Remember those Girls Video doing BJJ?!

[goosetherumfoodle]

Damn. The first time that I have an eye-witness account of someone discussed on here and it ends up going nowhere.

[JohnnyCache]

No, guys actually over-react to sexualizing of the sport in a different way.


Also, it's not toughill, Kyra, the mma girls, etc doing this complaining - they didn't pose and then "turn around and complain about it." I personally think it softens the image of the people that do it as fighters, tennis players, whatever, but I don't see them bitching about the pictures they allowed to be taken getting noticed.

Probably because they're realists.

My "point" about men's health, flex, whatever, is that there are dozens of magazines where good-looking men are shown all greased down in their sports and gym gear on half of the pages, not to mention the ads, etc - but you don't see sex in those pictures, someone else might. These people actually AREN'T automatically tramps because they look good doing what they do or got photographed in their gear - dozens of male pro athletes are photographed in their gear for interviews, adds, and photoshoots every DAY, often in provacative poses or poses that celebrate their physiques, but they're not cheapening anything - sexually or in terms of commercializing and selling out the sports? An episdoe of TUF is 30 minutes of guys running around with no shirts engaging in SUPER HETERO HORSEPLAY and 10 minutes of fighting . . . there's no cheesball marketing of sex there?

I'm talking more about the one layout of kyra gracie here in a sort of cheesecake set of photos in her gi, here, of course, not straw-man example like Mia St. John in playboy wearing boxing gloves.

My question about the MMA girls is how hard and how long they paid dues before deciding they could put "lessons" on the internet. I honestly think they're MUCH more interesting in selling things then in MMA, but again, that could just be a facet of where the sport is for women right now and the age they're hitting it at.

[Lv1Sierpinski]

I think everyone has to make peace with the fact that men and women are different and all cultures, throughout the history of the planet, have treated each gender and the way they interact with various phenomena differently. Is it unfortunate that some women are uncomfortable rolling with guys? Of course it is...but it's also unfortunate that some guys are uncomfortable rolling with other guys.

It's a fact that men are aroused by attractive women. And photo spreads are designed to make the person or the product look good, i.e. attractive. I'm glad that this forum provides a free, and therefore, blunt domain for exchanging ideas. And if the occasional comment is taken as childish or immature or inappropriate by someone...oh well. Because I'd wager that there are people out there that find people like us, interested in fighting, childish and immature and our acts of violence inappropriate.

Personally, I'd say they're wrong.

[GoldenJonas]

Also, it's not toughill, Kyra, the mma girls, etc doing this complaining - they didn't pose and then "turn around and complain about it." I personally think it softens the image of the people that do it as fighters, tennis players, whatever, but I don't see them bitching about the pictures they allowed to be taken getting noticed.

Probably because they're realists.

Exactly right.

My question about the MMA girls is how hard and how long they paid dues before deciding they could put "lessons" on the internet. I honestly think they're MUCH more interesting in selling things then in MMA, but again, that could just be a facet of where the sport is for women right now and the age they're hitting it at.

They are just starting to "pay their dues" on the mat. By there own words back on page 4 or 5 they are fans of the sport and never intended the vids to be anything but a marketing tool to get there clothing line off of the ground.

I don't know where you train and what y'all do, but most of the females I roll with have no trouble trying to kick my ass. I've never had to deal with any sexual tension in class. After class? Sure, all types of foolishness, but when its time to roll, I kick their asses like everyone else or I get choked out. That surprises some of the girls when they get a legit beating, but it solves the problem of sex.

Couldn't have said it better. We have one girl that rolls in our school. She works her ass off and I never pull punches or adjust my game any differently for her than I would for any other brand new guy, i.e., if I feel that I am much better than my opponent I may let up to allow him or HER to work. If I don't roll and defend she will submit me and has submitted me.

There are obvious physical attributes, breasts, that I consciously try not to post on when transitioning or holding. This is simple courtesy and I am less careful when she is wearing a chest protector (a girl at my last school would wear one). Similarly, no body, male or female, should/will intentionally knee ride over your balls to get a guard pass; if they know you are wearing a cup however, they may be less careful.

On the mat your training to fight, there is no sexual tension. If there is, then you need to grow up and get off of the mat. Off of the mat after class its business as usual.

[DaChinkOfSteel]

I hadn't even realized it until I asked about an autographed picture of the MMA girls that they were two new students at my BJJ academy...I didn't immediately recognize them b/c I haven't been to a beginner Jiu Jitsu class in a while; so I don't know the "new crop" of people...and yeah...they're noobs...been in class for a very short while and aren't particularly skilled...

Joanne's the girlfriend of one of my buddy's...I guess I'm just obvlivious to this kinda stuff...

[Cassius]

I don't know where you train and what y'all do, but most of the females I roll with have no trouble trying to kick my ass. I've never had to deal with any sexual tension in class. After class? Sure, all types of foolishness, but when its time to roll, I kick their asses like everyone else or I get choked out. That surprises some of the girls when they get a legit beating, but it solves the problem of sex.

HOLY CRAP YOUR READING COMPREHENSION IS HORRIBLE.

[Hanniballistic]

A woman posing provocatively in her gi/MMA gear is more to do with dispelling the pre-conception amongst the general populace that women who fight have to look like a bulldog licking piss of a nettle

[OnceLost]

I'm not sure what Hannibal just said but...

I don't fucking care about your approval.

I said we lived for yours, genius, and it should have registered fairly high on the sarcas-o-meter.

If people were talking trashy guy-talk about girls who had never gone out of their way to use their sex appeal to promote something (themselves, their sport, a clothing line, or anything else), I would agree that there is a problem. The few people bitching about what was posted are like rabid feminists chiding men for popping wood while they're looking at playboy without ever commenting on the fact that the women involved know exactly what they're doing.

[Shuma-Gorath]

Boyd's stance is asinine. Somehow I manage to grapple without my gi provocatively hanging open just in time for a professional photographer to snap a shot. High level female grapplers bring this on themselves by doubling as models. Gazzy, Toughill, Gracie? Is there not one of them thats not spraying innuendo, provocative modelling and/or softcore all over the net?

The problem is that retards who won't watch women fight but will post about how they're OMG JERKING OFF RIGHT NOW make that the most effective form of marketing for those women to get noticed. Once the sport takes off and diminishes the need for pandering, however, I think it will be too lucrative a tactic to stop using.

[Hanniballistic]

I can't stand women's pro 'rasslin because it is basically poorly disguised soft-porn for bubba's.

I don't like to watch women's pro boxing for the reason that on the whole the technical standard is fucking awful.

I like to watch good fights regardless of who is featured in a contest and will not turn up to an event just because you have slapped a pair of tits on it.

But when all is said and done, what is wrong with being sexy?

[OnceLost]

Nothing, you thexy hunk of man-meat, you...

[MaverickZ]

The problem is that retards who won't watch women fight but will post about how they're OMG JERKING OFF RIGHT NOW make that the most effective form of marketing for those women to get noticed. Once the sport takes off and diminishes the need for pandering, however, I think it will be too lucrative a tactic to stop using.

Are you that dense to not realize that sex has been used to sell EVERY GODDAMN THING EVER for longer than you've been alive?

[Hanniballistic]

*blushes*...owww stoppit you tease!

[jnp]

Should women use their sex appeal to better their position? If you have a tool that gets the job done, but does so in an ethically questionable manner, do you still use it? That's a decision each woman must decide on her own, but most will agree, she'd be crazy not to utilize all the tools in her toolbox in this oh so soft and tender world.

Personally I see nothing wrong with a woman using her physical attributes to futher her own agenda. Men use their size, strength and charisma to further their own professional and social standing constantly. Why should women be any different?

Does the world need more twenty, thirty, forty etc. year old males acting like teenaged idiots overcome by their own hormones? No, it doesn't.

Is that going to change tens of thousands of years of biological programming etched in the oldest part of the brain that screams, 'spread your seed!' day in and day out? I'll let you figure that one out for yourself.

[OnceLost]

Does the world need more twenty, thirty, forty etc. year old males acting like teenaged idiots overcome by their own hormones? No, it doesn't.

But then sales figures from marketing sex appeal would fall, which means fewer people would use it in their marketing, which leads to a decreased amount of material to use when you want to, you know, run a batch off...

Seriously, excellent post, jnp. But you've neglected to mention that a lot of men, regardless of age, enjoy talking like they're living in a hormone stupor. It's fun. Like fart jokes. Some people are offended, but most people with a decent sense of humor will admit that they can be pretty damn hilarious in the correct context. The context, in this case, is to not make comments when a women isn't trying to provoke them.

Comments during class = asskicking. Comments about a video clip that obviously basing it's marketing effect on sex appeal = appropriate.