Is BJJ "Arrogance" ruining BJJ?

[W. Rabbit]

But at the end of the day, being the baddest motherfucker on the block and putting the most dudes to sleep on the mat is the best measuring stick for respect in BJJ. And guys who use their BJJ to win actual fights deserve the most respect of all. Demian Maia has accomplished more in jiu jitsu and deserves more respect than Buchecha. That’s the way I see it.

He makes the argument that nobody stays the baddest MF forever, and that newcomers should take note of the veterans of the art who did not spend waste their time openly denigrating other alive arts. Even dead ones were invited to compete with the BJJ legends.

The eldest redbelts aren't remotely where they were at half their ages. The arrogance he's talking about in the article is not respecting just belts, imo, but keeping respect in the sport and eliminating the "BJJihad Effect" we both know exists and makes some BJJ people talk like total morons, especially if it's the only art they've ever trained.

[Dr. Gonzo]

Yeah but even without "belts" their is still a "need" for some sort of ranking for a couple of reasons both of which highlight how silly belts are.
Segregation of competitors into the right brackets
Certificating people for instruction
The really funny part is those are completely different things being handled by one system right now.

It would seem to me that we have competition segmentation by weight, age, sex type, and ruleset.

Ruleset segregation can be as varied as Judo, Greco, Freestyle, IBJJF style rules, Sub only, Combat Jiu-Jitsu, Sport Sambo, Combat Sambo, and MMA.

Or can be Sub grappling beginner (no slams, heel hooks, or twisting face / neck locks), and Expert (no holds or throws barred).

Instruction certification by ruleset seems simple enough and should be separate from athletic performance in competition, although competition excellence history is usually a plus.

I hate when people get all movie magic / ninja master about "black belts" etc.

I also find it annoying when purple belts, or even new black belts, get puffy in the chesty about their expertise.

Humans are really socially ridiculous about hierarchies, and how they are perceived in social hierarchies, and hero worship.

[Devil]

I think the truth lies somewhere in between.

I'm basing this on USA Wrestling, and NFL football. Both sports have taken the stance that single sport specialization too early leads to premature peaking and is ultimately detrimental to the long term success of the athlete.

Now yes, they will have to start young enough... but at the same time I'm not sure that the newer trend of highly specialized child athletes is the future either.

[Devil]

He makes the argument that nobody stays the baddest MF forever, and that newcomers should take note of the veterans of the art who did not spend waste their time openly denigrating other alive arts. Even dead ones were invited to compete with the BJJ legends.

The eldest redbelts aren't remotely where they were at half their ages. The arrogance he's talking about in the article is not respecting just belts, imo, but keeping respect in the sport and eliminating the "BJJihad Effect" we both know exists and makes some BJJ people talk like total morons, especially if it's the only art they've ever trained.

[Dr. Gonzo]

All of grappling is about making the other person so annoyed, uncomfortable, in pain, distressed, and disgusted that they want to quit, or have no choice but to quit.

So, the rule of thumb is to be a dick in the right dose to get the job at hand done.

Sometimes the rule of thumb is to be such a dick that they never want to try you or challenge you again, or are unable to effectively.

[Devil]

All of grappling is about making the other person so annoyed, uncomfortable, in pain, distressed, and disgusted that they want to quit, or have no choice but to quit.

So, the rule of thumb is to be a dick in the right dose to get the job at hand done.

Sometimes the rule of thumb is to be such a dick that they never want to try you or challenge you again, or are unable to effectively.

[Dr. Gonzo]

I do tend to ramble.

I am of the opposite school of It is Fake,

where I drift and wander on whatever breeze carries me at the moment.

[Devil]

I do tend to ramble.

I am of the opposite school of It is Fake,

where I drift and wander on whatever breeze carries me at the moment.

[W. Rabbit]

All of grappling is about making the other person so annoyed, uncomfortable, in pain, distressed, and disgusted that they want to quit, or have no choice but to quit.

So, the rule of thumb is to be a dick in the right dose to get the job at hand done.

Sometimes the rule of thumb is to be such a dick that they never want to try you or challenge you again, or are unable to effectively.

That all makes sense on teh mat, but Gael Coadic's point was more about off the mat, particularly the disdain some competitive-minded folks have for non-competitors (which is just shitty elitist behavior towards undeserving people), and the disdain some in BJJ have in general for martial arts other than BJJ they've never trained in, which I thought was a dying thing but apparently not if you happen to sift through some youth BJJ Youtuber videos (not that you should, they're terrible in general).

He writes that of the multiple arts he trains, he only sees this sort of thing in BJJ, which we know is bullshit because BJJ doesn't come close to the elitist delusions in certain TMA schools that train dead.

This is kind of a central Bullshido trope, too, the fine line between valid criticism and unnecessary bigotry. In fact, there was once a video sticky here attached to the concept.

"Reckless, arrogant, stupid dicks". It's like they wrote this for you.

[hungryjoe]

It is good the word gets out sooner than later. Ball gag's and cat o'nines are optional.

[jnp]

BJJ has it’s roots in arrogance. The Gracie Challenge anyone? Is that not arrogant?

Not to mention the thuggish behavior displayed by all the dojo storming during the 20th century.

[Raycetpfl]

Boxing and kickboxing in particular have a high rate of Champions starting late in life compared to other sports. I would guess this is because of natural athleticism,potential striking power,reach and "chin" being largely genetic.
You're born with the dim mak or you're not.
Wrestling is a hard one to gauge in the USA because most of the best heavier framed guys stop wrestling in high school and just play foot ball in college. Ray Lewis was a four year FL highschool state champ. I dont believe he wrestled in college by choice.


Cultivating general athleticism in children is paramount for any sport. I can catch an athletic,intrested,committed 15 year old up to another 15 year old thats been training since he was 10 very quickly.

[Devil]

That all makes sense on teh mat, but Gael Coadic's point was more about off the mat, particularly the disdain some competitive-minded folks have for non-competitors (which is just shitty elitist behavior towards undeserving people), and the disdain some in BJJ have in general for martial arts other than BJJ they've never trained in, which I thought was a dying thing but apparently not if you happen to sift through some youth BJJ Youtuber videos (not that you should, they're terrible in general).

He writes that of the multiple arts he trains, he only sees this sort of thing in BJJ, which we know is bullshit because BJJ doesn't come close to the elitist delusions in certain TMA schools that train dead.

This is kind of a central Bullshido trope, too, the fine line between valid criticism and unnecessary bigotry. In fact, there was once a video sticky here attached to the concept.

"Reckless, arrogant, stupid dicks". It's like they wrote this for you.

My general view is that keeping shit stirred up is generally useful. I see it in politics. Like the whole Black Lives Matter thing was retarded. But there’s still some value in having people shit on police cars from time to time to keep everyone thinking and talking about how shit should be done.

Same thing here. Yeah, big headed competitors can probably grow if they have some jokes thrown their way. But lazy ass hacks need to shut up and know their role too. It’s all good.

Edit.....this doesn’t apply to me. I do know my role but I’m still not shutting up. ‘Cause fuck you.

[W. Rabbit]

BJJ has it’s roots in arrogance. The Gracie Challenge anyone? Is that not arrogant?

Not to mention the thuggish behavior displayed by all the dojo storming during the 20th century.

I think all martial arts do.

You won't get much more arrogant than Japanese jujutsu throughout the last 500 years. The art of an elite warrior class, and an antique of cultural elitism at its finest.

I think the arrogance just goes along with the whole concept of fighting art, which also explains why some instructors stress humility above all else, to combat the tendency for one's ego to grow with skill or victory.

[Devil]

This post was better the first time, when I made it.