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If Wing Tsun works, where's the evidence?

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    Originally posted by ermghoti View Post
    Not me. I ain't got time to bleed.
    As I recall that didn't work out well for Jesse the body.

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      Originally posted by ksennin View Post
      Sure, it was a reality TV show that was filmed IN AGREEMENT with the teacher/school of a particular art, making all efforts possible to make the style look good so as to make the efforts of the hosts seem more legitimate, YET it still could not make the chun look good!
      (emphasis added)

      Err, yeah. That's what I said, they basically lied in order to make interesting TV. My problem is you holding up FQ as a legitimate challenge to the chun, for that exact reason. It's kinda like planting evidence to get a murder conviction. It's cheating.
      Consider for a moment that there is no meme about brown-haired, brown-eyed step children.

      Comment


        Originally posted by submessenger View Post
        (emphasis added)

        Err, yeah. That's what I said, they basically lied in order to make interesting TV. My problem is you holding up FQ as a legitimate challenge to the chun, for that exact reason. It's kinda like planting evidence to get a murder conviction. It's cheating.
        But in this example, the murderer is planting the evidence against himself.

        Comment


          Originally posted by Permalost View Post
          But in this example, the murderer is planting the evidence against himself.
          Again, I'm not defending the chun. FQ was a whole series of carefully crafted lies; as such, you cannot make a reasonable determination about the chun based on what is seen in FQ. Don't take my word for it, take Jimmy Smith's:

          Originally posted by Jimmy Smith
          They film at least 60 hours of footage, each episode, and they cut it down into 43 minutes. So, it is pretty crazy the amount of insanity that happens that winds up being cut out... And the one spar that they put in is the one where you get the crap kicked out of you! You beat 10 guys and one guy tears you apart, and of course that is what they put in the show.
          (source: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/eric-k...-_b_87688.html)

          (edit) You do have to admire that the chun was the last aired episode. The chun killed FQ, in the end!
          Last edited by submessenger; 3/04/2016 2:53pm, .
          Consider for a moment that there is no meme about brown-haired, brown-eyed step children.

          Comment


            Originally posted by submessenger View Post
            (emphasis added)

            Err, yeah. That's what I said, they basically lied in order to make interesting TV. My problem is you holding up FQ as a legitimate challenge to the chun, for that exact reason. It's kinda like planting evidence to get a murder conviction. It's cheating.
            I am holding up FQ not as a 'legitimate challenge' but as an example that even in a venue that was the equivalent of compliant demos for styles, the chun fared worst than most others. And even if we consider that the show distorted, exaggerated, or played with over-selective sampling, we can hardly believe that the show "lied" to favor other styles and then "lied" in the opposite fashion regarding the chun. I doubt the producers were Bullshido-indoctrinated Chun haters. So whatever their standards, with the minimal internal consistency, the simple comparison between shows gives a very bad image of a style making such huge claims. The whole FQ episode was filled of claims of how "street-oriented" and "street-proved" the style was. Then two journeymen beat up their representatives. Compare with the Kyokushin episode. At what point did the karateka there pontificate on how invincible and superior was their style? The emphasis was more on how hard they trained, and I think that matched up fairly realistically with the KK experience of Bullshido members.

            So, sure, we should not take it as gospel, because, hey, reality tv, indeed, but this was the equivalent of being shown an elaborately arranged demo that failed miserably.

            Comment


              Originally posted by submessenger View Post
              You do have to admire that the chun was the last aired episode. The chun killed FQ, in the end!
              That it did! Another reason for hating the chun. Whatever its faults, FQ was lots better than Human Weapon and it was fun to see what crazy training the locals put the hosts through to make their styles appear more hardcore.

              Comment


                I think that's the most hilarious part of it all... Even in a show where the footage was edited to make the style look good and effective, the Chun still bloody sucked. From what I remember of that episode, they kept instinctively throwing hooks at the Chunners that were catching them hard. Then I think they got stopped and told off for it... So much for the "NO RULES TEH REAL STR33T FIGHTER" style.. It works... So long as no one thinks to use a hook or moves out of the center line...
                "BJJ!!! Guard can't protect you from collapsing gym roof, tough guy!" - W. Rabbit

                Comment


                  Check out this guy's Facebook wall, Kwokwah Leung, a Wing Tsun instructor:

                  https://www.facebook.com/kwokwahl1?fref=ts

                  The first 10 videos on his timeline are from a seminar he gave at City Wing Tsun, the school I mentioned in earlier posts. This is rare, because Alex, the head instructor of CWT, almost never lets stuff like this out into the open. The only reason it's public is because Leung uploaded it, and I don't believe Alex has any say in the matter.

                  This just looks like LARPing to me. There's one video where he escapes a full nelson, but it doesn't appear to be applied appropriately at all.

                  If anything, this is even more evidence that Wing Tsun does NOT work.

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by ksennin View Post
                    That it did! Another reason for hating the chun. Whatever its faults, FQ was lots better than Human Weapon and it was fun to see what crazy training the locals put the hosts through to make their styles appear more hardcore.
                    Dont get me started on human weapon. Their 3d animation sections are pure bullshido. With every tech they show they also show "pounds" of energy the tech does (or similar) and alot of the time it would suggest they carry almost the same force as a car hitting you.

                    Comment


                      Originally posted by Kravbizarre View Post
                      Dont get me started on human weapon. Their 3d animation sections are pure bullshido. With every tech they show they also show "pounds" of energy the tech does (or similar) and alot of the time it would suggest they carry almost the same force as a car hitting you.
                      But a wing chun punch hits with the same amount of force as a bowling ball dropped from a height of 10 feet on Mars!!!

                      Comment


                        I have yet to be able to knee a car into orbit using my Muay Thai... Human Weapon lied to me.

                        I've just seen a trailer of Ip Man 3 with him fighting Mike Tyson... Oh dear... Lets face facts, outside of movie world, that fight would have lasted all of 15 seconds.
                        "BJJ!!! Guard can't protect you from collapsing gym roof, tough guy!" - W. Rabbit

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by Sovvolf View Post
                          I have yet to be able to knee a car into orbit using my Muay Thai... Human Weapon lied to me.

                          I've just seen a trailer of Ip Man 3 with him fighting Mike Tyson... Oh dear... Lets face facts, outside of movie world, that fight would have lasted all of 15 seconds.
                          Maybe, if you include the ten-count.

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by ermghoti View Post
                            Maybe, if you include the ten-count.
                            I also included the time it takes to come out the corner... Touch gloves and for Ip's soul to travel back to its body after the impact.
                            "BJJ!!! Guard can't protect you from collapsing gym roof, tough guy!" - W. Rabbit

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