Which MA for self defence?

[K876]

Hi guys,

This probably gets posted several thousand times a day, so apologies in advance. I am looking for a MA which is focused primarily on self defence. I don't care about belts, tournaments, etc. I just want to learn how to defend myself in a realistic situation (e.g against multiple opponents, tight spaces, weapons). I have no previous MA experience.

I have spent half the day reading up on different styles and am currently considering Krav Maga, MT, Eskrima, Systema (which seems to be universally panned on this forum), and BJJ (which seems to be universally praised on this forum). Can you offer me some advice?

I live in Perth, Western Australia - are there any decent clubs here?

Thanks very much!

[SteveM]

Yes, it's been asked a few times...

1) Find something in your area you can train regularly. The best system is one you have competency in when you are attacked, not the one you hope to someday study...

2) Just accept right now that there is no "one true system" that is the best at all standup/grappling/ground/knife/club/pistol/rifle/whatever. To get the best instruction in multiple disciplines you should and must train in a variety of systems. This is where you supplement whatever training you have available locally with seminar/private/small group and/or video instruction in other systems.

Good luck with your training and welcome to Bullshido.

[Krijgsman]

Eskrima/Kali/Arnis is pretty well respected as a self defense martial art here. So are the other popular basics like BJJ, Muay Thai, Judo, Wrestling, Boxing, Sambo (etc).

Krav from a good source is fine. Krav from someone who went to a two day conference to get their instructor certificate (which seems more common than the former these days) is crap.

[Eudemic]

Krav from a good source is fine. Krav from someone who went to a two day conference to get their instructor certificate (which seems more common than the former these days) is crap.

Having practiced Krav Maga for five years, I would like to second this.

Also, if you do wind up training in Krav, I would recommend finding additional instruction in a system dedicated to striking and/or grappling. My experience has been that as an RBSD system Krav Maga decent (lots of emphasis on situational awareness, aggression/intensity, and 'discretion being the better part of valor') but doesn't actually refine its combatives much.

[goodlun]

From one of MTripp's old post

The four rules:

1. I will not drink to excess and I will avoid ALL persons and places where people will be drinking to excess.

Note: Watch cops sometime and notice how many people are drunk out of their mind and in trouble.

2. I will not use illegal drugs and I will avoid ALL persons and places where people are using them or they are to be found.

Note: We just had a murder up here because one druggie told a druggie buddy that his grandparents had money and no guns in the house. Druggie #2 went there and beat everyone to death with a hammer.

3. I will avoid ALL ilicit sexual contact of ANY nature.

Note: I am not just talking about strip clubs (that is covered in #1). I mean leave other peoples wives, husbands, girlfriends, ALONE. Stay away from hookers (both 1 and 2 are always around hookers).

4. Avoid "challenging" behaviors, neither issue or accept them.

and

OK; technique selection. First; our mantra if you will:

WILL THIS TECHNIQUE WORK AGAINST A BIGGER, STRONGER OPPONENT WHO IS ATTEMPTING TO STOP IT BY ANY MEANS, FAIR OR FOUL?

That must be asked EVERY time we choose a technique.

For beginning level (Ikkyu in Judo; Blue Belt in BJJ/GJJ) YOU are going to have to select 10 techniques... TOPS. Some are a must others are of personal taste ot your body type.

You are going to need:

2 arm strikes

2 leg strikes

2 takedowns

2 "clinches"

2 "submission/restraining" holds

I used to use the words "finishing hold" as that was clearer; but the words could haunt you in court. So I leave it to you to understand that message.

One of the takedowns HAS to be a shoot, either single or double leg. One of the submissions HAS to be the CVR or Carotid Vascular restraint. One of the clinches has to be the Russian Mount (we don't pin people on the street). One of the leg strikes is kicking from the ground (butt scoot) and all that that entails. One of the arm strikes has to be the chin jab/tiger claw.

Now; when used in combination (Ketsugo) you would be stunned to see how many ways 10 techniques work out. Dr. Mance says you can mix 10 techniques into about 10,000 different combinations. At least I think he said that; memory getting bad. I know it was huge!

Lets stay with that; how long would it take you to master 10,000 techniques? Bet it would take longer than learning 10 REAL well!

Now these skills must be mastered! Drilled over and over again as if your life counted on them

[Azatdawn]

Russian Mount

Is this the same thing as a Russian tie up? I've never heard of the Russian Mount before (neither have I heard of the Russian tie up... google brought that up).

[bombom]

Hi, and welcome to Bullshido. You have a very common question, no worries.

There is no quick solution to this problem. Avoid training with those that tell you there is.

Develop your situational awareness. And your people skills. Don't take the bait when someone challenges you. Stay out of troublesome places.

As for what MA to train in. MT is good, so is boxing. Judo is good, real good. So is BJJ. I know you are not interested in competition, but you should train in a place that competes regularly. This will help you pressure test your skills on a regular basis when you spar. Just don't compete if you don't want to.

Good luck.

[dgold44]

The worse place to ever be in a street fight is on the ground. You never know if the attacker has friends who can stomp on your face. Plus you have to deal with sharp objects and other hazards.
You never want to be on the ground . However, this can be impossible to avoid so it would be good to learn some BJJ.
However, I think you should pick a primary system that is more stand up. Check out Krav Maga it teaches tons of street self defense such as attacks from Bear hugs, chokes, wrist grabs, hair grabs yes lol, and other types of head locks. KRav maga will not work well in the ring but for the street it can be effective.

MMA will give you the most precise strikes and make you the toughest but Krav address many other things like weapons too.

[K876]

Thank you all for the help.

Krav Maga looks very interesting but I am not sure if there are any good instructors near me. I have found 2 places which seem to be affiliated with international organisations (KMG & IKI), but there is no information about the instructors. I'm not sure what to expect so I can't really judge them, and I don't want to spend a lot of time/money on something that might turn out to be completely useless.

There seems to be a good BJJ place (Legion 13) not far from my university, but as dgold44 said, fighting on the ground seems like a bad idea to me in a situation with weapons or multiple opponents. I will probably end up learning another eventually, so BJJ could be a solid start.

Kali looks very interesting, but a lot of the places I've looked at look like McDojo's. I will look into it some more.

Any more suggestions are welcome, thank you all.

[DKJr]

You need 4 skill sets to be an effective fighter.

Stand up= boxing, muay thai, kyokushin, (insert other alive striking art)

Clinch= Judo, Sambo, Muay Thai (sorta), Wrestling, Catch Wrestling

Ground= BJJ, Judo, Wrestling, Sambo, Catch Wrestling

Weapons= Arnis, Kali, Marksmanship, (the fuck if I know what else)

If you have a competent ability in at least two of these you'll usually be ok.

I think the ability to transition between any of these is the most important ability as it allows you to control the terms of the fight thus allowing you to be at your strongest. Which includes putting people on the ground to hurt them, I'm looking at you dgold, if they are better at striking than you.

[karma2343]

Everyone has given great advice so far, but I would actually advise you to avoid Krav Maga entirely. Yes, there are good places out there. But until you've familiarized yourself enough with concepts of aliveness and been around long enough to get an eye for that sort of stuff, it'd be easy to get sucked in by a shitty Krav school (or any shitty type of school, but most of the rest of the styles listed are pretty consistent in quality).

[goodlun]

The most important thing to look for it is taught in an alive manner

Here is a comprehensive video about what we mean by aliveness

[patfromlogan]

The 'stay off the ground' advice bothers me. BJJ and a lot of arts will teach you to put the other guy on the ground and give skills to deal with being down. There looks like a lot of schools in Perth.

AFTER you read the sticky in N00bieville about finding a good school go check several out. But do read it - watch out for egomaniacs, chip on shoulder types and crazies. Find a friendly bunch who don't hurt n00bs.

[Eudemic]

If you do try Krav Maga, do your best to avoid any of the US Krav organizations. A lot of the Krav Maga to be learned out there can be bad, but it is more consistently bad in the groups based in the US. Also do your best to get a feeling for how much this sort of stuff should cost per month; lots of instructors out there from virtually every art that really only want all of your money.

Everyone has given great advice so far, but I would actually advise you to avoid Krav Maga entirely. Yes, there are good places out there. But until you've familiarized yourself enough with concepts of aliveness and been around long enough to get an eye for that sort of stuff, it'd be easy to get sucked in by a shitty Krav school (or any shitty type of school, but most of the rest of the styles listed are pretty consistent in quality).

Karma pretty much said what I was trying to say in my first post, but he said it much better.

[Eddie Hardon]

I just want to learn how to defend myself in a realistic situation (e.g against multiple opponents, tight spaces, weapons). I have no previous MA experience.

I live in Perth, Western Australia - are there any decent clubs here?

Thanks very much!

Tongue-in-cheek, you're in Perth. Ask your local Army unit ;-)

Someone teaches them Unarmed Combat....:-)

Weapons and tight spaces? Who better to ask?

Best Wishes