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  1. #161
    BKR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Tzadok View Post
    No. I can find lots of news articles saying that Washington is mutual combat. I just can't find anything in the criminal code itself.

    I have noted though that fighting and assault are separate charges. Not a lawyer so I don't know if that means anything or not.
    Disturbing peace, disorderly conduct, public nuisance, stuff like that might be a result of fighting...

    Disorderly Conduct

    RCW 9A.84.030
    Disorderly conduct.
    (1) A person is guilty of disorderly conduct if the person:
    (a) Uses abusive language and thereby intentionally creates a risk of assault;
    (b) Intentionally disrupts any lawful assembly or meeting of persons without lawful authority;
    (c) Intentionally obstructs vehicular or pedestrian traffic without lawful authority; or
    (d)(i) Intentionally engages in fighting or in tumultuous conduct or makes unreasonable noise, within five hundred feet of:
    (A) The location where a funeral or burial is being performed;
    (B) A funeral home during the viewing of a deceased person;
    (C) A funeral procession, if the person described in this subsection (1)(d) knows that the funeral procession is taking place; or
    (D) A building in which a funeral or memorial service is being conducted; and
    (ii) Knows that the activity adversely affects the funeral, burial, viewing, funeral procession, or memorial service.
    (2) Disorderly conduct is a misdemeanor.
    [ 2007 c 2 1; 1975 1st ex.s. c 260 9A.84.030.]
    NOTES:
    Effective date—2007 c 2: "This act is necessary for the immediate preservation of the public peace, health, or safety, or support of the state government and its existing public institutions, and takes effect immediately [February 2, 2007]." [ 2007 c 2 2.]

    LOL, maybe they had problems with fighting around funerals????

    lawful use of force...


    RCW 9A.16.020
    Use of force—When lawful.
    The use, attempt, or offer to use force upon or toward the person of another is not unlawful in the following cases:
    (1) Whenever necessarily used by a public officer in the performance of a legal duty, or a person assisting the officer and acting under the officer's direction;
    (2) Whenever necessarily used by a person arresting one who has committed a felony and delivering him or her to a public officer competent to receive him or her into custody;
    (3) Whenever used by a party about to be injured, or by another lawfully aiding him or her, in preventing or attempting to prevent an offense against his or her person, or a malicious trespass, or other malicious interference with real or personal property lawfully in his or her possession, in case the force is not more than is necessary;
    (4) Whenever reasonably used by a person to detain someone who enters or remains unlawfully in a building or on real property lawfully in the possession of such person, so long as such detention is reasonable in duration and manner to investigate the reason for the detained person's presence on the premises, and so long as the premises in question did not reasonably appear to be intended to be open to members of the public;
    (5) Whenever used by a carrier of passengers or the carrier's authorized agent or servant, or other person assisting them at their request in expelling from a carriage, railway car, vessel, or other vehicle, a passenger who refuses to obey a lawful and reasonable regulation prescribed for the conduct of passengers, if such vehicle has first been stopped and the force used is not more than is necessary to expel the offender with reasonable regard to the offender's personal safety;
    (6) Whenever used by any person to prevent a mentally ill, mentally incompetent, or mentally disabled person from committing an act dangerous to any person, or in enforcing necessary restraint for the protection or restoration to health of the person, during such period only as is necessary to obtain legal authority for the restraint or custody of the person.


    RCW 9A.36.080
    Malicious harassment—Definition and criminal penalty.
    (1) A person is guilty of malicious harassment if he or she maliciously and intentionally commits one of the following acts because of his or her perception of the victim's race, color, religion, ancestry, national origin, gender, sexual orientation, or mental, physical, or sensory handicap:
    (a) Causes physical injury to the victim or another person;
    (b) Causes physical damage to or destruction of the property of the victim or another person; or
    (c) Threatens a specific person or group of persons and places that person, or members of the specific group of persons, in reasonable fear of harm to person or property. The fear must be a fear that a reasonable person would have under all the circumstances. For purposes of this section, a "reasonable person" is a reasonable person who is a member of the victim's race, color, religion, ancestry, national origin, gender, or sexual orientation, or who has the same mental, physical, or sensory handicap as the victim. Words alone do not constitute malicious harassment unless the context or circumstances surrounding the words indicate the words are a threat. Threatening words do not constitute malicious harassment if it is apparent to the victim that the person does not have the ability to carry out the threat.
    (2) In any prosecution for malicious harassment, unless evidence exists which explains to the trier of fact's satisfaction that the person did not intend to threaten the victim or victims, the trier of fact may infer that the person intended to threaten a specific victim or group of victims because of the person's perception of the victim's or victims' race, color, religion, ancestry, national origin, gender, sexual orientation, or mental, physical, or sensory handicap if the person commits one of the following acts:
    (a) Burns a cross on property of a victim who is or whom the actor perceives to be of African American heritage; or
    (b) Defaces property of a victim who is or whom the actor perceives to be of Jewish heritage by defacing the property with a swastika.
    This subsection only applies to the creation of a reasonable inference for evidentiary purposes. This subsection does not restrict the state's ability to prosecute a person under subsection (1) of this section when the facts of a particular case do not fall within (a) or (b) of this subsection.
    (3) It is not a defense that the accused was mistaken that the victim was a member of a certain race, color, religion, ancestry, national origin, gender, or sexual orientation, or had a mental, physical, or sensory handicap.
    (4) Evidence of expressions or associations of the accused may not be introduced as substantive evidence at trial unless the evidence specifically relates to the crime charged. Nothing in this chapter shall affect the rules of evidence governing impeachment of a witness.
    (5) Every person who commits another crime during the commission of a crime under this section may be punished and prosecuted for the other crime separately.
    (6) For the purposes of this section:
    (a) "Sexual orientation" has the same meaning as in RCW 49.60.040.
    (b) "Threat" means to communicate, directly or indirectly, the intent to:
    (i) Cause bodily injury immediately or in the future to the person threatened or to any other person; or
    (ii) Cause physical damage immediately or in the future to the property of a person threatened or that of any other person.
    (7) Malicious harassment is a class C felony.
    (8) The penalties provided in this section for malicious harassment do not preclude the victims from seeking any other remedies otherwise available under law.
    (9) Nothing in this section confers or expands any civil rights or protections to any group or class identified under this section, beyond those rights or protections that exist under the federal or state Constitution or the civil laws of the state of Washington.
    Falling for Judo since 1980

    "You are wrong. Why? Because you move like a pregnant yak and talk like a spazzing 'I train UFC' noob." -DCS

    "The best part of getting you worked up is your backpack full of irony and lies." -It Is Fake

    "Banning BKR is like kicking a Quokka. It's foolishness of the first order." - Raycetpfl

  2. #162
    Michael Tzadok's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BKR View Post
    Disturbing peace, disorderly conduct, public nuisance, stuff like that might be a result of fighting...

    Disorderly Conduct

    RCW 9A.84.030
    Disorderly conduct.
    (1) A person is guilty of disorderly conduct if the person:
    (a) Uses abusive language and thereby intentionally creates a risk of assault;
    (b) Intentionally disrupts any lawful assembly or meeting of persons without lawful authority;
    (c) Intentionally obstructs vehicular or pedestrian traffic without lawful authority; or
    (d)(i) Intentionally engages in fighting or in tumultuous conduct or makes unreasonable noise, within five hundred feet of:
    (A) The location where a funeral or burial is being performed;
    (B) A funeral home during the viewing of a deceased person;
    (C) A funeral procession, if the person described in this subsection (1)(d) knows that the funeral procession is taking place; or
    (D) A building in which a funeral or memorial service is being conducted; and
    (ii) Knows that the activity adversely affects the funeral, burial, viewing, funeral procession, or memorial service.
    (2) Disorderly conduct is a misdemeanor.
    [ 2007 c 2 1; 1975 1st ex.s. c 260 9A.84.030.]
    NOTES:
    Effective date—2007 c 2: "This act is necessary for the immediate preservation of the public peace, health, or safety, or support of the state government and its existing public institutions, and takes effect immediately [February 2, 2007]." [ 2007 c 2 2.]

    LOL, maybe they had problems with fighting around funerals????

    lawful use of force...


    RCW 9A.16.020
    Use of force—When lawful.
    The use, attempt, or offer to use force upon or toward the person of another is not unlawful in the following cases:
    (1) Whenever necessarily used by a public officer in the performance of a legal duty, or a person assisting the officer and acting under the officer's direction;
    (2) Whenever necessarily used by a person arresting one who has committed a felony and delivering him or her to a public officer competent to receive him or her into custody;
    (3) Whenever used by a party about to be injured, or by another lawfully aiding him or her, in preventing or attempting to prevent an offense against his or her person, or a malicious trespass, or other malicious interference with real or personal property lawfully in his or her possession, in case the force is not more than is necessary;
    (4) Whenever reasonably used by a person to detain someone who enters or remains unlawfully in a building or on real property lawfully in the possession of such person, so long as such detention is reasonable in duration and manner to investigate the reason for the detained person's presence on the premises, and so long as the premises in question did not reasonably appear to be intended to be open to members of the public;
    (5) Whenever used by a carrier of passengers or the carrier's authorized agent or servant, or other person assisting them at their request in expelling from a carriage, railway car, vessel, or other vehicle, a passenger who refuses to obey a lawful and reasonable regulation prescribed for the conduct of passengers, if such vehicle has first been stopped and the force used is not more than is necessary to expel the offender with reasonable regard to the offender's personal safety;
    (6) Whenever used by any person to prevent a mentally ill, mentally incompetent, or mentally disabled person from committing an act dangerous to any person, or in enforcing necessary restraint for the protection or restoration to health of the person, during such period only as is necessary to obtain legal authority for the restraint or custody of the person.


    RCW 9A.36.080
    Malicious harassment—Definition and criminal penalty.
    (1) A person is guilty of malicious harassment if he or she maliciously and intentionally commits one of the following acts because of his or her perception of the victim's race, color, religion, ancestry, national origin, gender, sexual orientation, or mental, physical, or sensory handicap:
    (a) Causes physical injury to the victim or another person;
    (b) Causes physical damage to or destruction of the property of the victim or another person; or
    (c) Threatens a specific person or group of persons and places that person, or members of the specific group of persons, in reasonable fear of harm to person or property. The fear must be a fear that a reasonable person would have under all the circumstances. For purposes of this section, a "reasonable person" is a reasonable person who is a member of the victim's race, color, religion, ancestry, national origin, gender, or sexual orientation, or who has the same mental, physical, or sensory handicap as the victim. Words alone do not constitute malicious harassment unless the context or circumstances surrounding the words indicate the words are a threat. Threatening words do not constitute malicious harassment if it is apparent to the victim that the person does not have the ability to carry out the threat.
    (2) In any prosecution for malicious harassment, unless evidence exists which explains to the trier of fact's satisfaction that the person did not intend to threaten the victim or victims, the trier of fact may infer that the person intended to threaten a specific victim or group of victims because of the person's perception of the victim's or victims' race, color, religion, ancestry, national origin, gender, sexual orientation, or mental, physical, or sensory handicap if the person commits one of the following acts:
    (a) Burns a cross on property of a victim who is or whom the actor perceives to be of African American heritage; or
    (b) Defaces property of a victim who is or whom the actor perceives to be of Jewish heritage by defacing the property with a swastika.
    This subsection only applies to the creation of a reasonable inference for evidentiary purposes. This subsection does not restrict the state's ability to prosecute a person under subsection (1) of this section when the facts of a particular case do not fall within (a) or (b) of this subsection.
    (3) It is not a defense that the accused was mistaken that the victim was a member of a certain race, color, religion, ancestry, national origin, gender, or sexual orientation, or had a mental, physical, or sensory handicap.
    (4) Evidence of expressions or associations of the accused may not be introduced as substantive evidence at trial unless the evidence specifically relates to the crime charged. Nothing in this chapter shall affect the rules of evidence governing impeachment of a witness.
    (5) Every person who commits another crime during the commission of a crime under this section may be punished and prosecuted for the other crime separately.
    (6) For the purposes of this section:
    (a) "Sexual orientation" has the same meaning as in RCW 49.60.040.
    (b) "Threat" means to communicate, directly or indirectly, the intent to:
    (i) Cause bodily injury immediately or in the future to the person threatened or to any other person; or
    (ii) Cause physical damage immediately or in the future to the property of a person threatened or that of any other person.
    (7) Malicious harassment is a class C felony.
    (8) The penalties provided in this section for malicious harassment do not preclude the victims from seeking any other remedies otherwise available under law.
    (9) Nothing in this section confers or expands any civil rights or protections to any group or class identified under this section, beyond those rights or protections that exist under the federal or state Constitution or the civil laws of the state of Washington.
    My understanding is that Pheonix Jones carries a card with him, that a lawyer basically wrote out, detailing Washington and Seattle laws regarding mutual combat. My suggestion at this point, as just about every Bar Association in WA seems have pay walled their stuff, would be to contact Pheonix and ask him for the details. Maybe some of the posters here are still friendly with him and could do that. I don't know.
    Don't rely on theory if your life is at stake.

  3. #163
    BKR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Tzadok View Post
    My understanding is that Pheonix Jones carries a card with him, that a lawyer basically wrote out, detailing Washington and Seattle laws regarding mutual combat. My suggestion at this point, as just about every Bar Association in WA seems have pay walled their stuff, would be to contact Pheonix and ask him for the details. Maybe some of the posters here are still friendly with him and could do that. I don't know.
    Well, I find it funny that after searching the entire WA criminal code for "mutual combat" et al, I found nothing.

    I'm not planning on doing any mutual combat in Washington...
    Falling for Judo since 1980

    "You are wrong. Why? Because you move like a pregnant yak and talk like a spazzing 'I train UFC' noob." -DCS

    "The best part of getting you worked up is your backpack full of irony and lies." -It Is Fake

    "Banning BKR is like kicking a Quokka. It's foolishness of the first order." - Raycetpfl

  4. #164
    Michael Tzadok's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BKR View Post
    Well, I find it funny that after searching the entire WA criminal code for "mutual combat" et al, I found nothing.

    I'm not planning on doing any mutual combat in Washington...
    My mutual combat happens in a ring, on a mat, with a ref. No legal problems.
    Don't rely on theory if your life is at stake.

  5. #165
    Bneterasedmynam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Tzadok View Post
    Yeah. Technically you are supposed to wait for the cops to show up and have them ref the fight for you.

    Here is a video of a guy who used to post here in Bullshido doing exactly that when someone gave him racist grief in Seattle
    When the hell did he post on bullshido??

  6. #166
    Michael Tzadok's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bneterasedmynam View Post
    When the hell did he post on bullshido??
    Ask BFMonkey. He's the one that told me that.
    Don't rely on theory if your life is at stake.

  7. #167
    hungryjoe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Tzadok View Post
    Ask BFMonkey. He's the one that told me that.
    Can't remember when but there were a couple of posters doing this type of proactive civilian law whatever you call it. One was former US Army and maybe with the Guardian Angels. Maybe mike___

    It's been a long time. Ring any bells anyone? BFM?

    Where's IiF? He still has a solid memory.

  8. #168
    Nutcracker, sweet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hungryjoe View Post
    Can't remember when but there were a couple of posters doing this type of proactive civilian law whatever you call it. One was former US Army and maybe with the Guardian Angels. Maybe mike___

    It's been a long time. Ring any bells anyone? BFM?

    Where's IiF? He still has a solid memory.
    Not him, tho. Phoenix Jones is Ben Fodor. We've discussed him a bunch, but I don't think he's ever posted here. I think I remember a poster that claimed to know him, though, I'll see if I can dig that up.

  9. #169
    Michael Tzadok's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BackFistMonkey View Post
    Jones was a poster here for a good bit.
    His heart was always in the right place.
    Quote Originally Posted by submessenger View Post
    Not him, tho. Phoenix Jones is Ben Fodor. We've discussed him a bunch, but I don't think he's ever posted here. I think I remember a poster that claimed to know him, though, I'll see if I can dig that up.
    Above is BFMonkey's original quote on it. Just going by what he says.
    Don't rely on theory if your life is at stake.

  10. #170

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    Quote Originally Posted by BackFistMonkey View Post
    Anyone else feel sorry for the poor innocent Alt-Righter having his speech and safety violated?
    "Alt-Righters" typically try to conceal their love for Nazis with memes about frogs and KEK flags that resemble German flags, and when they trollnazi, they usually try to backpedal with claims about "lulz" and "don't take the Internet so seriously, guy"...

    Even Spencer has on many occasions claimed to not be that kind of guy, but the "Sieg Heils" and salutes at his speeches sort of give up the gag..

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