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Protecting Yourself During Sparring

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  • tao.jonez
    replied
    Now I can't wait to roll with a spaztic new guy, just so I can fuck him up under the guise of "protecting myself". -insert smirk here-

    I get it, honestly. I see how certain guys would require more physical disciplining than others.

    I think I saw it earlier in the thread, but I didn't see a verdict - what's the thinking on positional grappling for new guys? No subs, just work for control positions, guard passes, etc.

    I am trying to commit Saulo Riberio's Jiu Jitsu University to memory. In it he suggests essentially that lower belts' primary directive should be survival, then as they acheive some degree of proficiency they work on better position, then opponent control, and on up the ladder to strategy and submissions at the top levels. Does anyone actually practice this philosophy in their training?

    Monday I asked a black belt to roll with me - I told him all I wanted was to try and escape / avoid / survive. I'm smaller, but much more athletic than this guy. It was an enormously enlightening experience. He showed me about how to create space and use it, when I am / am not in danger of various attacks....you get the idea. It was a good workout, and we both went away sweating and tired but the learning on my side was absolutely grand.

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  • tao.jonez
    replied
    Understood, Steve. I came out of the "go hard" white belt thing fairly quickly - being among the top guys in kickboxing/JKD class to being the bottom guy in a combat submission class bruised my ego and I felt like I had something to prove at first.

    Plus literally being underneath a guy's full weight on my chest / face / stomach was ahhhhh miserable initially - ergo me spazzing in that all too familiar "get out from under and never ever be on the bottom no matter what" syndrome.

    Once I realized that you don't ACTUALLY die, and you even have options on the bottom, I was able to overcome that spaz response. But I do see your point about squashing a guy to protect yourself. I suppose I'm fortunate that my partners have never felt they had to so severely dominate in order to teach me mat etiquette (sp).

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  • Angry Mandrill
    replied
    ^^^ i'm with steve. as i wrote up above, i don't splatter people. it's not fun, not productive, and not educational. this guy was a dick. strong and using his strength all wrong. what would you have me do? should i have said 'ow, you're too rough, i won't train with you anymore'? no, you work to the buzzer, no matter your fate, right? well, i told him twice, and that's enough. an unconscious opponent can't hurt me. seems dickheaded, but it's not.

    tao, you're a recently enlightened spazzer. i'm a former spazzer. when you're spazzing, you don't even know it. neither do the current spazzers. they think that frantic activity means they're doing something that might be productive. i had one guy tell me he was working so hard because he wanted to 'impress the blue belt.' they don't realize that they're pissing off their sparring partners.

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  • steve_990
    replied
    I've done this for many years now. I always take the "go easy" approach, but tell them I will follow their level. Usually that means domination cause most of them don't get it until later.

    Most spazzers I've worked with eventually get it and slow down a bit - and then I match their speed.

    The important thing is that I dominate to protact ME... I've had too many times where I've said "let's go light" to have them go all out and hurt / injure me but being a spaz. I'd rather protect myself by being a dick than injure myself by being nice.

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  • tao.jonez
    replied
    As a recently enlightened white belt spazzer I have to say that patience from the higher ranking students has really helped me WAY more than being dominated by them. The ones who will say "let's focus on _____ today" really inspire me to work on that part of my game. I respect the fact that they've been in my position, have the experience to know what I need, and are willing to help me work on the holes in my game. er...my game is mostly holes, but nevermind that.

    But to be honest, it's not just us white belts who go all out. There are definitely some guys at all levels who just want to school new guys rather than teach/learn.

    ...there's no need to dominate a guy who doesn't understand how to relax. Just don't roll with him. Or tell him "dude, I'll roll, but you have to relax the aggression or this will be the last time I work with you".

    I mean why not take the opportunity to make the guy calmer and better instead of squashing him and making him (possibly) even MORE aggressive?

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  • steve_990
    replied
    Give these guys an inch and they take a mile. Just dominate him and explain non-stop how you will follow his aggression. If he rolls nice and cool - so will you. He'll eventually get the idea or get frustrated and quit.

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  • Angry Mandrill
    replied
    to be honest, i told the guy twice to relax and try to think his way out of trouble. i always let other people work when it's clear they're outmatched. but there was no way i was going to let this guy into a position to hurt me, and i sure wasn't gonna teach him anything. this is the first time i've ever just flogged someone. it was an enlightening moment.

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  • snowman
    replied
    You could just tell them to chill out? It's just rolling/sparring, not the mundials/title match?

    Leave a comment:


  • Angry Mandrill
    replied
    interesting thread. when i was a spazzy white belt, i wondered why i was so sore all the time. more precisely, i've wondered recently why i'm not sore anymore, even though i train 5-6 days a week. maybe i've gotten used to it, but realistically i was probably physically accustomed to the routine by 3 or 4 months, right? maybe. so yesterday i roll with a new white in our school. alas, he's a total spaz. like touching a live wire. in self defense, i totally maul him, trying to keep him from hurting me. 'sides that, he fucking pissed me off with his flying elbows and knees. it was that unpleasant. session ended when his ear ripped pretty good as he tried to slam his way out of a triangle. did he know why i beat him mercilessly? i doubt it. but now i really understand why others beat me mercilessly. and i used to think they were just bastards.

    memo to spazzy white belts: higher belts will let you work and teach you stuff if you ask questions and remain calm. if you spaz, they won't like you. if they don't like you, it will hurt. and then they won't train with you, which will hurt most of all.

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  • FictionPimp
    replied
    Originally posted by Alasaurus View Post
    Or, how about rolling with newer, bigger folks, going from knees who just
    charge and bowl you over. This sucks because sometimes I can't pull
    guard fast enought and my knees stay bent under me as they roll me on
    my back.

    My right knee is a bit tricky after popping a few months ago. This of course
    happens when I am allowing newer white belts try techniques, instead of
    me trying to dominate. Ouch...
    I had this problem when I first started. I adopted just sitting on my butt the moment the round started. So I'm on my knees, the coach starts the timer, and I plop on my butt with my legs in front of me.

    Sure it's easier for them to pass, but who cares I'd rather work on escapes and sweeps anyway.

    Leave a comment:


  • beardedtaco
    replied
    I am a whitebelt of almost 6 months training.

    I really like the advices given in this thread. I have many small injuries atm. Some I know were my fault, some just happened, some were other people's fault, and some I can't remember how it happened or when.

    I had my knee pop about 2 weeks ago ( second time it's happened since starting mma ). I used to have major issues with this knee before doing MA training. But now it seems to be showing itself again. Basically, I tried to buck someone who had mount, and my knee just popped. It felt totally messed up for a minute then it felt like it popped back by itself ( so I don't think it actually dislocated ). The next few days it was very sore just walking around the house and I wore my knee guard all day to give me some support.

    Lately it feels like it's healing, but it definitely still feels weak compared to my other knee.

    So, there is this guy in my class who started about a month ago. When I boxed with him, I didn't know he was new, I just said hey man how's it going and we sparred. He was very aggressive with his punching. Literally trying to take my head off, and if I hadn't been at this school for a few months he probably would have succeeded. Fortunately, he was easy to counter and easy to hit, so I basically gave him a bit of a pounding ( nothing too hectic, mind you ). This happens every time we pair up during a partner switch. He never chills out. I didn't say anything because I assume he will learn his lesson when everyone keeps dullering him in the head.

    Then a couple lessons ago this guy comes up to me while I'm rolling with my friend, and asks me about my eating plan ( he is overweight, and I was overweight but am steadily dissapearing ). I said that I just eat whatever I want, which while true, is not really the best advice I could have given him. He said he's new, told me his name, and was very nice and friendly. I felt like I shouldn't be so hard on him when we spar and maybe he's an alright guy.

    So, Tuesday's grappling class came, and we had to roll for 4 minutes X 2 ( 30 second break ) then switch partner, then another 4 x 2 with them. I went with 2 white belts who are much better than me. So I got very tired and gassed and squashed ( but let it be said that they were both very cool to roll with despite how they dominated me ). So I'm feeling pretty damn exhausted when I see that dude from sparring looking mega tired as well. So I said, "hey man, you look like I feel" with a smile and "do you wanna roll ?". He says cool and it's all seeming like it's gonna be a light one.

    This guy proceeds to go seriously spazzy and giving it every bit of strength he has. I swept him and got side control and went for an armbar. I almost got it but he managed to get out at the last minute. I ended up in his side control, so I think, yea let me just relax and let him gas. So I play possum. Man, this guy tried with all his might to put on a keylock on my arm, which I imagine if he'd known how to do it properly he would have pulled my arm out it's socket. Then he passes to mount, so I figure, lemme work some mount escapes. So as I reach out for his knee to do a shrimp, he tries what I think was meant to be an Ezekiel Choke, but he basically just tried to sandwich my neck between his two forearms and just tries to jerk his arms tighter onto my throat ( on the front of my throat I might add ). So I grabbed his arm to stop the pressure on my throat and just held it away till he stopped trying to murder me ( which was some time ). At this point my friend says that our lift is on the way, so I just said I'm done and left.

    Man, I didn't think it would mess with my head like it did. I know it's my ego getting the better of me, but all I could think of was how I wanna school this guy now. He could have hurt me, my knee almost popped again. How dare this guy ?? etc. This is how I felt until I woke up today.
    Now I'm feeling much less of a aggro asshole. It's not my right or place to regulate this dude ( nor do I have the experience or understanding ). So, I'm gonna be nice to him, spar nice, roll nice, because I don't want to be that dick that injures people.

    Anyways. Cool thread.

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  • pauli
    replied
    then you need better tape.

    Leave a comment:


  • steve_990
    replied
    Originally posted by pauli
    tape your feet (or toes or whatever). there's a 3m nexcare brown stretchy self adhesive tape that works perfectly for securing (and preventing) blisters and such.
    Yeah - I've tried taping before but I find that during randori the tape comes off - closely followed by the skin. It helps a bit, but it's definately not fool proof.... :(

    Leave a comment:


  • pauli
    replied
    tape your feet (or toes or whatever). there's a 3m nexcare brown stretchy self adhesive tape that works perfectly for securing (and preventing) blisters and such.

    Leave a comment:


  • steve_990
    replied
    I've been experiencing an annoying repeat injury myself. Not sure if anyone else here experiences this or not, but almost every class - or at least once a week I tear the skin off the bottom of my big toes (happens to either foot now and then).

    It's not linked to a specific move or set of moves, but it usually occurs when I'm pivoting my feet on the mat for some reason.

    Anyone have any ideas how to stop this?

    Thanks.

    Leave a comment:

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