Aikido vs MMA Reloaded.

[DCS]

Don't expect the unexpected

[Pship Destroyer]

Interesting how the MMA fighter pointed out the underlying issue with the Aikidoka is being afraid...fearing not just of getting punched...of punching too. I've always associated Aikido with one of those zen things where "no fear" is half the point...doesn't seem to work out when you haven't addressed, in particular, "fear of face smash".

So is that the point? A "defensive" martial art with little focus on attack is not only self-defeating against a mixed martial approach (knife to a gun fight analogy?), but Aikido in particular is missing defense or protection from strikes because they don't get struck enough in training to handle it and it breaks their mold?

It seems straightforward to me that you take an serious Aikidoka and give them MMA lessons, they can synthesize both together. That combo usually works for Judo or BJJ, they just seem to have a leg up on Aikido because of the focus on repetitive randori (i.e. practical experimentation).

It doesn't seem far out there that an Aikidoka with MMA instruction would fare any better/worse....but as the Aikido dude said, no way he could train for this just on the tatami. BUT he seemed to be a very fast learner, so the (10+ years of) Aikido must have had some value.

30m of MMA sparring later, he's probably a MUCH better Aikidoka than most. Imagine what a year would do. Imagine if he'd done both Aikido and MMA for 10+ Years. He'd be the most lethal man in a hakama on the planet, on top of having such a pleasant personality.

[BJMills]

That god damned hippie needs a hair cut.

[halfcut]

It seems straightforward to me that you take an serious Aikidoka and give them MMA lessons, they can synthesize both together. That combo usually works for Judo or BJJ, they just seem to have a leg up on Aikido because of the focus on repetitive randori (i.e. practical experimentation).

It doesn't seem far out there that an Aikidoka with MMA instruction would fare any better/worse....but as the Aikido dude said, no way he could train for this just on the tatami. BUT he seemed to be a very fast learner, so the (10+ years of) Aikido must have had some value.

Based on my completely anecdotal observations I feel the biggest issue is the types of people that Aikido attracts. It used to be a lot of older Judo guys looking for something new but familiar, but that's not really the case anymore. It largely seems to attract people who have never been punched or thrown around before, are not interested in doing so, and think they have found some silver bullet for self defense.

All that being said, kudos to this guy for being honest about what he's doing and jumping in the ring with a real professional fighter, and then getting feedback from him as well.

[GrouchyOldMan]

That god damned hippie needs a hair cut.

That seems to be a key identifying trait of the Aikidoka in any "Aikido vs. <style>" video. Almost like it is required, right along with the hakama.

I assumed that Aikido just naturally draws hippies, new-agers, and Steven Segal wannabes.

[Mandem]

It seems straightforward to me that you take an serious Aikidoka and give them MMA lessons, they can synthesize both together. That combo usually works for Judo or BJJ, they just seem to have a leg up on Aikido because of the focus on repetitive randori (i.e. practical experimentation).

I wouldn't say I was ever a really serious Aikidoka, but I have a brown belt in Aikido and wasn't far off going for my black belt when I started Muay Thai. What actually happened was the opposite; I realised quite quickly that I wasn't going to pull off any Aikido on Muay Thai guys, tried to adapt some Aikido punch defenses to proper punches in my Aikido training, mostly failed, and just focused on striking.

[Holy Moment]

It's almost like Aikido is for pussies or something...

[DCS]

It seems straightforward to me that you take an serious Aikidoka and give them MMA lessons, they can synthesize both together. That combo usually works for Judo or BJJ, they just seem to have a leg up on Aikido because of the focus on repetitive randori (i.e. practical experimentation).

It doesn't seem far out there that an Aikidoka with MMA instruction would fare any better/worse....but as the Aikido dude said, no way he could train for this just on the tatami. BUT he seemed to be a very fast learner, so the (10+ years of) Aikido must have had some value.

30m of MMA sparring later, he's probably a MUCH better Aikidoka than most. Imagine what a year would do. Imagine if he'd done both Aikido and MMA for 10+ Years. He'd be the most lethal man in a hakama on the planet, on top of having such a pleasant personality.

I think this is possible but IMO it would work better the other way: adding aikido to a preexisting base in combat sports.

[hungryjoe]

I think this is possible but IMO it would work better the other way: adding aikido to a preexisting base in combat sports.

Agree and can personally think of numerous others where this was the case. Judo in the majority but some others that had a varied background in striking arts. I'd say one of the better was a middle aged FMA guy.

[Pship Destroyer]

I think this is possible but IMO it would work better the other way: adding aikido to a preexisting base in combat sports.

I don't know if the order matters as much as the time spent blending both. The OP video's case is definitely a matter of latter-day respekt for MMA. He could have been even better at Aikido by picking up MMA sooner, right?

Haircut-wise, come on people. Lots of awesome boxers with dreads...let it go. LOL Ancient Greek boxers wore dreadlocks.



But think about the difference between somebody who only does one thing for 13 years, vs someone who tries a variety of interrelated things (consistently) over the same time.

That's the whole problem with some of the traditional MAs that haven't caught up...the idea there is that you spend your life doing X, then try Y, when you could be XYXYXYXYXYXYing...

Is it the art, or the people in it?

[GrouchyOldMan]

It's almost like Aikido is for pussies or something...

[Raycetpfl]

I don't know if the order matters as much as the time spent blending both. The OP video's case is definitely a matter of latter-day respekt for MMA. He could have been even better at Aikido by picking up MMA sooner, right?

Haircut-wise, come on people. Lots of awesome boxers with dreads...let it go. LOL Ancient Greek boxers wore dreadlocks.



But think about the difference between somebody who only does one thing for 13 years, vs someone who tries a variety of interrelated things (consistently) over the same time.

That's the whole problem with some of the traditional MAs that haven't caught up...the idea there is that you spend your life doing X, then try Y, when you could be XYXYXYXYXYXYing...

Is it the art, or the people in it?

People in it.
A US Marine fresh out of boot camp with no other training would do about 3000% better.
+

[DCS]

I don't know if the order matters as much as the time spent blending both. The OP video's case is definitely a matter of latter-day respekt for MMA. He could have been even better at Aikido by picking up MMA sooner, right?

IMO is about the amount of things one has to unlearn and the lack of delivery system/basic fundamentals someone who has only trained in, like in this case, Aikido suffers.

In other words: Usually for someone with a background in an alive art, lets say Muay Thai, learning MMA is going to be easier than for someone who is a martial blank slate and way easier than for someone who has been taught for years to do almost everything wrong.

Also someone with good fundamentals, for instance a BJJ black belt or the MMA guy in the clip, if exposed to an art like Aikido can easily pick what is right or useful for him in it, discard the rest.

Is it the art, or the people in it?

It's how the people and the art combine. A tough guy can make Aikido work and a pussyfied one can't make boxing work.

[ermghoti]

I'm a 16 year old 3rd Kyu, practicing for 2nd. Studying Aikido for half my life I kind of lived in the illusion that Aikido is just very hard to do but useful in a "real" fight. It is of course, but techniques are hard to actually perfom. To better my Aikido I've started Wing-Tsun and in my first sparring I realised hard difficult Aikido is to perform in such a situation. For half a life I identified myself with this fighting art. Now I'm kind of in an identity crisis. I love Aikido but I want it to work...

[NeilG]

People in it.

Not everybody in aikido is like that. I had a good friend (sadly since passed) who was an aikido instructor. He also had training in boxing, judo and a few other things, and worked as a bouncer when he was younger. He had a lot of stories about those days. He was one of my original kendo sempai, and I can tell you he didn't mind mixing it up on the floor.

You can find instructional videos he made on youtube but sadly they are just the usual slow motion aikido stuff. I know he was capable of a lot more rough and tumble.