Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

katafication

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    #31
    Originally posted by Permalost View Post
    Plus when the common attack is a lunge punch that kinda hangs there as they stand in a fencing lunge, it seems pretty reasonable to step your leg behind theirs and perform a so-so-do-giri.
    Yeah, exactly. It is often no much different from schoolyard roughhousing. We called those "estampudas" over here.

    Comment


      #32
      Originally posted by BJMills View Post
      I could swear I saw a koryu jujutsu demo once where they did something similar but much less dynamic than Osoto otoshi and called it Osoto gake. The tori kind of stepped into a deep stance bumping the uke with his hip then pulled him over his leg...

      The whole demo was very diato ryu looking but it was something else. I just can't remember the name.

      My caveat is that I know exactly jack shit about koryu so it could have been completely fake... Definitely had all the bowing and ultra stylized stepping and movement that looked traditional. But again someone who paid attention to detail could have faked that too.
      There isn't an official throw in KODOKAN JUDO called Osoto Gake. Koryu this or that, karate of different flavors, etc., may well have a throw called Osoto Gake. It's a thing for sure, and we could argue the minutiae of principles involved on how to determine if something is -gake (principle) versus otoshi (principle), or a blend of the two (probably the case a lot of times). Plus, you can blend -gari into it as well, using otoshi as the entry, get weight planted on uke support leg, THEN reap (-gari)...Shohei Ono takes that path often, while pulling pulling/pushing uke straight down.

      It all gets muddled. You can practice end members, as they all have different body feeling and shapes and applications, then be able to put them together in a practical situation.

      Comment


        #33
        Originally posted by DCS View Post
        O soto makikomi maybe?
        Osoto (gari) Makikomi
        j

        Soto Makikomi


        If you want brutal...Yoko Gake...

        Comment


          #34
          Originally posted by BKR View Post
          If you want brutal...Yoko Gake...
          Damn. Never seen that.

          Comment


            #35
            Originally posted by ksennin View Post
            Damn. Never seen that.
            Even the nage no kata version, when done correctly, is not fun to take as uke...if your tori lacks any control, you had better hope your ukemi is top notch. Even if it is, a clean throw is hard and fast and flat.

            Comment


              #36
              Talking about the lack of ukemi, about a year ago there was a karate event and instead of the fake choreographed demo stuff a training partner and I just did some basic drills and a couple throws and escapes. So I told my partner to go for o-goshi and after a brief scramble he threw me so hard the impact noise rose above the loud background music.

              So this is me being thrown (basically all I am good for these days):



              So afterwards many of the instructors present asked me if I had not been injured. But it was not even a shoulder throw! It was just a hip throw!

              Comment


                #37
                Originally posted by ksennin View Post
                Talking about the lack of ukemi, about a year ago there was a karate event and instead of the fake choreographed demo stuff a training partner and I just did some basic drills and a couple throws and escapes. So I told my partner to go for o-goshi and after a brief scramble he threw me so hard the impact noise rose above the loud background music.

                So this is me being thrown (basically all I am good for these days):



                So afterwards many of the instructors present asked me if I had not been injured. But it was not even a shoulder throw! It was just a hip throw!
                Hi quality mats you got there, too!

                Comment


                  #38
                  Originally posted by BKR View Post
                  Even the nage no kata version, when done correctly, is not fun to take as uke...if your tori lacks any control, you had better hope your ukemi is top notch. Even if it is, a clean throw is hard and fast and flat.
                  Have been uke for shodan and nidan exams, can confirm. You really just go *splat*.

                  Comment


                    #39
                    Originally posted by BKR View Post
                    Hi quality mats you got there, too!
                    As this is Honduras, Central America, any mat is a good mat. I did not train on a mat until after two decades of wooden and concrete floors and the occasional lawn.

                    Comment


                      #40
                      Originally posted by ksennin View Post
                      As this is Honduras, Central America, any mat is a good mat. I did not train on a mat until after two decades of wooden and concrete floors and the occasional lawn.
                      Que' juevos...

                      Comment


                        #41
                        Originally posted by BKR View Post
                        Que' juevos...
                        Quite scrambled from the hard impacts, believe me.

                        Comment


                          #42
                          Originally posted by ksennin View Post
                          Quite scrambled from the hard impacts, believe me.
                          I believe you !

                          Comment


                            #43
                            I spent many hours of my life as an Isshinryu student in the 90s doing crap that looked just like the OP video.

                            And yeah, it's just like everybody has been saying. No concept of position or conditioning. A new student goes two minutes between not knowing what the hell an arm bar is to doing them over and over on a fully complaint partner. At the end of the class they might spend some time on a pile of old carpets trying to do them in "sparring."

                            Maybe this is part of the reason krotty people think grappling can't be all that great. I mean, THEY know how to do an arm bar. Learned it from a black belt and everything. Even so, the damned thing doesn't work 80% of the time.

                            Comment


                              #44
                              Originally posted by MrGalt View Post
                              I spent many hours of my life as an Isshinryu student in the 90s doing crap that looked just like the OP video.

                              And yeah, it's just like everybody has been saying. No concept of position or conditioning. A new student goes two minutes between not knowing what the hell an arm bar is to doing them over and over on a fully complaint partner. At the end of the class they might spend some time on a pile of old carpets trying to do them in "sparring."

                              Maybe this is part of the reason krotty people think grappling can't be all that great. I mean, THEY know how to do an arm bar. Learned it from a black belt and everything. Even so, the damned thing doesn't work 80% of the time.
                              Well, to be fair, if you're rolling against an experienced grappler even an 80% fail rate is pretty phenomenal. I mean if I succeeded with 1 out of every 5 armbar attempts I'd be thrilled.

                              But I get your point.

                              Comment


                                #45
                                Originally posted by BJMills View Post
                                Well, to be fair, if you're rolling against an experienced grappler even an 80% fail rate is pretty phenomenal. I mean if I succeeded with 1 out of every 5 armbar attempts I'd be thrilled.

                                But I get your point.
                                Yeah, but this experience showed us that every grappling technique was low percentage even against people who suck.

                                The thing is crappling is about two people on the ground just essentially throwing submission attempts at one another. Arm straight, try to bar it. Arm bent, try to do some shoulder thingy to it. See an ankle, try to crank it. Remember humans have necks, try for a choke. No trying to get a dominant position. No strategy.

                                It works because striking (when you're a dipped foam point stop sparring piece of crap like we were) is exactly that. It's a series of completely independent, free-standing techniques, or maybe 1-2 combinations. Damn sure not three though. Every punch or kick is like the ref just called hajime on a brand new fight. Crappling brings that same philosophy to the horizontal plane.

                                Comment

                                Collapse

                                Edit this module to specify a template to display.

                                Working...
                                X