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Admission of guilt

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    Admission of guilt

    Hello, I have been studying a form of Wing Chun for over 2 years, and I have finally come to the conclusion that it has been a large waste of time. thankyou to everyone who tried to reason with me, even though it took so long for me to listen.

    I wanted to write down that I was very biased, prideful and narrow minded when I was studying it, but tonight I decided to end my training and take up BJJ.

    I was wrong about martial arts, wrong about wing chun and wrong about grappling.

    I can't believe some of the stupid things I allowed myself to think and place my trust and safety in.

    I dont want to say which school I have left, but I wanted to say hello to this online community. Thanks for putting this website up, which gives insight and perspective about a sensitive issue - no BS :)

    I am ready to start from scratch.

    I consider myself to have zero experience in martial arts.

    Im looking for a good club in Sydney, or some fellow martial artists that just want to get together and train.

    Hi. Anyone know of any good clubs in the CBD?

    Awesome. We all have our dark pasts. Just be thankful you didn't do TKD and WC like I did.


      A number of the fighters here train in Aust. Not sure if it is near or in Sydney though. JohnnyS is a BJJ BB but not sure where his school is. Might be in Melbourne. But he would probably know the good schools.


        Welcome to the light!


          BJJ w1nz again!!11!!


          P.S. Welcome to the forums. . . .

          P.P.S. Two drink minimum. . . .


            Machado affiliates are listed at

            Boxing Works is in the City.

            I Go Ryu (yes, ha ha, very funny Igor) Jiu Jitsu is in Manly, I think, but the website wasn't working properly for me.

            Gracie schools (and some Machado) are listed here.

            Good luck.


              Please reconsider if not on the name, at least share more tales of Wing Chun with us.


                Thanks gravious, I will visit boxingworks next week.

                JohnnyCache I'm not really sure what you want to hear about. I thought most people had heard enough about wing chun on these forums. But here we go.

                I think the biggest problem with the style is that there aren't any schools which emphasize teaching through sparring. I do think wing chun has a few techniques that would be useful to know (basic movements for clinch type situations) but won't elaborate on this. The system is just so dated. I read and appreciate what Matt Thornton said about when you train a 'dead' system 'alive', he said eventually it just looks like MMA anyway. I think there are still a few techniques out there that haven't emerged into MMA yet, so I don't think its fully evolved, and maybe other styles still have something left to offer. However apart from perhaps some traps, the majority of the wing chun system, IMO, is garbage. Evolution, theres a word. Apparently, Wing Chun is supposed to mean 'eternal springtime' because its 'always growing'. There is no discussion about where the style is going, no understanding of trends in the wider world of martial arts (the emerged dominace of ground fighting) etc.

                Apparantly sparring is unrealistic and doesn't prepare you for fighting but chi sau and forms will.

                The wing chun stance/s is stupid

                The guard is too outstretched

                The techniques where I was training require your partner to basically stand there and do nothing. Alternatively your partner attacks once with a single technique(without a follow up or the real aggression involved in a self defence encounter).

                Apparently even beginners can knock out their opponent with the first hit (or the following 'elite' chain punching).

                Most of the instructors teaching me had not been in a fight (ever) or not in the past ten years, hadn't visited another martial art school in a very long time (at least a year for most) and did not participate in any form of competition (friendly or unfriendly).

                The defences taught against take downs were inadequate (downwards knife hand strike, elbow or knee).

                The groundfighting techniques taught had horrible flaws in them (lots of reaching up when lying on your back on the ground, which presents an easy target for an arm or shoulder lock technique). I went and asked the opinion of someone who taught grappling - this wasn't just my own opinion.

                Wing chun forms.... Hmmm. 1st. frond on stance. Bad. 2nd Side on stance, weight on rear leg - okay if you were fencing in medival times, but bad for hand to hand fighting. 3rd form - the only one that makes sense, elbow movements, rotation and flexion of the torso, this form basically looks something like boxing mixed with some mu thai.

                Where I trained there was this almost religious demand that you stay upright like a column when you are doing any technique, which is just such a small minded detail to pick on, particularly if you are physically struggling with another person. Why should you even stay upright if the last (and best?) level of wing chun moves like a boxer anyway?

                I never saw anyone fail a grading, even the students I knew should have failed - everyone who pays gets let through.

                Plus the guy running the school gives off a dodgy vibe. He asked some of us to look up Wing Chun on the google engine and click on the sponsored links of other schools, so they would dissappear! How dodgy is that!

                Another in a long line of sick schools, and a very sick system. Where is the great Wing Chun from legend? I couldn't tell you.


                  I train in Choy Lee Fut is that a garbage system well it's a sadly neglected system on this site


                    Arhetton, what you wrote to me sounds more like a flawed application rather than a flawed MA system. I think WC as something, but like everything else it needs complimenting.


                      Originally posted by abclaret
                      Arhetton, what you wrote to me sounds more like a flawed application rather than a flawed MA system. I think WC as something, but like everything else it needs complimenting.

                      A system, no matter how good in theory, is ultimately flawed if allows so many practitioners to neglect the practice in application.

                      Why? Simple:

                      The difference between theory and practice is a lot larger in practice than it is in theory.
                      Calm down, it's only ones and zeros.
                      "Your calm and professional manner of response is really draining all the fun out of this. Can you reply more like Dr. Fagbot or something? Call me some names, mention some sand in my vagina or something of the sort. You can't expect me to come up with reasonable arguments man!" -- MaverickZ

                      "Tom Kagan spins in his grave and the fucking guy isn't even dead yet." -- Snake Plissken

                      My Bullshido fan club threads:
                      Tom Kagan's a big hairy...
                      Tom Kagan can lick my BALLS
                      Tom Kagan teaches _ing __un and bigotry?
                      Tom Kagan: Serious discussion here
                      Lamokio asks the burning question is Tom Kagan a pussy or just cruising for some
                      I'm Dave the gay Kickboxer from Manchester and I have the hots for Tom Kagan
                      ATTN TOM KAGAN
                      World Dominator 'Kagan' in plot to lie about real Kung Fu and Martial Arts
                      Tom Kagan just gave me my third negative rep in a day
                      I am infatuated with Tom Kagan
                      Tom Kagan is a fat balding white guy.


                        Arhetton, sorry I missed your big first post!

                        How is training life going now? Are you still at the school? What are you looking into? Boxing? BJJ?

                        I can recommend Paulo Guimareas BJJ, and his various branches. Let me know if you want a link.

                        Boxingworks I think offers Shooto classes. Shooto is basically MMA with a very active amateur league--you could get fighting for real, fast.


                          Arhetton, now the healing may begin. Helio bless you, my child.


                            Shooto sounds good! Yeah if you could post the link that would be great!

                            I'm just wrapping things up at the moment at my old school, I'll be out very soon.

                            I started a weights program on the side to prepare myself a bit for my next in martial arts, I've done about four weeks, been working on squats, upright rows, chinups and benching as my main exercises.

                            I have an old back injury so i've had to take it slow and careful but 5 weeks in and I feel great. I've even put on a couple of kilos already :)!


                              Originally posted by Arhetton
                              Shooto sounds good! Yeah if you could post the link that would be great!
                              Shooto is at Boxing Works in the city.



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