Educate me on the octopus guard

[PoleFighter]

Could someone educate me a little about it? Is it a gimmick, or is it a legit position or what? Is it strictly a no-gi position? I could barely find anything about it on the web.

[G8]

Could someone educate me a little about it? Is it a gimmick, or is it a legit position or what? Is it strictly a no-gi position? I could barely find anything about it on the web.

couple of clips here:

http://www.groundfighter.com/details/prodid/204.html

it's legit, yes. you'll probably get more expert opinion if you ask here:

http://www.jiujitsugear.com/forum/in...board,2.0.html

[UpaLumpa]

Based on the two clips, wtf? Normal no-gi stuff.
Guess you can market anything if you give it a lame name.

The kimura showed is hard to pull off because you'll usually get slammed down as soon as you take weight off the posted arm.

[MONGO]

I use the octopus guard (didn't know there was a name for it) when rollng shooto with guys. Mainly cause it keeps them from getting leg attacks cause I have their upperbody tightly controlled and it is close to taking the back for the dreaded RNC.

Note- I get footlocked cause I play loose guard all the time

[chaosexmachina]

It's great to have names for all theses things, it makes them easier to remember.

[Ke?poFist]

It's great to have names for all theses things, it makes them easier to remember.

Two words... American Kenpo

[Ke?poFist]

watched the first vid of him demonstrating the position. I have to call bull. I've done that position numerous times inadvertantly, and as long as the other guy is bigger or slightly stronger than me, they just posture up or sink back and I'm left with nothing. I wanna see this used successfully live.

[Aesopian]

My instructor saw Eduardo Telles use this position live while fighting in the black belt division at the 2006 Pan American Tournament.

[GoldenJonas]

couple of clips here:

http://www.groundfighter.com/details/prodid/204.html

Damn!!! Those Telles DVD's look pretty damn good. Does anyone have them that can comment on them?

I also find myself in the "octopus" position a lot. Particularly when a hip heist gets countered (sans the arm drag part). Never really considered it a "position" to attack from before. But if you are actually able to get the arm drag cleanly against a resisting opponent the guillotine/arm triangle looks to be there for the taking.

[Jeice]

watched the first vid of him demonstrating the position. I have to call bull. I've done that position numerous times inadvertantly, and as long as the other guy is bigger or slightly stronger than me, they just posture up or sink back and I'm left with nothing. I wanna see this used successfully live.

If I'm not mistaken BJ Penn used "octopus guard" to take Matt Hughes back in round 2 of their fight in UFC 63... Live enough? Moreover, Recent enough?

[Ke?poFist]

If I'm not mistaken BJ Penn used "octopus guard" to take Matt Hughes back in round 2 of their fight in UFC 63... Live enough? Moreover, Recent enough?

I'd have to watch the fight again, but I'll take your word for it.

I suppose it's the individual then. I've gone for a guard sweep, and then when they posture down I've gotten into this position, and instead of me holding them down or getting their back, they sink back and break my hold. By leaving my arm across their back like that, one guy actually passed into half guard and got an arm triangle on me. I guess I just suck.

[UpaLumpa]

I have to call bull. I've done that position numerous times inadvertantly, and as long as the other guy is bigger or slightly stronger than me, they just posture up or sink back and I'm left with nothing. I wanna see this used successfully live.

The position is commonly used. It happens somewhat often no-gi. It is somewhat hard to judge based on those two clips whether there is anything novel there, but there are indeed several positional improvements, sweeps and submissions you can do from there.

[UpaLumpa]

And I still think the shoulder lock is somewhat ridiculous. I can see it happening (hell, I've been getting kimura'd right and left lately, from all freaking angles) but the problem is more commonly and even with abs of steel when you take your weight off the posting arm your weight falls back some, letting them drive you down by the neck (which would create the possibility of armbars and omaplatas).

Oh great reviewer of bjj media, has that shoulder lock been done successfully in competition?

[GoldenJonas]

And I still think the shoulder lock is somewhat ridiculous. I can see it happening (hell, I've been getting kimura'd right and left lately, from all freaking angles) but the problem is more commonly and even with abs of steel when you take your weight off the posting arm your weight falls back some, letting them drive you down by the neck (which would create the possibility of armbars and omaplatas).

Oh great reviewer of bjj media, has that shoulder lock been done successfully in competition?

Yeah, I just reviewed that single handed kimura again and I agree. I can't see it being a secure submission either. The ab's of steel comment is perfect too.

I can see it being an annoyance to help clear the arm so you can move to the back but otherwise....meh.

[UpaLumpa]

Given what some people have pulled off in comps, I'm curious what Aesopian can dig up.