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    Originally posted by DCS View Post
    Like in Judo's Kime no Kata.
    It doesn't matter if Judo has something similar because it has this huge difference

    Since it has that difference it has ground fighting.


      This is not ground fighting

      This is compliance from standing to the ground and compliance on the ground.


        Originally posted by wingchunx2z View Post
        wing chun has ground fighting too.

        Getting knocked out isn't ground fighting.


          We've all seen the ancient Chinese art of the side headlock without arm control.


            Originally posted by goodlun View Post
            I disagree with your disagreement.
            In Judo their is a transition into a ground fight, truth is in Judo you could throw someone and still lose the match in that transition.
            In Akidio their is a certain assumption that you will be able to move right into the arm lock and that the guy on bottom isn't going to roll out of it or do anything their is no actual fight on the ground.
            LOL, define groundfighting then, please.

            So, if I am doing groundwork randori (ne waza... roughly meaning "reclining, or "on the ground as in not standing up" technique(s), transition to my knees or one knee down one up (called kyoshi in Judo) and apply Hara Gatame or Waki Gatame, (while on my knees), it's not groundfighting/ne waza ?

            If I'm in a "street fight", slip, and a guy jumps on me and we start grappling on the ground, what transition are you talking about ?

            It's a katame waza applied with both people on the ground.

            Assumptions don't matter. Katame waza applied with both people on the ground (not standing) is ne waza.

            If I apply a standing armlock and remain standing, it's katame waza applied as tachi waza (standing technique).

            Of course aikido doens't have anything like the ne waza of Judo or BJJ.

            And ne waza is all the stuff done in between the pins, chokes, locks, it's about.

            Of course, it's all semantics, as you are going with, LOL !


              His mistake was fighting not defending himself. As a martial artist you should be above such nonsense. His technique proved he is a beginner and his decision to fight proved he is not training correctly.

              He had every opportunity to walk away. I hope that ass whipping taught him the right lesson. If he was my student he would be warned if he every did anything like that again he will be kicked out of the academy.


                Originally posted by BKR View Post
                ne waza is all the stuff done in between the pins, chokes, locks, it's about.
                This is a close enough definition to ground fighting for me or at least the concept that their is all the stuff that needs to be done aside from techniques for it to be ground fighting vs not ground fighting.
                This is what is in Judo/BJJ/Wrestling/SAMBO "ground fighting" that is lacking in Aikido "ground fighting".

                You know what I just went back and reread your initial post and I actually don't disagree with it.

                In Judo if you are kneeling it is ground fighting. What you described was ground fighting.
                Sorry I wrapped too much "context" into between pete.m2 and permalost post that I missed what you actually said. My fault.



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