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Rener Gracie responds to critics saying he has sold out his family name...

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    Rener Gracie responds to critics saying he has sold out his family name...

    By showing how much money he is making by doing it.


    https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...type=3&theater

    Originally posted by Rener Gracie
    To the loyal haters:

    Yesterday, an article popped up in my newsfeed with my face on it along with a headline which suggested that mine and Ryron's jiu-jitsu perpetuation efforts were negatively impacting the legacy of my predecessors. I was upset, and my initial reaction was to prepare a lengthy response to refute all of the myths and misconceptions about Gracie University (like the idea that GU students don't actually get on the mat and train as much as anyone else), but when I logged on to Gracie University this morning, I noticed that new student enrollment was more than double the daily average. Over the last 48 hours, 174 new students, from 28 different countries, have began the jiu-jitsu journey with us (most of whom I tried to squeeze into the attached screenshot). Of the 174 new members, most are white belts located 100 miles or more from the nearest Certified Training Center, or any qualified academy, but have the discipline and motivation to find a group of training partners and learn like my grandfather did, through keen observation and lots of training, while using trial and error to pursue perfection. There are also a handful of blue and purple belts from non-Gracie Academies who will use their access to our linear curriculum to fill in the gaps and make sure they are learning the most important, but most neglected, aspects of jiu-jitsu. And then there are two black belts, whom I can only assume have enjoyed the journey thus far and may be skeptical about Gracie University's effectiveness, but at least they have the courage and humility to log in and understand it before criticizing it.

    I was upset at first, but after reflecting on the situation I realize that the right thing to do is to send a small gift to each of our misinformed doubters. Thanks to them, 174 new students from around the world have embarked on the GU journey!

    p.s. For those who still believe that GU doesn't work, or that the students aren't putting in the work and rolling like the rest of us, watch this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e5283yANkUE or this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5hD2...ature=youtu.be
    Ryan Kelly responds with probably the most succinct issue with Gracie University:

    Originally posted by Ryan Kelly
    Why then do you not make a rule about operating commercially if you are within a certain distance of a reputable black belt's academy? I am a 2nd degree black belt under a direct Gracie lineage, as is my partner. There are other legitimate black belts in my town. But now, a couple of jokers who have their blue belts from GU have moved in and with slick marketing and big funding have started spreading their propaganda of being "the only Certified Gracie Jiu-Jitsu Academy in town", and specifically targeting our students to come train with "the only true and authentic Academy". Nobody should be training with an on-line blue belt rather than one of the multiple black belts around who actually earned their belt. I understand the value in GU for people who can't make it to an Academy and for a clear learning progression and quality of Instruction that can compliment someone's training, but the fact that after 25 years of training BJJ that I have to compete against some online blue belt who has a fancy facility and runs cheap ass groupon specials. There are limitations that they could put on their students to prevent things like that from happening, if they care about the quality of BJJ being taught.
    Last edited by plasma; 2/25/2016 3:15am, .

    #2
    That's like Peter Luger's being worried a McDonalds will open up down the street.

    Comment


      #3
      This is what capitalism and free market is about. If you don't like it you can move to North Korea.

      Comment


        #4
        Originally posted by HarshMallow View Post
        That's like Peter Luger's being worried a McDonalds will open up down the street.
        With the caveat that first-timers are often looking for the cheapest beef.
        Consider for a moment that there is no meme about brown-haired, brown-eyed step children.

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by DCS View Post
          This is what capitalism and free market is about. If you don't like it you can move to North Korea.
          lmao ..... if you don't like it GEDOOOUT! love it or leave it!THESE COLORS DON'T RUN! SHAKE AND BAKE!

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by DCS View Post
            This is what capitalism and free market is about. If you don't like it you can move to North Korea.
            By that logic I should join the Bujinkan, Black Belt in 14 month and often very cheap. Who cares about effectiveness. I'm a Black Belt!

            Comment


              #7
              Gracie University is everything that is wrong with marital arts. But it still is the most effective martial art out there.

              I disagree with online ranking without competition wins in an open competition like NAGA, GQ,Ibjjf, Copa, etc. . If your winning you deserve to move up.
              Now does it really matter what I think? Not really, I am not in control of anything. At the end of the day Renner can go to bank withdrawal $1,000,000.00 ,bring it home,lay it on the bed and nail his gorgeous wife on it and then mail a fake ass blue belt off to some out of shape pussy that has never had physical contact with another human.
              He's never shutting down this revenue stream. Is what hes doing giving Bjj a bad name? yes. Does he care? not as long as he is cashing checks. He's over exploiting the resource though. By tarnishing the Gracie name it will mean less in the future.
              The Gracies are referred to as "The First Family of Fighting" , if standards are kept high they won't be held in such high regard. It's hurting what the others that came before him have created with blood ,sweat and balls.

              Comment


                #8
                Gracie University is everything that is wrong with marital arts. But it still is the most effective martial art out there.

                I disagree with online ranking without competition wins in an open competition like NAGA, GQ,Ibjjf, Copa, etc. . If your winning you deserve to move up.
                Now does it really matter what I think? Not really, I am not in control of anything. At the end of the day Renner can go to bank withdrawal $1,000,000.00 ,bring it home,lay it on the bed and nail his gorgeous wife on it and then mail a fake ass blue belt off to some out of shape pussy that has never had physical contact with another human.
                He's never shutting down this revenue stream. Is what hes doing giving Bjj a bad name? yes. Does he care? not as long as he is cashing checks. He's over exploiting the resource though. By tarnishing the Gracie name it will mean less in the future.
                The Gracies are referred to as "The First Family of Fighting" , if standards aren't kept high they won't be held in such high regard.
                It's hurting what the others that came before him have created with blood ,sweat and balls. The shitty part is he hasn't even ever fought at an elite level. What hes selling is the proof offered by the people that condemn the way he's delivering the product. Royce, Rickson, Royler,Drysdale, Renzo and others have fought against other elite martial artist to prove what Renner claims.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by plasma View Post
                  By that logic I should join the Bujinkan, Black Belt in 14 month and often very cheap. Who cares about effectiveness. I'm a Black Belt!
                  No, by that logic you can choose the goods and services an unregulated martial arts market offers.

                  Personally I'm on Kelly's side and think some kind of regulation or, alternatively, old school dojo storming is needed, but that's because I'm a left-wing european.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    How Prof Rener and Prof Ryron promote their students has no affect on my students or how I promote my students.
                    They can run their school(s) as they see fit.
                    For people not near an academy with a black belt or that prefer their system, their system provides a legitimate use.
                    And, their efforts of Gracie Breakdowns and students that start with their program but end up transferring into other local academies probably provides a subsidized marketing for all the local bjj/gjj academies.
                    In the grand scheme of things, it seems like a modernized system of the old Gracie learn by seminar model for remote students/academies that many of the Gracies provided in the 1990's, including several of the current Gracie University critics.
                    I suspect the Gracie University has zero negative impact on me or my students.
                    As I have said before, there are some things taught to beginners in the traditional Mestre Helio Gracie curriculum that are not my favorite technique choices.
                    But, that is a taste and preference issue that is not dependent on the delivery channel of the content.
                    If Prof Rener and Prof Ryron are making millions each month from their membership sales, good for them.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by WFMurphyPhD View Post
                      How Prof Rener and Prof Ryron promote their students has no affect on my students or how I promote my students.
                      They can run their school(s) as they see fit.
                      For people not near an academy with a black belt or that prefer their system, their system provides a legitimate use.
                      And, their efforts of Gracie Breakdowns and students that start with their program but end up transferring into other local academies probably provides a subsidized marketing for all the local bjj/gjj academies.
                      In the grand scheme of things, it seems like a modernized system of the old Gracie learn by seminar model for remote students/academies that many of the Gracies provided in the 1990's, including several of the current Gracie University critics.
                      I suspect the Gracie University has zero negative impact on me or my students.
                      As I have said before, there are some things taught to beginners in the traditional Mestre Helio Gracie curriculum that are not my favorite technique choices.
                      But, that is a taste and preference issue that is not dependent on the delivery channel of the content.
                      If Prof Rener and Prof Ryron are making millions each month from their membership sales, good for them.
                      I find this all to be a bit myopic, what they are doing is good for them but not good for the community.
                      The community suffers for it.
                      Since you are in the community you and your students suffer for it.
                      When quality control goes down in the community the whole community is worse off.
                      It might not be all that noticeable to you in your day to day affairs, but their is a long term effect, its slow, its mild, but its infectious.
                      Its not going to impact you as much as say someone that you promote to black belt that wants to go open up a school somewhere else.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by Raycetpfl View Post
                        lmao ..... if you don't like it GEDOOOUT! love it or leave it!THESE COLORS DON'T RUN! SHAKE AND BAKE!
                        Why do you hate our country?? Are you one of those yourapeenins??

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by plasma View Post
                          By that logic I should join the Bujinkan, Black Belt in 14 month and often very cheap. Who cares about effectiveness. I'm a Black Belt!
                          If you want to make money then yes you should. Green is the true deadly.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by DCS View Post
                            No, by that logic you can choose the goods and services an unregulated martial arts market offers.

                            Personally I'm on Kelly's side and think some kind of regulation or, alternatively, old school dojo storming is needed, but that's because I'm a left-wing european.
                            I thought left wing hippie euros liked talking things over like bitches. Anyway with the overly litigious society we live in now any dojo storming would be met with a battery charge and a lawsuit.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by goodlun View Post
                              I find this all to be a bit myopic, what they are doing is good for them but not good for the community.
                              The community suffers for it.
                              Since you are in the community you and your students suffer for it.
                              When quality control goes down in the community the whole community is worse off.
                              It might not be all that noticeable to you in your day to day affairs, but their is a long term effect, its slow, its mild, but its infectious.
                              Its not going to impact you as much as say someone that you promote to black belt that wants to go open up a school somewhere else.
                              The G/BJJ community already has bigger problem academies/instructors to worry about.

                              The worst problems that I see tend to fall into two categories:
                              1) Legitimate BJJ technicians who have criminal tendencies, and periodically hurt or rip off their students, or deal drugs, or do roll ups on people in public.
                              OR
                              2) The usual martial arts scammer with a folder full of black belt certificates
                              that somehow weaseled a bjj purple belt, brown belt, or even a black belt out of some recognized bjj instructor,
                              without a lot of mat skills but whose ego and business shenanigans requires them to act as if they are expert.
                              They put their students in competition after competition picking up luck of the draw weak bracket medals to market their business.
                              Their students are exposed to needless harm and aren't very well trained but they and their parents can't really tell the difference.
                              They teach moves they pull randomly from youtube without understanding methodology, details, or risk factors.

                              These are the two true banes of the BJJ community.

                              The Gracie University / CTC system, by requiring and providing a vetted curriculum at least cuts down some of the con-nery of the second category.
                              And by providing some character background checking and behavior expectations, it provides a check against some of the behavior issues
                              associated with both the first and second category.

                              I love traditional, solid G/BJJ academies, with solid techniques, good black belt instructors and solid good behavior encouragement.

                              But, I will take a Gracie University / CTC any day of the week over the category #1 and category #2 problem academies that I described above.

                              And, the problem is there are more category 1 and category 2 problem academies than Gracie University / CTCs.

                              I can't stand con artists, paper collectors, and criminals.

                              But we already have some major problems in our BJJ community that have nothing to do with Gracie University / CTC's, that are definitely problems.

                              More good traditional BJJ/GJJ academies, and even more Gracie University / CTC's may help crowd out or curb the standard con artist who just hangs up a shingle and pulls his stuff up without real understanding of methodology from youtube as they go along.
                              Last edited by Dr. Gonzo; 2/25/2016 11:00am, .

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