A dilema

[Liffguard]

I recently started going back to my university Judo club. On the whole, it's a good club with decent drills, lots of randori etc. The ne-waza leaves a bit to be desired though. Anyway, we were doing ne-waza drills and the instructor demonstrates (to the class) an americana from inside the guard and in doing so reaches right across the body in a "please armbar the fuck out of me" sort of way.

My dilema is this. Should I have spoken up about this and pointed out the flaw? Bear in mind that the instructor isn't some massively experienced nth dan grand-master but another student like myself. Furthermore, it's more or less acknoweldged that I've got more groundfighting experience than anyone else at the class. On the other hand, it's not my class and I'm not a well-established regular. In the end I said nothing in front of the class and just drilled the move as shown but had a quiet word with my partner about the dangers of getting caught in an armbar. I'm interested as to how other people would have handled this.

Flame away.

[Virus]

Just get t3h armb4rz when he tries it on you during randori.

[Neildo]

"Can you show that to me please?"

"Why sure, you just put your arm across like this.....HEY"

"TAP OR SNAP, YOUR CHOICE!"

[Teh El Macho]

I recently started going back to my university Judo club. On the whole, it's a good club with decent drills, lots of randori etc. The ne-waza leaves a bit to be desired though. Anyway, we were doing ne-waza drills and the instructor demonstrates (to the class) an americana from inside the guard and in doing so reaches right across the body in a "please armbar the fuck out of me" sort of way.

My dilema is this. Should I have spoken up about this and pointed out the flaw? Bear in mind that the instructor isn't some massively experienced nth dan grand-master but another student like myself. Furthermore, it's more or less acknoweldged that I've got more groundfighting experience than anyone else at the class. On the other hand, it's not my class and I'm not a well-established regular. In the end I said nothing in front of the class and just drilled the move as shown but had a quiet word with my partner about the dangers of getting caught in an armbar. I'm interested as to how other people would have handled this.

Flame away.

Dude, there is no much of a dilemma. Next time ask (preferably before or after class), talk to him about that same technique and discuss with him about the flaw. If it is well established that you have more ground experience than anybody else, I'm sure people will hear what you have to say (provided you are polite).

And since it's his class/group, not yours, by discussing this in private/semi-private manner for a few minutes, you give the chance to correct the error without appearing to be a dude trying to establish some dominance game shit.

If you do in this manner, who knows. Maybe you get invited to help others in their ground game.

[HearWa]

If your University club is anything like mine you'd speak up if you saw a problem. We do that with ours all the time and if we don't agree on something we often roll to see if the technique actually works. I don't see how pointing out a flaw is disrespectful if you're right, just think of it as helping everyone else out.

[Liffguard]

All good points. Like I said though, this was my first time back in a while. I just didn't want to come across as too cocky or know-it-all right off the bat. A few more weeks to get re-established and it wouldn't have been an issue.

[Uechidude]

Dude, there is no much of a dilemma. Next time ask (preferably before or after class), talk to him about that same technique and discuss with him about the flaw. If it is well established that you have more ground experience than anybody else, I'm sure people will hear what you have to say (provided you are polite).

And since it's his class/group, not yours, by discussing this in private/semi-private manner for a few minutes, you give the chance to correct the error without appearing to be a dude trying to establish some dominance game shit.

If you do in this manner, who knows. Maybe you get invited to help others in their ground game.

Took the words right out of my mouth. I may not do judo, but I do teach class's. Share the flaw, if he is worth his salt, he will listen, and make the changes needed.

[Doctor X]

El Macho beat me to it . . . curses!!!

Be polite and talk to him after/before class.

Good teachers in my experience WANT this feedback. One now Venerable Senior-Senior-Senior-Senior tells a story about how he became "t3h d34dly" way back in the late sixties--he was . . . a NI-DAN!!! [!--Ed.]. Anyways none of his students could defeat him, and I think he cured a few sick children with his tears.

So he eagerly enters a tournament. As he put it:

A Japanese guy who did not know who I was, nor, frankly, cared, promptly buried a kick in my stomach, sending me out of the ring unable to catch my breath!

I realized my students were not testing me at all.

basically, he lapsed into the false sense of security of compliant training--when you do not know it is compliant.

A good teacher is a good student who is still learning and trying to refine his technique. One who does not respond to good criticism is not a good teacher.

--J.D.

[Ke?poFist]

If your University club is anything like mine you'd speak up if you saw a problem. We do that with ours all the time and if we don't agree on something we often roll to see if the technique actually works. I don't see how pointing out a flaw is disrespectful if you're right, just think of it as helping everyone else out.

Well there's a fine line. I have a guy who tries to be the class no-it-all, although unlike Liffguard, doesn't know what the hell he's talking about. Basically his argument against every move is "what if he's not wearing a gi" which sets off the same repeated gi vs no-gi lecture every class.

It's one thing asking a genuine question, and quite another to ask loaded questions meant to embarrass the instructor. The problem here is that Liffguard had a genuine question, but he feared it would appear to be an attack (because he is...well, calling BS on the move) rather than a concern.

[Iscariot]

Either what everyone else has always said or phrase a question in a way that doesn't make him look stupid - "Do I want to move this way to avoid a potential armbar counter, or is this way better?"

[RunningDog]

Judokas aren't as aware of the guard game as they should be, I too find it's far easier to armbar/triangle etc from guard in Judo class than in BJJ. The more Judo people learn from people who cross train in sub grappling or BJJ, like you (Liffguard), the better off they, and Judo, will be. So you should definitely share.
Alternatively just crank on the armbar repeatedly, but unless you explain why it was so damned easy, you won't be helping your training partners much (but I know you know that already).

[Liffguard]

Thanks all. That's a lot of helpful feedback.