Why do TMAers hate on MMA? (stereotypes you've heard about combat sports)

[big maclol]

I was talking to my friend earlier who has his own FB martial arts group (most of them do TMA) and I noticed. Why do so many Traditional Martial Artists hate on Combat sports like MMA, Boxing, Kickboxing, BJJ, wrestling, and SAMBO so much?

He told me how real martial artists don't fight for money (Apparently everyone in combat sports is only in it for money, passion doesn't exist for a Combat sports athlete)

Then he tells me that all combat fighters are egotistical, and brute fighters but not real talented martial artists.

"A better martial artist isn't a better fighter. You can do martial arts and get beat up by a non-trained thug in the streets and still be a better martial artist, martial arts isn't about fighting"

Yet these same people avoid talking about TKD and Karate and their ruled competitions.

"Western martial art aren't real martial arts", etc
Why do TMAers think we're all brute meatheads? who started this trend? lol

[JohnnyCache]

I was talking to my friend earlier who has his own FB martial arts group (most of them do TMA) and I noticed. Why do so many Traditional Martial Artists hate on Combat sports like MMA, Boxing, Kickboxing, BJJ, wrestling, and SAMBO so much?

He told me how real martial artists don't fight for money (Apparently everyone in combat sports is only in it for money, passion doesn't exist for a Combat sports athlete)

Then he tells me that all combat fighters are egotistical, and brute fighters but not real talented martial artists.

"A better martial artist isn't a better fighter. You can do martial arts and get beat up by a non-trained thug in the streets and still be a better martial artist, martial arts isn't about fighting"

Yet these same people avoid talking about TKD and Karate and their ruled competitions.

"Western martial art aren't real martial arts", etc
Why do TMAers think we're all brute meatheads? who started this trend? lol

I was trying to talk a "combat sports" guy into charging and self promoting a little MORE earlier this week.

I also find the cross-section of who walks into a given school is, well, roughly the same. It's really just a question of which door the non-initiated person walks through first.

[goodlun]

Because MMA and Combat Sports have proven how ineffective their arts are and well they have to satisfy their own ego about the choices in life they have made.
Also because most of them have little concept of the technical aspects of a combat sport.
BJJ for example as you know is extremely technical but those who don't do any sort of ground fighting have no fucking clue as to how deep that rabbit hole goes.
They have no idea of the artistry involved.
They have no idea of the time sweat and blood it takes to to learn its depths.
So they parrot the shit other TMAers say to make them selves feel good about themselves.
The ego thing to me is the most funny.
Participating in a Combat sport is so incredibly hard on ones ego its crazy.
You constantly have to test yourself against people who are in fact better than you, and who in fact could kill you if they wanted to.
You actually step into a situation where you can lose.
Combat sports is better for developing a healthy ego than TMA arts are for sure.

[Devil]

They have those attitudes because they aren't serious martial artists themselves. They love to talk about being serious martial artists. But serious martial artists seek out the truth about martial effectiveness. That search will always bring you in contact with combat sport athletes who will kick your ass and change your perspective if you're willing to look honestly at your own skills.

[judoka01]

You already know the answer to this. Its easier on their egos if they just do an easy TMA than do something that requires strength, conditioning, technique etc.

[Devil]

Lately I've been chewing on the idea that we'd be much better off if we did away with the term "TMA". It allows shitty martial artists to hide behind weak training as if it's a point of honor. "Well, fuck you MMA meatheads. I'm an honorable traditional martial artist so your argument is invalid." We should acknowledge only two categories of martial arts training. Good training and shit training.

[PartialArts]

I think it comes down to insecurity. A lot of TMA practitioners don't train to anywhere near the level that a combat sport practitioner will, but they really want to believe the hype about whichever system they practise. Furthermore, I think in the rush to try and get students, teachers of TMA will often throw terms such as 'reality based' and 'practical' into their marketing spiel, and then have their students practise in ways which are so removed from reality that it's not even worth joking about, IE 1/2/3 step sparring in karate.

I practise karate, and I know some of the guys there have a real dim view of MMA, because it's 'only a sport'. They look at something like BJJ and conclude that it's merely a pair of guys grinding on each other on the deck, without actually checking out the techniques that are being put into practise, or acknowledging the hard work that they've put in learning them. They assume that because it's a sporting contest, that their 'traditional' style would undoubtedly prove the winner.

A lot of traditional guys never test what they learn, never try applying it under pressure and just assume "It'll work when I need it". For example, I also practise classical Japanese martial arts, my school has a very loose affiliation to the Bujinkan (as in my instructor used to train under the Booj, until he realised how shitty they are. He dropped all the ninja stuff and decided just to research the samurai side of things), and earlier in the year we attended a seminar in Chester. The guy teaching was a 15th dan, Steffen Frohlich, and it was terrible. So many of the practitioners were massively out of shape and practising things which have no basis in reality. They'd then say things like, "Oh, this'd work on an mma guy, they'd never expect it". The sheer ignorance on display was pretty scary.

[ghost55]

Lately I've been chewing on the idea that we'd be much better off if we did away with the term "TMA". It allows shitty martial artists to hide behind weak training as if it's a point of honor. "Well, fuck you MMA meatheads. I'm an honorable traditional martial artist so your argument is invalid." We should acknowledge only two categories of martial arts training. Good training and shit training.

I would be very okay with this.

[Bayonet]

The worst part is, most of these ponytailed sperg-cases will happily mouth off about their favorite legendary master who would take on any style, travel the world to find new challenges, learn new ways to fight, etc.

But when you point out that that's exactly what competitive fighters do, they clam up and change the subject.

Most of the people who go into non-sparring martial arts just want some sort of Walter Mitty ego cocoon.

[FinalLegion]

You know why TMAers hate on 'modern' or 'combat' sports/arts?

Because the modern martial artist has remembered what those egotistical fucksticks have forgotten: that the term 'martial arts' has the word MARTIAL. They prance around doing all their 'traditional' movements and techniques that are not combat effective in the slightest. Why? Because they study at schools and within systems that do not teach their students how to translate traditional techniques and methods into modern effectiveness. They do not train with appropriate aliveness They believe that the reality of combat is what they see in well choreographed martial arts movies. They pat themselves on the back for keeping a 'traditon' alive and think themselves true and honorable warriors but, in truth, they are little more victims waiting to happen.

I don't believe there is anything wrong with studying 'traditional' martial arts; for example, I think kenjutsu is awesome and I'd love to study it but I'm not going to delude myself into thinking it's martial virtues are going to translate into real world combat effectiveness. Certainly traditional helps can be helpful in conditioning the body and increasing one's awareness and perceptiveness but those things alone do not win a fight. There are also philosophical and even spiritual aspects to training in the martial arts but again those elements don't win a fight. They can help you avoid a fight, diffuse a situation, etc. and that is helpful...but if it comes down to blows than the guy who is double legging you so he can GnP you isn't going to give a fuck about how enlightened you are.

Not all TMAers are of this type. The problem is that too many of them are of this type. They live in the fantasy that they've seen in the media they devour...from anime to samurai drama, from video games to martial arts movies. They try to consciously live in that reality...but the intrusion of the true reality breaks that fantasy and it pisses them off.

[Ke?poFist]

I often hear that sport martial arts are for meat-heads and athletes.

Anyone who doesn't think sport arts possess nuanced technique and detail has never rolled with a high level Jiu-Jitsu practitioner. Even after all these years, I am humbled on the mat, and made to feel like a scrub by some of my training partners, let alone world class champions. All the kata perfection and bunkai study in the world doesn't compare to proficiency of a black belt setting up an armbar that you see coming, but still cannot stop.

[ashkelon]

They also feel superior because of the perceived philosophical aspect, which puts them above "mere sports".
Which is funny cause they usually don't know shit about eastern philosophy.

That said though, most experienced guys I know do respect combat arts and accept that they don't have the same fighting ability, even if a level of delusion remains.

[Omega Supreme]

Personally I fall on both sides of this coin:

My traditional side rolls its eyes when I get youtube idealogical sport orientated "athletes" shutting off the idea that TMA has any worth.

My sport combat style rolls its eyes when the TMA guys start using cognitive dissonance as a reason why sport styles are (insert blank).


Both sides have their dogma. Very tedious.

[Azatdawn]

Personally I fall on both sides of this coin:

My traditional side rolls its eyes when I get youtube idealogical sport orientated "athletes" shutting off the idea that TMA has any worth.

My sport combat style rolls its eyes when the TMA guys start using cognitive dissonance as a reason why sport styles are (insert blank).


Both sides have their dogma. Very tedious.

Typical nuanced MMA-meathead delusional TMA answer.

[Devil]

Personally I fall on both sides of this coin:

My traditional side rolls its eyes when I get youtube idealogical sport orientated "athletes" shutting off the idea that TMA has any worth.

My sport combat style rolls its eyes when the TMA guys start using cognitive dissonance as a reason why sport styles are (insert blank).


Both sides have their dogma. Very tedious.

Exactly. This is why we should just forego all the bullshit and stop distinguishing between TMA and modern martial arts. Just good training and bad training.

Here's the way I see it. All the pajama wearing dojo princesses believe that there's more to martial arts than fighting. To them it's about enlightenment and whatnot. And you know what? I agree with them.

And that enlightenment comes from hard training. From pushing yourself. From stepping outside of your comfort zone. From getting your ass kicked. From bleeding and nursing injuries. From proving your ability to survive while you're under fire.

There's nothing non-traditional about good training. Modern sport athletes are practicing traditional martial arts. They're just practicing them better.