the head.
    Good for a takedown, not a good strike though.

    - Tiger claw to the trachea.

    Again, totally worthless with gloves on.
    Worthless withotu the gloves as well. All a person needs to do to foil this tactic is drive their chin to their chest thus releasing your "deadly" claw.

    - Index finger middle knuckle punch at an upwards angle under the cheekbone,
    - Index finger middle knuckle punch inwards towards someone's heart through the top couple ribs that are inside your armpit.
    - Same punch again but to the solar plexus.

    These are all valid targets with a regular punch but you can do much more damage with the "phoenix eye fist"
    I doubt it. You'll more likely break your finger. These are fun strikes to give people charlie-horses with, though.

    - How about the middle of somone's chest? A pretty useless target with a regular punch in that case but a palm strike can take someone out that way.
    A nice fist to the sternum can do some damage.

    - The forehead? Punch or Palm?
    Either way, it's gonna hurt your hand. It's not a good target.

    - index and middle fingers held together to stab upwards into someone's armpit. I'd like to see you hit someone there effectivel with a regular punch.
    I'd like to see you hit someone with an effective punch there with your index and middle finger. That armpit target is good for a knife, but not for your fingers.

    The list goes on.
    There is an endless supply of nonsense out there.

  4. #14

    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    BC, Canada
    Jiu Jitsu
    Quote Originally Posted by MaverickZ
    ridgehands make great clotheslines. but you'll have to ask El Guapo why he uses palm strikes.
    Rutten says on his career DVD that we would punch but was not allowed to in Pancrase, due to the rules. Watch his 2 UFC fights, he punches the whole time.

  5. #15
    Odacon's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Bits and pieces
    I think that any martial art without proper punches e.g. jab, cross, hook is watered down. That said some open hand strikes e.g. a proper slap are effective and I've seen many MMA fighters use hammer-fists on the ground.

  6. #16
    Badness will not be rewarded supporting member

    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Montreal, Canada
    Targeting the soft areas is usually reserved for street techniques only. Using gloves is only good for sport and they are much too inprecise in a true combat situation.

  7. #17

    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    white boy jiujitsu
    Quote Originally Posted by Snapp
    Rutten says on his career DVD that we would punch but was not allowed to in Pancrase, due to the rules. Watch his 2 UFC fights, he punches the whole time.
    cool, thanks. i thought i heard somewhere that he preferred palms, i guess i was wrong.

  8. #18
    Bullshido's Greatest Ninja staff
    plasma's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Kuso shite shinezo
    Basically you need different stirkes for setting up different things. If your goal to beat them to a pulp use a good solid fist. However, if you are using strike to set up a throw a fist is not always your best option. A better option would a sword hand or thumb to the neck or a palm stike to the face. Why? Becasuse you can go straight into a grab and throw. A punch, they would retreat before you can throw them.

  9. #19

    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Auburn, CA
    Isshinryu Karate
    I can't speak for all traditional martial arts of course, only for my training. At our dojo, we train on the hard side.

    Our bread and butter when it comes to hand strikes is the punch, no doubt about it. Whether its a reverse punch, hook punch, lunge punge, uppercut, etc that's what you'll see us use the most when striking with the hands.

    In our traditional kata we do however have nukite strikes as well as knife-hand and ridge hand attacks. I've seen people get knocked out in competition from knife hand and ridge hand techniques. I've seen people get stunned and incapacitated by nukite strikes.

    Personally, I don't work my nukites enough to make them effective. I've seen guys breaking boards and striking through watermellons with them and would hate to be on the receiving end of one of those from them, especially in a soft spot on the body. This is just a personal weakness for me... it's something that I should work on.

    Knife-hand attacks I am much more comfortable with. I certainly don't use them as often as I use a punches, but they do have a place in my striking. I find myself most often using knife hand strikes when in "odd" situations, most especially when I need a good strike that needs to be delieved in a downward motion where a punch would just be too awkward. When the opponent is bent over for whatever reason and the neck is a good juicy target is one example.

    When I most use the knife-hand though is when blocking, parrying, and slipping. I see a lot of people do this more than they even realize.

  10. #20
    Meex's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Tao Ga
    A lot of TMA techniques werer created for, and during combat/war.
    That said, many were useful then, being used against armor, with
    or without weapons, on/against horses, and so on. Even with the
    "empty hand" techniques, clothing had some consideration, so did
    climate and terrain.

    The problem with a lot of TMA is that they say that their
    techniques are viable in today's world, without actually knowing it.

    Without constant (or, at least recurring) testing in combat, whether
    or not a technique will work against an opponent is at best an
    uncertainty. Thus, the "art" stagnantes. This is a BIG problem, and
    happens whenever a system/style/art is "standardized" and taught
    in it's "pure" form - without regard to the fact that they art was
    "developed" over time, and tested, adjusted, retested, added to,
    retested, pared down, and retested during it's development.

    "Alive" as a training methodology must also be applied to "alive" as
    an art form. You martial art must adapt, and evolve with resistance
    that cannot readily be dealt with, or it will die.

    The reason many of the sportfighting arts are front and center in
    "alive" training methodologies, is they are used and tested (within
    limits) on a daily basis. All aspects of the training are studied, and
    any found lacking are disgarded, and replaced. The number of the
    techniques is certainly limited, and this is due to their sport specific
    needs. No armor, no weapons, no horses. Single combat to defeat.

    The best way to appraoch a street-worthy fighting system is to build
    it yourself from whatever training is out there. Make it fit you, and
    then you will be accountable to yourself, and your goals, and not to
    anything or anyone else. Just keep putting it to the test, each time
    you think you're done. Then train some more.

    Last edited by Meex; 1/12/2006 6:01pm at .

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