WT in MMA

[Fantasy Warrior]

So, valid questions here would not be notions of what it should have looked like. Good questions would be along the lines as follows:

1. Did he really only train the same regimen as anyone else in the system?

This is the crux of the problem. With "styles" comes a whole lot of baggage, including more often than not training culture. So I bet the answer is "no", I'd be astonished if the averager chunner could suddenly jump into a boxing ring and do anything aside from embarass themselves, sorry if that sounds prejudice but truthfully, how many Chunners train remotely like someone entering a boxing match in terms of intensity, contact and fitness? Few if any.

[Torakaka]

I think it's pretty funny that Dr TT had to say "this is why WT guys will never enter MMA comps, because you guys won't credit the style!"

I sure don't know any MMA/MT fighters that go into their matches thinking about proving anything but their own abilities. Feeling the need to prove your style's worth to everyone else is hilariously stupid unless you created it.

[Virus]

I havn't watched the videos yet because I'm at work but from reading the responses I'm glad to see that I'm still right, Aliveness is king and Thornton is God.

I think Tom Kagan had an excellent point, so he has some skill in boxing either this means that;

All strking ends up looking like boxing under aliveness, and t3h _ing is just another path to getting there.

He boxed as well and ended up using that.

He did "wing chun" but this training had little semblance to a wing chun club and in fact more resembled a boxing gym. (which kind of makes it the same as the above point)

I think that many _ingers would like to believe in the first point; given that we are not seeing anything of _ing style fighting in MMA. However if this is true then that kind of means that sports science is errornous and specificity is not actually true. Broadly speaking, this is akin to saying that golf will make you good at cricket, and water polo will make you good at basketball.

[RunningDog]

I think it's pretty funny that Dr TT had to say "this is why WT guys will never enter MMA comps, because you guys won't credit the style!"

I sure don't know any MMA/MT fighters that go into their matches thinking about proving anything but their own abilities. Feeling the need to prove your style's worth to everyone else is hilariously stupid unless you created it.

DTT has a desire to prove to the internets that he hasn't been wasting his time training WT. He is wasting his time in this endeavour.

[DevonHartigan]

This kind of remind of a discussion I'm currently having in the youtube commentary-section to this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jLB75cypHt0#mX68l1h4dmo

Screenshot of discussion here: http://www.bullshido.net/gallery/sho...0/ppuser/26426


Edit: The level of intelligence in the youtube commentary-section is of course somewhat lower, since your comments has a length limit. Therefore it usually end up in namecalling when trying to prove a point.

[Gezere]

If it all ends of looking like boxing then why not just do boxing!?!?! Call me crazy.....

[Lu Tze]

LuTzu, you generally are much more logical, but judgeing the loser to be inexperienced only because a Tsunner is beating him (well all 3 on this clip, 7 in his total record) seems using a pre-concieved belief to rationalize what you are seeing. We do not know anything about the experience of the partys in question. The clip shows only the final winning hits, not the whole fight, so we do not know what led up to it. We do know that the winner was WT.

I'm judging him inexperienced because he just backs into the ropes when faced with the onslaught. You are right though, there isn't enough video there to really tell either way.

The fact that it's rather brief is part of the problem. The only half decent continious footage there is (between about 1:25 and 1:35) is quite recognizably boxing, he's in an orthodox boxing stance, with a boxing guard, using boxing footwork and throwing boxing punches.



If it looks like a horse and all that... That stuff doesn't just resemble boxing, it's textbook, and it looks nothing like any of the pure _un I've seen in the countless other videos out there, it doesn't even look anything like the other sparring on the same video!

I'd say the guy has trained in boxing in addition to _ing _un, and not just adapted his _ing _un for the ring. Which is fine, I see absolutely nothing wrong with that.

[Torakaka]

I didn't really think WT taught people to fight from a boxer's T with your elbows covering your body, but what do I know...

[theword]

it doesn't even look anything like the other sparring on the same video!

Litterally, exactly what I was thinking. The sparring in the later half looks very much like their compliant drills which makes the whole thing suspect (IMHO).

[polishillusion]

I still do not see how Wing Tsun has anything to do with that match. I could turn around and say that every leg movement that guy does is a practical application of TKD footwork, and it would be the same argument. In the end, it looks like boxing is boxing is boxing.

[JohnnyCache]

So that guy is a wing tsun fighter? Exclusively? Who just happens to not use wing chun in the ring, but do a precise imitation of orthodox boxing in the ring?

Also, if he IS a wing chun fighter, exclusively, then how does the clip show wing chun can improve other arts (as that would mean he haddn't trained any other arts)?

If, on the other hand, he HAS trained in other things - then given the enormous amount of wing chun sucking we've seen, isn't it more likely that those other arts improved his wing chun?

[Goju - Joe]

The boxing part of this video is the least interresting, he was fighting a boxing match with boxing gloves and boxing rules and it looked like boxing. Doesn't mean anything either way.

The more interresting bit was the full contact WC.

Which looked ok to me.

No I still don;t love chain punching, but what I saw was the chain punching leading into a clicnh, elbows and take down.

My feeling is that a good ma shoud teach the full range of fighting, from striking, closing the distance, clicnginh and taking down.

So to me this demonstarted that WC can be effective fot this.

Doesn't mean it's the best way to approach this but there,s no reason why someone using WC as a base and gross training in boxing, greco (because of the upper boady throws) and BJJ can't have something usefull

of course it won't look like WC anymore

Much in the same way GSP doesn;t look just like a Kyukushin fighter.

So yes I think this shows that WC can be practiced as a non BS martial art.

But it doesn;t change the fact that theres so much crappy versions of it.

[Tom Kagan]

If it all ends of looking like boxing then why not just do boxing!?!?! Call me crazy.....

Did you miss the conversation on this very point in the style forums when Virus was trolling in the same way? :smile:

[JohnnyCache]

This isn't the style forums.

[Virus]

DTT has a desire to prove to the internets...

Don't you mean the _ingternets?