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More BJJ bullshido - The Gracie Combatives Licensing Programô

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  • Team Python
    replied
    Originally posted by Askari View Post
    Anyone have a list of the 34 techniques?
    I have s student that bought the DVD's and I checked it out. The techniques are called lessons. Some lessons have 4 moves to learn and some have only two.....so in reality there is more than 34 techniques. I think it would take the average person 3 months to learn everything on the dvd's.

    I liked the way they broke down each technique...made is simpler to understand......I wish the dvd's were out when I was a white belt.

    I am not connected to the Gracie Academy in any way and I am currently a 1st degree black belt in BJJ. I don't agree with getting the blue belt with out having to spar on a regular basis but who am I to say anything.
    Last edited by Team Python; 11/04/2010 1:26am, .

    Leave a comment:


  • CrackFox
    replied
    Originally posted by ssgwsmith View Post
    The Gracie Combatives is a "street ready" program not a sport bjj curriculumn. That is the main difference. the program is designed to prepare an individual to defend themselves against a bigger opponent on the street not in a bjj match. if we remember this is where gracie jj came from... it was designed by the grand master as a way for a smaller person to defeat a larger person.....
    Yes, as has been stated plenty of times here before, those are the claims they make.

    In your opinion does the program deliver on these claims? What reasoning do you use to reach your conclusion?

    Leave a comment:


  • slideyfoot
    replied
    It's good to have someone currently in the program sharing their views on the thread. I look forward to hearing what you have to say.

    Originally posted by ssgwsmith View Post
    educate yourselves...
    You might want to read the extensive thread on Gracie Combatives (here), as that alleged distinction between 'sport' and 'self defence' BJJ has been discussed at considerable length.

    There's also the views of several high level BJJers to consider. For example, Renzo Gracie had this to say:

    [...] when people call me, saying "this is the real jiu jitsu," the next thing they are going to say is "I cannot use it, because I could kill you!" [laughs] You know, that's what I heard my whole life, from those fake martial artists who claim they were better than everybody else. So believe it my friend, I live my whole life watching this and seeing this. We were always against that, and now suddenly one branch of my family is turning into that! It's claiming that, but doesn't go on the proving ground to prove it, does not step into the place where he should actually be representing jiu jitsu, to do it. [...]

    The 'pure jiu jitsu', it's doing nothing but selling products on the internet. Again, trying to shove crap in American peoples' mouths. This is just claiming: go and prove it with acts, my friend! The jiu jitsu was good when nobody else knew any jiu jitsu. Now, everybody knows, so now, only those who are really good shine. If you realise Gracie Barra produce more champions than anybody else, go to the world championship and try to fight in there.
    When I asked Romulo Barral about the supposed 'sport'/'self defence' divide, he responded with this:

    My own thoughts on it here.

    Leave a comment:


  • ssgwsmith
    replied
    finally someone gets it... this is the roots of gjj!!

    Leave a comment:


  • ssgwsmith
    replied
    Gracie Combatives

    As I am currently enrolled in this program here is my two cents....

    The Gracie Combatives is a "street ready" program not a sport bjj curriculumn. That is the main difference. the program is designed to prepare an individual to defend themselves against a bigger opponent on the street not in a bjj match. if we remember this is where gracie jj came from... it was designed by the grand master as a way for a smaller person to defeat a larger person.....

    the blue belt is in gracie combatives not bjj and allows an individual to teach up to that level... there is also a master program (purple and up)

    educate yourselves...

    the techniques are available on gracieuniversity.com....

    Leave a comment:


  • chingythingy
    replied
    Royce is spot on.

    Obviously Rener missed the whole point of his grandfather wearing a blue belt for the last few years of his life.

    Leave a comment:


  • TattooDave
    replied
    Attended a Royce Gracie seminar this morning and asked him what he thought about Gracie Combatives and he basically said that the teaching was superb but he didn't like the video promotion part. He said someting along the lines of, "How can you promote someone when you can't feel their technique?" Before this was brought up he had mentioned several times that Jiu Jitsu was NOT a sport, and used the examples of what has happened to Karate and TKD, people manipulating the rules. When asked his thoughts on Jiu Jitsu in the Olympics he said it would be good for popularizing JJ but would ruin it as a martial art. He said the only reason he and his dad fought was to promote JJ but it wasn't intended to be a sport.

    Leave a comment:


  • It is Fake
    replied
    Culled:
    YMAS Cull Gracie Licensing Program: We forgot where we were at - No BS MMA and Martial Arts

    Leave a comment:


  • searcher66071
    replied
    Originally posted by Tenebrous View Post
    So it's on tv now. Gracie combatives during Spike's mma programming. The official ad copy is something like "you can't win in mma without mastering gracie jiujitsu."

    Which is far afield from the official line of the gracie combatives program decrying competition and sport jiujitsu.

    I am guessing this is stemming from Ralek winning against Sakuraba.

    Leave a comment:


  • Tenebrous
    replied
    So it's on tv now. Gracie combatives during Spike's mma programming. The official ad copy is something like "you can't win in mma without mastering gracie jiujitsu."

    Which is far afield from the official line of the gracie combatives program decrying competition and sport jiujitsu.

    Leave a comment:


  • Diesel_tke
    replied
    This is very similar to what happens when you go through the academy. You are taught a few effective techniques and drill them to get good at them. Then you are hopefully better prepared than you were the day you walked in the door. I'm actually very thankful for the Gracie Combatives programs. It has allowed us to have access to better techniques than we were given in the academy.

    Since they started the LEO program a few years ago, the state has added their techniques to the curriculum. We had a certified instructor teach us the combatives program, and it was very well done.

    No belts were given, but that was not why we were there. The knowledge has save lives and prevented injury. That was the point for us. When I went through the program, there was no BJJ within 500 miles. We don't all live in Cali or New York.

    Leave a comment:


  • gonzomalan
    replied
    Originally posted by ps1 View Post
    Not only does Pedro Sauer know of it, he suggests it's a good program. I brought it up in order to get his opinion of it. He told me the course is well thought out and recommends it to anyone interested in working with LEOs or Military.

    That's some high praise coming from a very very well respected source.
    yeah, i'm still surprised, mainly because i've spent so much energy providing a defense for the Gracie Combatives/Gracie University in that thread that i'm surprised to hear someone so high up in the BJJ community supporting the Gracies in Torrance, CA. very nice to hear, though, thanks for sharing that.

    Leave a comment:


  • ps1
    replied
    Originally posted by gonzomalan View Post
    I like this post because it feels more in line with what Gracie University is all about now: spreading the art worldwide. not everywhere has San Diego-like access to bjj, even within the US, and even within the state of California.



    sounds like what i had imagined, i'm a little surprised Prof. Sauer knows of this program.
    Not only does Pedro Sauer know of it, he suggests it's a good program. I brought it up in order to get his opinion of it. He told me the course is well thought out and recommends it to anyone interested in working with LEOs or Military.

    That's some high praise coming from a very very well respected source.

    Leave a comment:


  • gonzomalan
    replied
    now that i've read this thread, i'll provide a few updates, since i've only had one reply to what i wrote in my thread of choice.

    -it's no longer a 2 week "vacation" with no previous experience necessary. all candidates for the program must have earned a blue belt through GracieUniversity.com with a minimum score of 90/100 (passing score is 80). I haven't read anything about someone actually taking the test in person at the Torrance, I would think they would let someone with a (subjectively) very good blue belt test be a candidate. so that list of 36 techniques posted previously coincides with being the exact techniques in the Gracie combatives program.
    -don't believe it's been mentioned yet, but once a person is an instructor, it's not for life


    Q. Once somone becomes gracie jiu jitsu instructor how often does he need to do the re-certification course ?
    stsafi (7/22/2010 9:13 AM)
    A. Every two years, here at the Academy.
    GracieAcademy8
    -
    In the past, an individual could not participate in the ICP unless he/she was already an instructor at an established school of martial arts. Since the launch of GracieUniveristy.com, however, we realized that there are thousands of Gracie Jiu-Jitsu students around the world who have the character, desire, and dedication to become amazing instructors even though they have never taught a martial arts class in their life. As a result, we have decided to open the Gracie Academy Instructor Certification Program to all dedicated practitioners of the art who meet the three basic qualification requirements, so that those who have the passion can help us spread the word. The final goal is to turn dedicated students into amazing instructors so that they can make Gracie Jiu-Jitsu available in their communities with the proven system and the support of the Gracie Academy.
    (source) (emphasis mine)
    and the three reqs seem to defined as 1) Technique Preservation, 2) Discipline, Integrity, and Honor, and 3) Gracie Combatives Mastery. It still bugs that they say "technique preservation" because i believe they mean "philosophy preservation", but that's another point.
    -instructors don't have to wait for a head instructor to pass by for belt evaluations. you might have guessed, students are filmed taking the Blue Belt Qualification Test and upload it to GU.
    -more interested parties can read on here and here.

    Leave a comment:


  • gonzomalan
    replied
    Originally posted by Kung-Fu Joe View Post
    However, I'll also argue that this class has a different purpose than that.

    The Combatives course is not meant to be a replacement for good Jiu-Jitsu training. It's not even designed to be a thorough Jiu-Jitsu course. It seems to me the purpose of the course is solely to introduce a few basic concepts of grappling into other martial programs. I don't think the Combatives course is pretending to do anything besides teaching basic techniques.

    Now, I'm extremely new to BJJ. I've had only four classes, so far, and a little bit of book knowledge before that. Until last night, I did not know the proper technique for attacking a resisting opponent with either a triangle or an armbar from my guard. And yet, while rolling with other guys-- fully resisting opponents-- that have little or no knowledge of Jiu-Jitsu, I've been able to apply armbars, triangles, Kimuras, Americanas, and a host of other techniques that I've only seen in books.

    In my opinion, the Combatives course isn't supposed to even the ground between a Grappler and a non-Grappler. It's supposed to give a non-Grappler a bit of an advantage over another non-Grappler.

    --Joe
    I like this post because it feels more in line with what Gracie University is all about now: spreading the art worldwide. not everywhere has San Diego-like access to bjj, even within the US, and even within the state of California.

    Originally posted by ps1 View Post
    I spoke with Pedro Sauer about this course. He explained to me that the blue belt is not something you get with the course. Rather, the blue belt is a prerequisite for graduation from the course.

    He told me the course is meant to be taught in three parts. It's supposed to be for military & law enforcement types. The first level of the course deals with prevention of takedowns and weapons retention. The second level teaches the ground. The third level is where you spend a minimum (for some people it takes longer, obviously) of 100 hours training BJJ to earn your blue belt.

    There are 10 pages of text and if this has been mentioned, I'm sorry. But I thought it was worth mentioning.
    sounds like what i had imagined, i'm a little surprised Prof. Sauer knows of this program.

    Leave a comment:

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