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  1. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phrost View Post
    So you're saying that a single line in the entire article, referring to a translation from Latin, which you don't agree with, undermines the entire piece?

    Hyperbolic much?

    It's one thing to fact check a translation, it's another to go all 8-Mile, mom's spaghetti as if I was trying to "Lose Myself" in some sort of intellectual rap battle.
    More like your quotation is hyper-bollocks.

    Your article on Occam's Razor ironically violated the same principle it's written about..you added multiplicative layers of bullshit that readers now have to dig beneath, work they probably won't do, and thus they'll remain ignorant, all thanks to your attempt at truthiness.

    You mistakenly misattributed a Latin phrase ("“Pluralitas non est ponenda sine neccesitate.”) to William of Ockam, when it was actually produced and recorded by theologian Johannes Poncius AKA John Punch of the Franciscan Order of Friars Minor.

    You see...Sir William did not originate this axioma vulgare, in fact he was just a famous proponent of it, and it predates him by centuries, and centuries after Sir William's death, John Punch uttered the Latin quotation you claimed William stated "in the original Latin" (as IF there was a non-original Latin version..).

    The words of John Punch belong to John "Phrost Don't Know Me" Punch. Give credit where it is due by properly sourcing quotations, it's that simple.

    Last edited by Pship Destroyer; 8/03/2017 10:05pm at .

  2. #12

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    Now for a quote that actually comes from Sir William:

    ""For nothing ought to be posited without a reason given, unless it is self-evident (literally, known through itself) or known by experience or proved by the authority of Sacred Scripture." - William of Ockham
    (Spade, 1999).

    Most people who peddle Ockham's Razor, especially atheists, don't realize he was a devoutly religious monk.
    Last edited by Pship Destroyer; 8/03/2017 10:13pm at .

  3. #13

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    And don't EVEN get me started on your bit about "Hitchen's Razor" (which rips off Carl Sagan)...

    ..or "Hanlon's Razor", a hipster 80's era version of quotation directly ripped from your favorite author (Robert Heinlein's 1941 novella, "Logic of Empire")..

    "You have attributed conditions to villainy that simply result from stupidity" - R.A. Heinlein.

    Philosophical razors are like Internet quotes: everybody's got one to share, and most of them are copied, borrowed, or just bullshit.

    Don't be that guy.

  4. #14
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    Link me to some sources for all that and I'll happily update the article accordingly.

  5. #15
    Michael Tzadok's Avatar
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    It's really simple. Simply say, hey Phrost, you accidentally misattributed John Punch's statement to Ockam. Here is Ockam's actual statement, that isn't that much different but would be more accurate if you used it:
    Entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessitatem.
    More things should not be used than are necessary.

    Source:
    https://www.britannica.com/topic/Occams-razor
    Now if we are going to argue with the Encyclopedia Brittannica, I'm going to just check out because we will have reached the realm of alt-facts.

  6. #16

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    Why are you quoting Sir William of Ockham in Latin, Michael?

    I'm sure you have a solid source suggesting William ever uttered or recorded such a phrase.

    No, not alt-facts. Poor citation, because they're only human. The online EB is shitty when it comes to sourcing things.

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Tzadok View Post
    It's really simple. Simply say, hey Phrost, you accidentally misattributed John Punch's statement to Ockam. Here is Ockam's actual statement, that isn't that much different but would be more accurate if you used it:
    Entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessitatem.
    More things should not be used than are necessary.


    Source:
    https://www.britannica.com/topic/Occams-razor
    Now if we are going to argue with the Encyclopedia Brittannica, I'm going to just check out because we will have reached the realm of alt-facts.
    Last edited by Pship Destroyer; 8/04/2017 2:51am at .

  7. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phrost View Post
    Link me to some sources for all that and I'll happily update the article accordingly.
    In addition to the sources I've already cited, such as Spade (1999)....

    Details matter. Punch wrote the Latin forms, not William of Ockham. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Punch_(theologian), but these are far older reductionist philosophies as ancient as the Greeks.

    Ockham's use of the device as a philosophical "razor" is not unique, but he's noted as a particularly skilled user of the device by his peers for centuries after his death.

    Sober, Elliott (2015). Ockam's Razor: A User's Manual. Cambridge University Press. p. 4. ISBN 1107692539.
    Last edited by Pship Destroyer; 8/04/2017 3:01am at .

  8. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by ermghoti View Post
    Isn't the easiest way to explain Occam to slow people to just relate it to the physician's hoofbeats analogy?
    Slow people "get" Ockham's razor better than fast people.

    Believe it.

  9. #19
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    So now we've gone from Eminem to Naruto.

  10. #20
    Michael Tzadok's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pship Destroyer View Post
    Why are you quoting Sir William of Ockham in Latin, Michael?

    I'm sure you have a solid source suggesting William ever uttered or recorded such a phrase.

    No, not alt-facts. Poor citation, because they're only human. The online EB is shitty when it comes to sourcing things.
    You actually want me to believe that a 14th Century Franciscan Monk didn't use and speak Latin? The middle ages RCC are pretty much the only people that spoke Latin. I mean after the Battle of Corinth, and the absorption of Greece into the Roman Empire, every self respecting Roman spoke Greek, and used Latin only for official discourse and records. The RCC kept Latin alive, and it's priests and monks all knew and were able to speak Latin. Heck, Jesuits still use it. Oh, and in case you didn't realize it, all of William of Ockham's books were written in Latin. So you getting your pants all in a twist over a Latin quotation, of a primary principle of William of Ockham's philosophy, especially a principle that William of Ockham quoted so often that, despite it having been around long before him, became known for him.

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