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  • Grizzly216
    replied
    Originally posted by Pojac View Post
    <snip>
    you know that the consensus is that wing chun tends to be terrible; if you've been reading your own thread, you know that the majority here thinks you're wastinng your time and money.
    <snip>
    @ [color=#cccccc]chthonian[/COLO"]No BS MMA and Martial Arts - View Profile: [email protected]@[email protected]@View Profile: chthonian</title>@@[email protected]@chthonian:
    I cannot judge anything about the school where you train as I am at the other side of the ocean. My below reply is therefore more general and not specific at your initial message.

    @Pojac:
    Some Wing Chun schools may indeed be what the majority thinks. And I think Wing Chun practitioners might benefit from crosstraining in groundwork and good grappling.

    chainpunching:
    Contrary to what I see on filmclips, Wing Chun is not "exclusively chainpunching". The way my teacher taught was to use these chainpunches if my first punch landed, then creating 'stimulus overload' for the opponent and go on to other tactics/techniques.
    (and I am not 'King Wing Chun' ;-) )

    But I do understand the tendency of how people think about Wing Chun, many times there is a split up between teacher and student, student-not there yet- starts Wing Chun school and well....(fill in all scepticism etc.), and there may be lots of other reasons.

    BertB
    (Grizzly216)
    Last edited by Grizzly216; 9/04/2009 6:51pm, .

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  • chthonian
    replied
    Originally posted by Pojac View Post
    One thing I'm curious about: why are you posting here? I ask that without insult, but because I'm genuinely curious. If you've been reading this forum in general, you know that the consensus is that wing chun tends to be terrible; if you've been reading your own thread, you know that the majority here thinks you're wastinng your time and money. You're polite, and write like an intelligent adult, and so people here will treat you politely and wish you nothing but good...but behind our computers we're face palming that you're asking for input and then ignoring it completely.

    So I'm curious: why here? You could post about your beginning experiences at a wide variety of websites, and they'd be enthusiastic and possibly have tons of wing chun advice to give you. Here people will just follow along for a little while in the hopes that you actually get your head around what we're telling you: if you're doing this to learn how to fight, you are wasting your time and money. Tell us where you live, and we'll be happy to find you a much better school! That's what you're going to get from posting here about this: is that what you're going for? Something else?
    Who says I'm ignoring their input? I may not reply to some posts but I still read and consider them. Many posts here have already proven to contain valuable information. I post at this site because it's the only site of the sort I know of. Besides if I did go to a Wing Chun forum it's likely that it'd be completely biased towards Wing Chun. I am trying to look at both sides of the coin.

    While I know that Wing Chun has a bad rep here and many other places, I have heard both sides and doubt it is as bad as the other side says. Most forms of kung fu share the same low opinion and it is true that modern kung fu is like a sea of piss, but there are still spots of clear water and through research I bleieve I have found one of those. I am aware of all the other martial arts locally available and I chose a Wing Chun school for many reasons. Foremost I am not interested in simply learned how to fight, though that is a large bit of it. I am also interested in the art aspect.

    The school I go too isn't filled with scrawny WC elitests, most of the students are quite buff but fortunately also retain a level headed attitude. The drills that are performed aren't just bland dead patterns, while I haven't gone to the aliveness class yet the drills contain random patterns, i.e. varients in angle of attacks, how hard the hits are, speed of attack, ect.

    The only concern I have is that I haven't learnt anything about fighting against someone who isn't using WC, though I have only taken a few classes and that may be resolved of its' own accord. Or as I have said previously I have many friends whom train other MA's typically being the "critically acclaimed" MMA, and thus I can train with them as well.

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  • Pojac
    replied
    One thing I'm curious about: why are you posting here? I ask that without insult, but because I'm genuinely curious. If you've been reading this forum in general, you know that the consensus is that wing chun tends to be terrible; if you've been reading your own thread, you know that the majority here thinks you're wastinng your time and money. You're polite, and write like an intelligent adult, and so people here will treat you politely and wish you nothing but good...but behind our computers we're face palming that you're asking for input and then ignoring it completely.

    So I'm curious: why here? You could post about your beginning experiences at a wide variety of websites, and they'd be enthusiastic and possibly have tons of wing chun advice to give you. Here people will just follow along for a little while in the hopes that you actually get your head around what we're telling you: if you're doing this to learn how to fight, you are wasting your time and money. Tell us where you live, and we'll be happy to find you a much better school! That's what you're going to get from posting here about this: is that what you're going for? Something else?

    Leave a comment:


  • chthonian
    replied
    Just an update, had my second class today, went very, very well. I learnt the next part of the first form, and worked on the applications and sensitivity. Very good environment, every time I began a new application the person I was working it with (more senior students) kept asking if I had done it before, though I am sure they are just being nice, it brought a smile to my face.

    Leave a comment:


  • Gabetuno
    replied
    Nice. I'm curious to hear more about the sparring. Good luck to you, and don't forget to punch people in the god damn head.

    Leave a comment:


  • chthonian
    replied
    Originally posted by Gabetuno View Post
    What were the drills like? What was the proportion of explanation to drill? Not trying to start an inquisition, just curious about your new schooling experience relative to a few I've had, including in BJJ.
    I'm not sure what to call drills. But when I was partnered with someone it was like a chain punch/blocking drill(?) It was just working off some of the beginning of the form I had learnt. There were a lot of applications explained but we only worked on one. I am also aware that constant working of dead patterns won't really help in a real right because there's a resisting opponent, that's why I'm looking forward to an aliveness class and further testing it out on my friends!

    Leave a comment:


  • Gabetuno
    replied
    What were the drills like? What was the proportion of explanation to drill? Not trying to start an inquisition, just curious about your new schooling experience relative to a few I've had, including in BJJ.

    Leave a comment:


  • chthonian
    replied
    Originally posted by Gabetuno View Post
    Beware of "hand conditioning". Aside from deadening the nerves in your hand, it's my understanding that all you are doing is making minor bone breaks which may or may not heal back stronger. I once met a girl who thought she was conditioning her hands by punching steel. This is pretty much the worst idea I've heard come out of a "TMA" school.

    Also, can you talk about why you liked the class so much? What kind of 1-1 attention you got, and from whom, and whom you got paired up with? Thanks, welcome to Bullshido.
    As for the hand conditioning, i was advised to do it very lightly at first (we use rice bags or something like them) and my sifu was doing it pretty hard, and of course monkey see monkey do, i started off by doing it hard and almost messed up my hands. The conditioning more so seems to just make good callouses on the knuckles and get the fists used to constant punching. I've only ever been in a few fights as a kid so my hand aren't really used to it.

    I really enjoyed the class because I noticed a lot of power in the stances, and everything my teacher and the more senior stundents told me really made sense. Towards the begining of class I was instruced by a senior student while the teacher was talking to/setting the other students off to do their things for the day. After that was done me and another semi-new guy got more indepth explenations and guidance from the sifu. There was a lot of attention and teaching through the whole class be it from another passing student of the sifu. Any time I got paired up with someone it'd be a senior student.

    Leave a comment:


  • Gabetuno
    replied
    Beware of "hand conditioning". Aside from deadening the nerves in your hand, it's my understanding that all you are doing is making minor bone breaks which may or may not heal back stronger. I once met a girl who thought she was conditioning her hands by punching steel. This is pretty much the worst idea I've heard come out of a "TMA" school.

    Also, can you talk about why you liked the class so much? What kind of 1-1 attention you got, and from whom, and whom you got paired up with? Thanks, welcome to Bullshido.

    Leave a comment:


  • chthonian
    replied
    I had my fist class last night, I thought it went very, very well. The atmosphere is great, everyone there is very nice and is always helping each other learn. All I did was; learning the beginning of the first form, learnt basic the chain punch, began hand conditioning, and began the most basic sensitivity training. While it may not be the most exciting stuff it's the very basics and they're important. I will likely be going back on Thursday, and then the first class I'd have been taking with "aliveness" won't be happening because the teacher will be out of town. But the doors will be open during the normal class time and some other students will be there so I'll probably drop by and see what they're doing.

    Leave a comment:


  • danno
    replied
    Originally posted by It is Fake View Post
    Nebietown.
    yeah, forgot where i was.

    Leave a comment:


  • galois
    replied
    Originally posted by chthonian View Post
    Most of my friends take martial arts, usually MMA(MT, BJJ, Karate, ect.) and I am planning on regular sparring with them. Also, if I get the oppertunity to film any sparring during class or with my friends I will and I'll post it.
    Sounds good, I look forward to the vids. Good luck with the training.

    Leave a comment:


  • bombom
    replied
    Originally posted by chthonian View Post
    Hey guys, thanks for all the input, I have my first class tomorrow, and I'll let you guys know how it went. The first class is free, and then there's a 3 month commitment, then a 6 month after. I'll keep you guys posted on how well the training is going and whether or not it is actually worthwhile. Most of my friends take martial arts, usually MMA(MT, BJJ, Karate, ect.) and I am planning on regular sparring with them. Also, if I get the oppertunity to film any sparring during class or with my friends I will and I'll post it.
    Chun gets a bad rap around here, usually for good reason. Sounds like you are on the right track though, good that you have some friends to work out with.

    Good luck with your training, and welcome to Bullshido.

    Leave a comment:


  • chthonian
    replied
    Hey guys, thanks for all the input, I have my first class tomorrow, and I'll let you guys know how it went. The first class is free, and then there's a 3 month commitment, then a 6 month after. I'll keep you guys posted on how well the training is going and whether or not it is actually worthwhile. Most of my friends take martial arts, usually MMA(MT, BJJ, Karate, ect.) and I am planning on regular sparring with them. Also, if I get the oppertunity to film any sparring during class or with my friends I will and I'll post it.

    Leave a comment:


  • Southpaw
    replied
    Originally posted by wingchunx2z View Post
    I Want you to knwo that there are a few posters here who practice and enjoy wing chun kung fu and support your descision to train. We are generally considered village idiots but regardless we are here.
    Hey...that hurts. ;)

    I'd actually say that those of us Chunners who are still here are here because we agree w/ Bullshido's purpose...and hope someday to be able to point to some wing chun that is proven to be effective. I also think that a few of us might actually be respected by the other members of the boards because we acknolwedge this issues and limitations within wing chun and don't just blindly believe what our Sifu tells us.

    That being said... wingchunx2z is right about aliveness. Too many wing chun schools exist today simply to make money. This means that they soften the training as to not drive away students that might not want to get hurt. Furthermore, they end up teaching techniques and habits that run contrary to what you would actually need to do in a fight...and they can do this b/c they never test out what actually works in a fight.

    Well...the tough thing is fighting is an ugly business, and people get hurt. If you don't get hurt, beat up, banged up, bruised, etc. when you are training, you are going to shit yourself when you are actually called upon to use your skills and you get punched in the face.

    So...here is my advice.

    1. Ask a lot of questions. During class, during techniques, etc. Ask hypothetical questions (i.e. what if he does this?), ask tough questions, and then ask how your teacher knows the answer to those questions. Too many people act like questioning your teacher is a bad thing. That's why we've got so many shity teachers around. Just because someone claims to have knowledge of something doesn't mean they know how to apply that knowledge.

    2. Punch your friends, and get punched. TEST every technique you learn out in a full contact scenario. If you haven't or can't test it out and proved to yourself that it works (i.e. poking the eyes, etc.), don't fucking rely on it!

    3. Ask your teacher about his/her fighting experience. I don't care what anyone else tells you...if you haven't been in any real fights, it is really hard to teach someone what to do in a real fight.

    4. Train w/ other arts. Too many times wing chun people only practice against other wing chun people...and they start to think that everyone throws their punches from their chest w/ a vertical fist. Most people don't. Learn how to fight people who don't do wing chun. Seriously, don't worry about other wing chun people, most of them can't fight. ;)

    Leave a comment:

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