Grappling with a bum knee (MCL)

[Res Judicata]

I have a grade 2 MCL sprain. Yeah, me -- from throwing, not being thrown, ironically. I'm in for about 6 weeks of physical therapy. My Judo coach says that I should learn to love ne waza, because that (and uchi komi later on) is all I'm doing for at least the next three months. Coach --in all seriousness -- is going to tie my legs together for the next month or so for ne waza.

Any suggestions on how to maximize training--safely--for the crippled? I figure that this is a good time to work on my flexibility. Anyone go through this sort of thing?

(I considered putting this in the physical training forum, but this is not so much a "how do squat" as it is "cripple crappling")

[BKR]

I went through a torn ACL when I was 19 or 20. I never let it heal, and in 1987 I was having ACL recon. So first off, let it heal up, then go back slow. Keep in shape safely while you rehab. If there is any sort of Judo you can do with a torn MCL without aggravating it, OK, but make sure you clear it with your doc first.

And let it heal up, unless you want to see how good your health insurance is.

Ben

[Res Judicata]

Thanks Ben. I'm going to take it as easy as I can without going stir crazy. I've seen too many people with cascading injuries -- one after another, after another.

[BKR]

I'd use the opportunity to get into mad shape upper body/core wise in any way that would not endanger the knee or hinder it's rehab. I didn't really do that back in the day, as I was in grad school.

Ben

[tao.jonez]

I had a partial tear of my MCL a while back - strength training, yoga (carefully chosen poses and stretches) and boxing with a knee brace on was what I did. It was about 7-8 weeks before I got back on the mat, and even then I wore the brace for another 3 1/2 months.

So nearly 6 months of recovery for me. It should have been quicker, but in the midst of my recovery I rolled without the brace and attended a TD. My eagerness/foolishness agitated it enough to set me back a few weeks. Do yourself a favor and let the thing heal properly (not like me).

I can't remember the brand of brace, but it was heavy neoprene, velcro closures with metal hinges that could lock out at varying degrees. I still own it and can get info to you, or I'll ship it to you if you're in the US. Was a couple hundred bucks, but well worth it despite my other choices.

[Res Judicata]

Thanks. Please post the Knee Brace info. I'm not quite to that point yet -- down to one crutch, like Tiny Tim. And your story is a good one to keep me from doing anything stupid. Sadly, the knee I injured was my plant (right) leg and I fight lefty.

[tao.jonez]

It was made by Donjoy - below is a link to the manufacturer's page. The ones I see online are $175 ish. Maybe your insurance covers it...

http://www.donjoy.com/index.asp/fuse...il/cat/1/id/24

Playmaker Wraparound/Wraparound IROM Playmaker Ideal Application The wraparound design makes this brace ideal for those patients who have trouble applying a sleeve-style brace. It provides dependable support for mild to moderate ACL and/or PCL, MCL and LCL instabilities. The IROM Playmaker is ideal for post-op care following meniscal repairs as well as ACL/PCL reconstruction. Features and Benefits

[Res Judicata]

So, it is possible to do ne waza with a bad knee--so long as your legs are tied together. It translated into defending from the fetal position/turtle while a BJJ purple, a high BJJ blue, and an enormously strong Judo brown belt tried to maul me. Good times. The knee was fine afterwards.

[tao.jonez]

Glad you didn't get hurt. How did you tie your legs together? like below the knees or ankles and knees or what?

[Res Judicata]

Glad you didn't get hurt. How did you tie your legs together? like below the knees or ankles and knees or what?

Ankles and thighs, although the thigh one kept coming off. Lots of shrimping practice and moving from the hips.

[Coach Josh]

Recover first them just drill till you get full use back. ROM exercises and some strength work, uchi mokis in newaza and tachi waza will help with recovery as long as you are taking it easy and just doing what you can and not over exerting yourself.

I have had 3 knee surgeries and most of my recovery and continued mobility is directly related to being on the mat. Of course the injuries are also directly related to being on the mat but that is because I am not that smart. As my friend once told me "your body can not keep up with your ability." He said its like your body is rated for 70mph but you keep going 100mph so eventually something has got to give.

[BKR]

Ankles and thighs, although the thigh one kept coming off. Lots of shrimping practice and moving from the hips.

Very interesting. I had a coach who used to make me do ne waza randori with lower ranked guys with my legs only, or only one arm, or most fun, no arms or legs. Plus pinning without grabbing uke with the hands.

Ben

[Res Judicata]

Coach trained in Japan for a few years. He said that when he hurt his knee, that's what they had him do.

[jnp]

This is a bit of a derail, but I'll allow it.

Sometimes I only use my legs to defend guard with new people, or hold two tennis balls in my hands while I roll. The absence of grips while still sparring with the gi is as interesting as blind randori.

[tao.jonez]

May I suggest a new thread devoted to alternative grappling drills like this?

Specifically, I've never heard of the tennis ball thing - I really must try it. Would love more details.