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"Jail Yard Rush" knife attack: defenses, anyone?

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  • hitfirst
    replied
    The problem is blade fixation, the guy is like a deer in the headlight. The best response is evasive footwork and mainly, clear his live hand, because it the live hand that has him immobile. Use a circular or palisut sweeping motion to clear the live hand and at the same time on the way down pick up the attacking hand. Or kick him in the balls this is a linear attack.

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  • hapkido_keith
    replied
    I guess you do have a point there, but I've always wanted to use that graphic

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  • Jim_Jude
    replied
    Originally posted by hapkido_keith
    ... please check the last posting date before you post...
    Why? If someone starts a thread asking about "Jail Yard Rush" defenses, they'll get chastised and told to "use the <SEARCH> function, n00b!!!" Perhaps someone has something they feel is pertinent or important to the discussion or topic. So, if they post on a thread that hasn't been active for awhile, they'll get stupid graphics like yours. If they start a new thread posting new info, they'll be chastise for that too, despite any salient point they may have.

    I love thread necro myself. Keep it up!!!

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  • hapkido_keith
    replied

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  • Mischa
    replied
    Well, your initial post gave the impression that you were advocating not only rushing in against an knife unarmed, but making no attempt to protect yourself while you do so. You can probably understand why that might've raised some eyebrows.

    The reason it's theoretically possible to do pure offense with a stick or gun is because of range. Knife is short, bullet go far. It's also possible to drop somebody with one hit from either if you're very good, so you can maybe prevent him from getting into range (you can see by all the "theoretically"s and "maybe"s that I wouldn't bet my life on a knifer not being able to close with either weapon). Lastly, I wouldn't really mind an improvised club getting sliced up for being in the effective range of a knife. I have different feelings about my arm. By the same token, if I have a club/gun and the knifer is close enough to reach me, defense suddenly becomes real important.

    Sure, hit the guy in really painful places so you can get past him, but unless you take steps to minimize the damage to yourself while doing it you're still probably dead. I suppose there's an argument to be made that you could take the guy with you by going apeshit, but the whole probably dead thing is a major problem for me.

    Basically, my problem with the "just go crazy on the guy" philosophy is the same as my problem with people who answer every SD question by saying "just run away." I mean, how are you going to execute your plan so that you have the best chance of staying alive? Ignoring the fact that you're being attacked and turning to run away is just as ridiculous as ignoring the fact that you're being attacked and going killer commando mode. Maybe you can get away with it in a friendly punchout (at which point going killer could mean life in prison), but with weapons no way.

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  • curby82
    replied
    well put Mischa . This is all I am really trying to get across to people. You really need to stop looking at the whole thing as you trying to deal with what he is doing to you and more along the lines of what your going to do to him. what you said above about him not caring is exactly what makes him so effective so to speak, he does'nt care or ask himself " maybe he knows how to defend himself or I may get hurt while trying to get in on him" He simply has a single minded goal which is simply to get in and stab you repeatedly till your non functional. But the thing maybe that everyone thinks that the situation has somehow changed because he has a knife in his hand and now your playing for keeps so everything you learnt about hurting people goes out the window when in truth and fact people get beaten to death all the time all over the world.

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  • Mischa
    replied
    Originally posted by leere_form
    wow, knives are dangerous.

    by the way, you do FMA.. shouldn't you know how to deal with knives and such?
    A lot of what FMAs teach is dueling: you both have knives, you're both trained, and you're both as concerned about getting killed as tearing up the other guy. The rush is an attack where the guy either doesn't think you have the ability to hurt him or (worse) doesn't care. That's part of what makes it such a bitch to deal with, unless you're a samurai and have a hard-on for double kills.

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  • poidog
    replied
    Originally posted by caseyboy
    ... Or am I feeding the troll?
    Feeding the troll. But so was I. After all, we can't have emaciated troll carcasses all over the forum. It would be bad for business.

    Aloha, Poi

    Leave a comment:


  • caseyboy
    replied
    Originally posted by curby82
    I was ithching to say how the rest of the vid turned out and why they can support their claims that they can teach anyone to handle this situation but after reading through litterally every single post and finding noone with the ability to think outside the box of how to handle a knife attack I choose not to, but thats ok because before I learnt the TFT principles I would have responded like everyone else.
    But I will leave you with a hint though.
    If you had a gun and the other guy had a stick would you shoot the stick out his hands? of course not your aim for his centre mass to shut him off right?
    What if you had a stick and he had a knife, would you hit the the knife out of his hands? well it could be argued that you can strike the hand but would'nt it be more beneficial to open up his skull instead?
    So if I can hurt a man with my bare hands why then must I try to deal with whats in his hands first before I put my forearm in his throat?



    Please don't think the lack of responses to your post indicates that you made a valid point. More likely everyone thought your post was too ridiculous to respond to. But I am curious, how exactly do you intend to stop someone from practicing acupuncture on you while you are attacking their throat? Do you have the d3ath t0u{h? Or am I feeding the troll?

    Leave a comment:


  • poidog
    replied
    Originally posted by curby82
    So if I can hurt a man with my bare hands why then must I try to deal with whats in his hands first before I put my forearm in his throat?
    Because the knife in his hands can open you from taint to sternum while you are putting your "forearm in his throat".

    You fail Knife Defense Rhetoric 101. You must repeat the class. Ask your TA for more help next time, don't be ashamed.

    Leave a comment:


  • curby82
    replied
    I was ithching to say how the rest of the vid turned out and why they can support their claims that they can teach anyone to handle this situation but after reading through litterally every single post and finding noone with the ability to think outside the box of how to handle a knife attack I choose not to, but thats ok because before I learnt the TFT principles I would have responded like everyone else.
    But I will leave you with a hint though.
    If you had a gun and the other guy had a stick would you shoot the stick out his hands? of course not your aim for his centre mass to shut him off right?
    What if you had a stick and he had a knife, would you hit the the knife out of his hands? well it could be argued that you can strike the hand but would'nt it be more beneficial to open up his skull instead?
    So if I can hurt a man with my bare hands why then must I try to deal with whats in his hands first before I put my forearm in his throat?

    Leave a comment:


  • Jim_Jude
    replied
    Originally posted by selfcritical
    It was essentially an "escaping the corner" drill with a time parameter before you could dash out.
    Okay, cool. I'm getting the visual. :icon_rabb

    Leave a comment:


  • selfcritical
    replied
    It was essentially an "escaping the corner" drill with a time parameter before you could dash out.

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  • Jim_Jude
    replied
    Originally posted by selfcritical
    To clarify, in the above challenge, as the point was to disengage as soon as the whistle was blown, I didn't clinch up at all at any point. I was exclusively using checking and guiding in the typical knife-tapping fashion.
    If that was the parameters of the drill, then cool. But as we know, few plans survive first contact...

    Leave a comment:


  • selfcritical
    replied
    To clarify, in the above challenge, as the point was to disengage as soon as the whistle was blown, I didn't clinch up at all at any point. I was exclusively using checking and guiding in the typical knife-tapping fashion.

    Leave a comment:

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