More BJJ bullshido - The Gracie Combatives Licensing Program™

[Like_A_Boss]

Because the formula doesn't include rolling or competition, and there is no one who knows what they're doing to supervise it.

I train at a Academy where they teach the Gracie combatives to beginners, sure you don’t roll or do competition but that’s only for maybe the first three to four months, once you have gone through the combatives a few times you join the advanced guys and then it's business as usual. Sure I would have liked to roll from day one but at least by the time you get to roll you know a few things.

Now if my instructor was someone who got a blue belt over the net I would not feel the same way, but my instructors are brown belts and have studied BJJ for about 10 years.

So my point is Gracie combatives from a legit instructor, in my opinion is not a bad way to learn BJJ in the beginning, but learning from a guy who got his blue online, I don’t think so.

[CrackFox]

I train at a Academy where they teach the Gracie combatives to beginners, sure you don’t roll or do competition but that’s only for maybe the first three to four months, once you have gone through the combatives a few times you join the advanced guys and then it's business as usual.

This is perfectly fine in my book. I suppose you could argue about how much time to spend doing just drills before you get to rolling, but that's a matter of opinion as far as I'm concerned.

The problem is that this thread started with the following quote:

Attention All Martial Arts Instructors

Become an official Gracie Family Representative

Get Certified to Teach in 2 Weeks

No Previous Grappling Experience

Turn your school into a (image of Gracie Combatives Certified Training Center)

This is total bullshit.

[Like_A_Boss]

This is perfectly fine in my book. I suppose you could argue about how much time to spend doing just drills before you get to rolling, but that's a matter of opinion as far as I'm concerned.

The problem is that this thread started with the following quote:
This is total bullshit.

Agreed

[slideyfoot]

The problem is that this thread started with the following quote

Although that is an old version of the program: it is no longer two weeks. Instead, they now require a 90/100 or greater score on the blue belt test, followed by that 52 lesson online course, five videos and finally a two-day live evaluation.

On balance, that should work out rather longer (I would assume several months of training, to first get the blue belt then to go through the instructor course). On the other hand, this new version has even less physical interaction with qualified instructors than the previous two week incarnation.

I'm assuming Like_A_Boss trains with Gary 'sapateiro' King, who is teaching Gracie Combatives the right way (i.e., also has his team enter competitions, spar etc), judging by King's posts elsewhere. Although I'm sure King learned how to teach through hands-on practice, not online learning followed by a two-day evaluation. I could be wrong, though: would be interesting to hear his thoughts on the new Instructor Certification Program.

[Like_A_Boss]

I'm assuming Like_A_Boss trains with Gary 'sapateiro' King, who is teaching Gracie Combatives the right way (i.e., also has his team enter competitions, spar etc), judging by King's posts elsewhere. Although I'm sure King learned how to teach through hands-on practice, not online learning followed by a two-day evaluation. I could be wrong, though: would be interesting to hear his thoughts on the new Instructor Certification Program.

You are correct sir, though I have been bunking lately. Need to get my ass back on the mats.

[CrackFox]

Whatever the exact technical requirements are, on the ground the only Gracie Combatives place near me is a hapkido school that has zero interaction with any of the local BJJ schools.

[Coach Josh]

Recently we had a seminar with Ryron at our academy. He is a really good instructor and I can tell you it was a great learning experience watching him teach. I have been teaching MA for, sigh, 20 years and I learned and relearned some great things.

Without a shadow of a doubt these guys are great salesman also and I can tell you that the Gracie name carries a lot of weight. So much so that we are considering this program for our academy.

I have always been a fan of the Gracies. Royce is the reason I started Judo. This program has much to offer the experienced instructor but as previously stated I don't think they should give a certification to just anyone who pays the fee.

[Like_A_Boss]

Recently we had a seminar with Ryron at our academy. He is a really good instructor and I can tell you it was a great learning experience watching him teach. I have been teaching MA for, sigh, 20 years and I learned and relearned some great things.

Without a shadow of a doubt these guys are great salesman also and I can tell you that the Gracie name carries a lot of weight. So much so that we are considering this program for our academy.

I have always been a fan of the Gracies. Royce is the reason I started Judo. This program has much to offer the experienced instructor but as previously stated I don't think they should give a certification to just anyone who pays the fee.

Rener is coming down to our academy in April, looking forward to it.

[slideyfoot]

This program has much to offer the experienced instructor

That's a good point: if you already have the teaching skills, so you have a solid understanding of how to relay information successfully to a large group of people, then a well structured Instructor Certification Program could be of real benefit in refining and adding to those skills.

IIRC, there was previously a requirement that you had to already be a martial arts instructor before enrolling, which makes a lot of sense from that perspective. Now, anyone can do it, meaning that they potentially have to learn all those complex and challenging teaching skills from scratch.

[datdamnmachine]

The Gracie Combatives program does contain stuff that most sport BJJ schools don't, how to defend punches.

Yes, and I believe that is a good thing. My instructor will have classes dedicated to self defense such as defenses against punches, weapons, etc. He also will use normal, BJJ/Judo movements and techniques and show you how they are applicable to self defense. It's not down like it's some sort of completely separate martial art.

The thing is, it isn't being advertised as a "supplement" to what you are already doing but as what you "should" be doing instead. I spoke to a guy who is doing the combatives program even though there is a BJJ school 20 minutes away from this person. Eventually, you are going to see guys who are only 10 minutes, or 5 minutes away from quality BJJ training, deciding that they would rather do Gracie Combatives out of the comfort of their home.

I don't care how good the instruction is, nothing beats having that instructor/student interaction as well as having a diverse group of training partners to provide different experiences.

[risingphoenix73]

I don't think anyone is shocked by BJJ bullshido at this point. I've read enough about it. Just wanted to add the latest to the pile which, again is not shocking given what we know about some of the Gracies' marketing and business practices. But, at least it's new.

From the "Gracie Insider" e-mail (don't even remember signing up for it, but ok):


Then some history and horrific hyperbole like this:



What the fuck does that even mean?

Well, there's more craptacular information here.

Lineage is unfortunately going to grow even more and more important in BJJ. Hopefully, we're a few hundred years away from a full on _ing _un lineage war. Because we all know that BJJ was created by a Portugeuse nun who's name means "homely fall" and who had to fight several men to get one to marry her.

damn...don't you just love baseless statistics that can't be proven or disproven? for example i could say 85% of statistics are made up:)

[chingythingy]

Recently we had a seminar with Ryron at our academy. He is a really good instructor and I can tell you it was a great learning experience watching him teach. I have been teaching MA for, sigh, 20 years and I learned and relearned some great things.

I cuaght a Ralek seminar recently and got to play around with him a little. Real legit skills - you can certainly feel that they are above the level of your average BJJ black belt. Those guys may not be winning Mundials lately but they are not too far off that pace, honestly.

[MMAlee]

It seems to be a conversion course which if they choose the candidates well could work, but I agree 2 weeks would be much too short a course to make a good fighter.
Im not sure of the specifics, but if a Olympic wrestler or Judo player studied 8 hours a day for 2 weeks it's not improbable that he could adjust his 34 basic techniques to a reasonable enough level to teach them right?

[Bodyartsguy]

Licensing Fees
Although participation in the ICP requires only a one-time flat fee, all CTCs pay a monthly licensing fee.......

ANYONE have any idea what:
1) the one time flat fee is????????
2) What the CTC monthly fees are??????

[Team Python]

Licensing Fees
Although participation in the ICP requires only a one-time flat fee, all CTCs pay a monthly licensing fee.......

ANYONE have any idea what:
1) the one time flat fee is????????
2) What the CTC monthly fees are??????

I don't think its going to be cheap.......I hear the other Gracie camp bases there monthly affiliation fees on how many students you have....and they want to know everything you do.