Ninjutsu

[BudoCanuck]

I have so far, only physically trained in Ninjutsu in the Bujinkan Dojo environment, which I had some issues with.

The main instructor, a Sandan, became hostile towards myself and my friend when we asked or openly spoke about commonality and cross training. The Dojo space is part of a multi discipline martial arts school. There were several occasions where we trained with other practitioners before or after sessions and openly discussed technique and training methods.

I found that the club was bottom heavy and that the more experienced martial artists were marginalized rather than utilized by the Bujinkan instructors.

I want to make it clear that I'm not having a go at the Bujinkan school. I am merely sharing my experiences with this Dojo.

I'm very aware of the fact that all modern Ninjutsu is directly linked to Masaaki Hatsumi and therefore Bujinkan, but are there any other schools in the UK or Europe that any of you would recommend? I have extensively Googled and asked for suggestions of other schools, but most in this area are Kung Fu, Muay Thai or BJJ/MMA.

I am just an Aikidoka who has an interest in cross training. I train daily and partake in Randori 2-3 times a week. Finding a good environment in which to progress is a priority for me this summer.

Thanks for reading and any suggestions would be very much appreciated.

[lordbd]

I think most ppl here would say crosstrain in MT or BJJ. Any particular reason you want ninjutsu?

I transitioned recently from Aikido to Muay Thai. I'm not an Aikido hater and actually quite like the art for what it is, and I've found that if I feel like it I can keep some Aikido principles in mind while fighting (e.g. entering, turning, finding distance, staying relaxed/centered). Really these are just good principles for fighting in general.

Anyway, I vote that you crosstrain Muay Thai and keep us updated on how the training melds together for you.

[BudoCanuck]

I think most ppl here would say crosstrain in MT or BJJ. Any particular reason you want ninjutsu?

I transitioned recently from Aikido to Muay Thai. I'm not an Aikido hater and actually quite like the art for what it is, and I've found that if I feel like it I can keep some Aikido principles in mind while fighting (e.g. entering, turning, finding distance, staying relaxed/centered). Really these are just good principles for fighting in general.

Anyway, I vote that you crosstrain Muay Thai and keep us updated on how the training melds together for you.

Ok, thanks for your input.

I have a long standing interest in Japanese arts and really just wanted to explore the principles and "secrets" of Ninjutsu.

As far as the cross training goes, I think that, for me personally BJJ and Hung Boxing/MT could be good. I have distanced myself from the local MMA clubs due to the volatile "hard man" element, but I suppose they really are the minority.

[CrackFox]

I have a long standing interest in Japanese arts and really just wanted to explore the principles and "secrets" of Ninjutsu.

The main secrets are that its history is all made up, and the techniques have no founding in reality.

Now that your exploration is complete, you are free to go look at other stuff.

[BudoCanuck]

The main secrets are that its history is all made up, and the techniques have no founding in reality.

Now that your exploration is complete, you are free to go look at other stuff.

Not very helpful, but thanks for your input.

What, apart from Judo, would you suggest then?

[dougguod]

Not very helpful, but thanks for your input.

On the contrary, that's the most helpful advice one can receive when it comes to ninjutsu. If it was too succinct for your liking, use the search function to get more in depth explantions on why ninjers suck.

[lordbd]

On a serious note, if you like Aikido (and that is a separate debate you can also find searching the old forum posts) you probably aren't getting a lot of 1) striking 2) ground-work or 3) full-contact or mostly full-contact sparring. Therefore depending on your preference I think Judo, Muay Thai, Boxing, Wrestling, Kyokushin Karate etc all could fill in the gaps for you. With Ninjutsu or other more esoteric arts that involve lots of forms you'll be getting a similar training experience to what you already get: learning body mechanics through pre-arranged movement.

The best thing to do (or at least what I did) is to take a couple trial classes at some of the gyms available to you and just see what you really like.

On a related note: what flavor of Aikido do you practice? I've only done Iwama type stuff.

[BudoCanuck]

On the contrary, that's the most helpful advice one can receive when it comes to ninjutsu. If it was too succinct for your liking, use the search function to get more in depth explantions on why ninjers suck.

I am an Aikidoka, and I have no wish to be a "Ninja", I'm merely interested in the form and function of the techniques.

I could list in full the martial arts I've looked at and participated in over the last 30 years, but it's a tad pointless.

I take on board that a lot of what is claimed by "Ninja's" is indeed BS, but I have asked a perfectly legitimate question, and stupidly, as it appears expected a sensible and erudite answer.

I could sit here slag off almost all other martial arts, but I won't, because I respect other peoples choices and opinions.

[ashkelon]

Bujinkan has a bad rep for many reasons. This forumis oriented towards practical, "alive", martial arts. Bujinkan is not and will not be encouraged or respected.
You can still have fun with it, but do not expect anything nice. Also, use the search function for the bazillion threads about this. For example the currently active http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?t=116523

[BudoCanuck]

On a serious note, if you like Aikido (and that is a separate debate you can also find searching the old forum posts) you probably aren't getting a lot of 1) striking 2) ground-work or 3) full-contact or mostly full-contact sparring. Therefore depending on your preference I think Judo, Muay Thai, Boxing, Wrestling, Kyokushin Karate etc all could fill in the gaps for you. With Ninjutsu or other more esoteric arts that involve lots of forms you'll be getting a similar training experience to what you already get: learning body mechanics through pre-arranged movement.

The best thing to do (or at least what I did) is to take a couple trial classes at some of the gyms available to you and just see what you really like.

On a related note: what flavor of Aikido do you practice? I've only done Iwama type stuff.

Yoshinkan, primarily but I've studied Iwama as well.

[BudoCanuck]

Bujinkan has a bad rep for many reasons. This forumis oriented towards practical, "alive", martial arts. Bujinkan is not and will not be encouraged or respected.
You can still have fun with it, but do not expect anything nice. Also, use the search function for the bazillion threads about this. For example the currently active http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?t=116523

Duly noted. Perhaps I should have searched more, but I thought that I'd just ask. I won't make the same mistake again.

[BJMills]

No harm in asking. Just don't expect a wealth of positivity for that particular art on this particular forum.

And you really should read through the thread ashkelon linked.

[slamdunc]

Normally, I'd be the first one to crack on a Ninja (if they really existed that is), but since everyone already beat me to it. Welcome to Bullshido.

[dougguod]

I am an Aikidoka, and I have no wish to be a "Ninja", I'm merely interested in the form and function of the techniques.

I didn't say you did wish to be a ninja. However, given that you joined a ninja dojo and acknowledged, I hope facetiously, an interest in the "'secrets' of Ninjutsu" that would be an entirely reasonable inference to make.

As far as your "longstanding interest in Japanese arts" and your desire to learn "the principles and 'secrets' of Ninjutsu", stick with aikido. The "form and function" of the taijutsu's similar and you can get your fill of Japanophile mysticism without your instructor trying to saddle you with the delusion that what you're training has any practical value.

[It is Fake]

I am an Aikidoka, and I have no wish to be a "Ninja", I'm merely interested in the form and function of the techniques.

I could list in full the martial arts I've looked at and participated in over the last 30 years, but it's a tad pointless.

I take on board that a lot of what is claimed by "Ninja's" is indeed BS, but I have asked a perfectly legitimate question, and stupidly, as it appears expected a sensible and erudite answer.

I could sit here slag off almost all other martial arts, but I won't, because I respect other peoples choices and opinions.

See and this is why people say "SEARCH FUNKTION NOOB" on this board. He gave you a nice response, but you tried to put him in his place.

Here is a recent thread that will cover EVERYTHING he wanted you to understand:
http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?t=116523