Wing Tsun is an absolute Joke

[Tonuzaba]

OI! No Bruce bashing on my watch!!!!!!!

Unless you are Rickson of course............

No, I'm not Rickson.
And I'm not bashing Bruce.
Unlike many loudmouths here I respect him for all the hard and dedicated training and thinking within martial arts.
I just like to make fun of people who think that in their hands something that B.L. developed for himself (based on wing chun) is a priori better than wing chun...

[Goju - Joe]

First off, congrats on your win. Great that you compete and tried out your WC.



Just want to point out that the dynamics of light contact and full contact fights are very different. Some tactics and techniques that work in light contact will not work well, or even worse, be detrimental if you tried it in a full contact fight.

Some of the differences I've noticed:
- in light contact fights, fighters tend to have a bad habit of not pulling their punches or kicks back fast. They like to "leave it there" to show that they've scored a hit. Doing that in a full contact fight is a big no-no.

- light contact doesn't allow you to do some things like push kicks or leg kicks hard enough to get the job done. In a full contact fight, you're supposed to push kick the guy hard if he charges in. Or you'll throw very hard leg kicks if he likes to charge in with punches. These strategies will not work if it's light contact, for obvious reasons.

- in a light contact fight, fighters tend to backpedal a lot in response to a punch or kick. They also play "tag" in which one fighter tries to tag the other, and vice versa. This is very different from a full contact fight. In a full contact fight, I prefer to stand my ground when attacked, and give back. At most, I will move to avoid a kick, then immediately move forward to return kick, or counter attack with a punch combo. The dynamics are very different.

Yours might not have been like what I've described, but I thought you might like to know.

Sport Ju jitsu is a funny animal. It's really not so much about knock out striking as it is about using strikes to set up throws and submission. Think of it as Judo with punching.

Also the lower belts are light contact, as you move up it gets harder.

On A side note in an advance class on Wednessday I did 15 minutes of SJJ sparring and learned that pulling guard when the guy's alowed to punch you in the head on the ground is not the best idea :)

Anyways, I have always felt that the striking I see in WC is actually good for distraction, closing the distance and getting underhools and a throw in.

So if you were to do WC and cross train in ju jitsu, SJJ is actually the ideal way to learn to do, kick, punch, throw submit and not necesarily ideal (at least until you get a higher level at it) for developing knock out power and technique.

[Hanniballistic]

Jeet Kun DO?
That's the stuff made up by that guy who didn't get to learn the whole wing chun system?
Lead hand striking?
N00b much?

OI! No Bruce bashing on my watch!!!!!!!

Unless you are Rickson of course............

[PPlate]

First off, congrats on your win. Great that you compete and tried out your WC.

Firstly I only got hit twice that I remember and I prity much hit my opponent at will. I launched a chain punch at the first available oppertunity but got called up on a excessive force penalty (thats 3 pts for hitting to hard as it was only light conatact allowed).

Just want to point out that the dynamics of light contact and full contact fights are very different. Some tactics and techniques that work in light contact will not work well, or even worse, be detrimental if you tried it in a full contact fight.

Some of the differences I've noticed:
- in light contact fights, fighters tend to have a bad habit of not pulling their punches or kicks back fast. They like to "leave it there" to show that they've scored a hit. Doing that in a full contact fight is a big no-no.

- light contact doesn't allow you to do some things like push kicks or leg kicks hard enough to get the job done. In a full contact fight, you're supposed to push kick the guy hard if he charges in. Or you'll throw very hard leg kicks if he likes to charge in with punches. These strategies will not work if it's light contact, for obvious reasons.

- in a light contact fight, fighters tend to backpedal a lot in response to a punch or kick. They also play "tag" in which one fighter tries to tag the other, and vice versa. This is very different from a full contact fight. In a full contact fight, I prefer to stand my ground when attacked, and give back. At most, I will move to avoid a kick, then immediately move forward to return kick, or counter attack with a punch combo. The dynamics are very different.

Yours might not have been like what I've described, but I thought you might like to know.

[Tonuzaba]

Firstly I only got hit twice that I remember and I prity much hit my opponent at will. I launched a chain punch at the first available oppertunity but got called up on a excessive force penalty (thats 3 pts for hitting to hard as it was only light conatact allowed). I dominated the stood up fighting and coped quite well with the grappling and ground fighting. I lost the fight due to getting tapped out with a rear naked choke hold after getting caught with a low blow that the ref didn't spot but every one else did. So lesson one is wear a box. ...In summary my WC stuff worked alot better than I thought and the front stop kick is such a good tool. Fromt he fight i've learn't that I need to work even harder on my Randori and buy a box for my next match. If you guys have any questions then feel free to ask and I'll try and answer as best I can.

Any video of the match?
A link to the organisation/rules, etc...? Why only light contact and what exactly does that cover?
How come you didn't wear a cup/groin guard (that's what you mean by "box" I guess) in a match? Isn't it mandatory? Didn't they tell you to wear one?

[K-Ron]

Footwork and structure are the Keys to WC. I do extensive footwork and excercises so I can move faster and keep my balance. I stress this to my students as well.

So I had my first competitive Sports Jitsu match last nite and It was an amazing experiance. I fought a 2nd Kyu and I'm a 5th Kyu and he beat me by and average of two points. Here's the break down.

I decided before that my tactic would be to use my WC skills while striking and revert to Ju Jitsu when in a Clinch and on the ground. I used the standar WC hourglass stance for all the striking parts and a semi sprawl for the grappling.

Firstly I only got hit twice that I remember and I prity much hit my opponent at will. I launched a chain punch at the first available oppertunity but got called up on a excessive force penalty (thats 3 pts for hitting to hard as it was only light conatact allowed). I dominated the stood up fighting and coped quite well with the grappling and ground fighting. I lost the fight due to getting tapped out with a rear naked choke hold after getting caught with a low blow that the ref didn't spot but every one else did. So lesson one is wear a box. My opponent gained 10 pts for the tap out so to come back to within 1 and 3 pts on the counters is prity good going. I should of one though I know I could of done better and I should of delt with the rear naked choke despite my bollocks stinging. To make things worse If i had of won my fight my team would of drawn which just makes the defeat even more bitter. I'll do better next time.

In summary my WC stuff worked alot better than I thought and the front stop kick is such a good tool. Fromt he fight i've learn't that I need to work even harder on my Randori and buy a box for my next match. If you guys have any questions then feel free to ask and I'll try and answer as best I can.

[Asriel]

must...........be........polite............musn't. ..............laugh................

Does _ing _un no longer have any footwork in it?

[Tonuzaba]

Well, so that your training is not a total waste, I would suggest Jeet Kun DO. The trapping techniques and lead nand striking is there from Wing Chun.

Jeet Kun DO?
That's the stuff made up by that guy who didn't get to learn the whole wing chun system?
Lead hand striking?
N00b much?

[knuckle dragger]

Also we had a guy in our class that only went once to a training in 2 months & was still allowed to grade & move up to the next level. (as long as they get the money they don't care).

When this happened I decided not to take part in gradings anymore.


As this is my only Martial Arts experienc & it is a very bad one.

I wouldn't know what else to start with after my contract finishes.

Well, so that your training is not a total waste, I would suggest Jeet Kun DO. The trapping techniques and lead nand striking is there from Wing Chun.

[RunningDog]

must...........be........polite............musn't. ..............laugh................

I cried a little.

[PPlate]

At the risk of your ridicule, I uploaded this for ya'll. Its got some things I don't like, but it covers the 3 classic Punches in _ing _ung.

Remember, there are also a bunch more open hand hits, elbows, and even shoulder strikes.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aXk8Xn24xA0

must...........be........polite............musn't. ..............laugh................

[M1K3]

Hey, M1K3,
glad to hear the good news!!!

Thanx for the pdf-tip, I already have the book in my SE p910i cellphone so I can read it anywhere I go... ;-)

From looking at the Dr's vid, which was very good I might add, I would think you WT guys would like what dempsey has to say. The uppercut and the vertical fist are 2 punches he recommends. Dempsey prefers a shovel hook to the straight hook as it keeps the elbows in for protection and is more of a 'pure' punch. Dempsey does throw the lead vertical punch with bad intentions though.

[MacWombat]

At the risk of your ridicule, I uploaded this for ya'll. Its got some things I don't like, but it covers the 3 classic Punches in _ing _ung.

Remember, there are also a bunch more open hand hits, elbows, and even shoulder strikes.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aXk8Xn24xA0

I thought that was you? What don't you like about your own video?

[Tonuzaba]

Hey, M1K3,
glad to hear the good news!!!

Thanx for the pdf-tip, I already have the book in my SE p910i cellphone so I can read it anywhere I go... ;-)

[M1K3]

Congrats!!!

awesome news

Thanks, I just got home from work and I am going to go down the basement and beat the hell out of the heavy bag.

Check out the book, it has some cool stuff from an old school boxer. Especially why he considers the jab to be a wussy punch. The chapter on shovel hooks and uppercuts is really good.