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  • BKR
    replied
    Originally posted by ChenPengFi View Post
    Isn't fist fighting already deadly force (eg Martin) and even more so when a cop (ie assumed gun) is involved?
    I'm just thinking that makes judicious use of force even more complicated.
    It can be, but isn't necessarily. Guys can fight cops without swinging, resist arrest without using deadly force or what could be perceived as deadly force.

    There are well known legal precedents/standards that are applied to determine 'excessive force', use of deadly force, 4th amendment violations, etc.

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  • gregaquaman
    replied
    Originally posted by ChenPengFi View Post
    Did you ever practice anything specific with a bat?

    Yeah did some shitty stick work. But people latch on to the thing really quickly. So I gave up and just used it to hit people.

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  • ChenPengFi
    replied
    Originally posted by gregaquaman View Post
    Every time I tried to grapple with a bat. The other dude grabbed it and then I was fighting for the weapon rather than trying to clamp the guy I was trying to clamp. I just really didn't like the concept at all.
    Did you ever practice anything specific with a bat?

    Leave a comment:


  • ChenPengFi
    replied
    Originally posted by BKR View Post

    That and it's hard as hell to subdue a guy who is really fighting and does not want to give up, but is not using deadly force.
    Isn't fist fighting already deadly force (eg Martin) and even more so when a cop (ie assumed gun) is involved?
    I'm just thinking that makes judicious use of force even more complicated.

    Leave a comment:


  • gregaquaman
    replied
    Every time I tried to grapple with a bat. The other dude grabbed it and then I was fighting for the weapon rather than trying to clamp the guy I was trying to clamp. I just really didn't like the concept at all.

    Leave a comment:


  • Permalost
    replied
    I think the problem with nunchucks for police is similar to the problems of the side handle baton when it first came out- the advocates claim that this new style of baton will allow an officer to use safer techniques to subdue a suspect without cracking their head, but in reality when the adrenaline turns on, the weapon is used "improperly" in a way that makes the weapon even more dangerous than a standard baton. For a side handle, this can mean holding it "backwards" and swinging it like a bat, hitting with the protruding handle like a hammer and concentrating the force on a smaller area (plus the extra weight on the business end makes it more topheavy than a straight baton when used this way). For nunchucks, it means that the cop will default to nunchuck-haymakers as a striking method, because the more conservative striking methods of the straight baton are out. Only strikes with sufficient momentum to swing and follow through are of any use. On the restraint side of things, using the nunckucks to assist any kind of carotid restraint is more of a murdering technique than a restraint one. Its a weapon where only the most dangerous techniques will actually work.

    A lot of effective baton techniques are executed from the port arms position.

    In a wide grip, the baton can be used to thrust with either point or the part between the hands. This provides less percussive effect than if the baton is held like a bat and swung for maximum momentum. Nunchucks can't be used in this way.
    Last edited by Permalost; 11/03/2015 12:12pm, .

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  • mike321
    replied
    Originally posted by The Villain View Post
    I am totally down with grappling with chucks.
    But would you want to give up some of the advantages of a nightstick like creating distance. Also chucks seem ridiculous for breaking a window and clearing loose glass.

    Leave a comment:


  • BKR
    replied
    Originally posted by Raycetpfl View Post
    I really feel like they were set before tasers. Good alcohol based pepper spray. Now da police can't carry the good alcohol based stuff because it can turn into a BBQ if someone tasers while another is pepper spraying.

    Tasers don't work at close range reliably I am told.

    I don't understand how grappling with Nunchucks would be better than getting good at cuffing people.
    TASER effect to incapacitate depends on how far apart the darts are on the target, and where they hit, assuming good solid penetration of the darts. The closer the darts are together, the less the TASER effect. If the darts are close together, it can hurt like hell, but not lock up the body.

    On a good shot, your whole body locks up. You can also drive stun, which is pulling the cartridge out and using the electrodes like a cattle prod. Two darts close together (as in at very close range) has similar effect.

    And yeah, I was tased as part of training/certification. I was the example of the perfect shot. I wasn't going to be fighting anybody for 5 seconds, that's for sure...

    I think the primary issue for cops is they have to measure their use of force constantly, plus, lack of real ongoing training.

    That and it's hard as hell to subdue a guy who is really fighting and does not want to give up, but is not using deadly force.

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  • Raycetpfl
    replied
    I really feel like they were set before tasers. Good alcohol based pepper spray. Now da police can't carry the good alcohol based stuff because it can turn into a BBQ if someone tasers while another is pepper spraying.

    Tasers don't work at close range reliably I am told.

    I don't understand how grappling with Nunchucks would be better than getting good at cuffing people.

    Leave a comment:


  • The Villain
    replied
    I am totally down with grappling with chucks.

    Leave a comment:


  • Bluto Blutarsky
    replied
    In NYC cops just use bullets for restraint.

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  • Permalost
    replied
    Jesus proved that a little wrist pain won't stop a good Christian.

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  • gregaquaman
    replied
    Originally posted by BKR View Post
    I saw some really effective wrist-techniques in there too. The pain compliance was really working on those pissed off, intoxicated perps...

    I think that the protesters need to load up on Oxy or other narcotics and just kind of go REALLY limp en masse. Then the cops would be really puzzled...
    They were fueled by zeal or something.

    Leave a comment:


  • gregaquaman
    replied
    Originally posted by Ming Loyalist View Post
    couldn't handle all the jeebus idiocy while waiting for the glorious arm breaking. what time does the arm breaking happen?
    A few minutes in.hammerlock gone wrong. Same chucks.

    03:30 ish

    Leave a comment:


  • Permalost
    replied
    Originally posted by Bneterasedmynam View Post
    Are nunchukas still actually banned in California?? If I remember correctly they were originally banned because Bruce Lee made them look scary in a movie. This is one of the reasons I think that California should be left out of making any gun laws.
    Yes, they're still banned because there was never an effort to unban them.

    Leave a comment:

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