Fang Shen Do

[wagamichi]

The tail end of this thread is fucking amazing! What is this shit? Is FSD a church? Do you get excomunicated for leaving? Is your soul damned to hell? If my students want to leave, who cares. If they want something else and can find it over there, good for them. You FSDers need to look at finding a "less-than secret yakuza-martial-art." A dojo is a bussines, just like mcdonalds is a bussines. If you want KFC, go eat chicken. Don't worry about feelings! Pull A Pontious Piolet and wash your hands of it!

[marcdscott]

I moved away from Ottawa ten years and back then Wing Chun Do/FSD was cult, I am glad to see that in the last decade it has entrenched itself into even more cult like behavior.

[Psychedelic]

can somebody post a good picture of this head sifu/guru chap?
I'm curious what this nut case looks like!

[GreenHornet]

go there www.fangshendo.com

[Slug]

Cancelation Fee?

$570 departure fee ?!?!?!?!?! for canceling a contract? for leaving?
What was that all about?

[It is Fake]

Liu Bei,

Chinese and Japanese use the same character set for some things. "Do" is Chinese, same transliteration as the Japanese use for the same character. The character in question when translated from Chinese most often works out as "Heaven's Way," and is usually pronounce as "Tao" today. The pronounciation of the character as "Do" is from an older transliteration method that is not in as much use today. Another example is the capital of China which can be transliterated as Beijing or Peiking, depending on which system you use.

Since Feng Shen Do is somewhat decended from Jeet Kune Do, its not really a bad word choice.

This has been done to death.

Yes, you are partially right. Yet, these arts that use "Do" were created in a time when the cross usage, you are implying, was dead and buried.

See, many of these masters jumped on the Do bandwagon to create this type of discussion.

See, we use an antiquated definition of the word, it shows how old our art really is compared to all others.

[PeterPantsless]

Richard. Please tell us what on earth the $570 departure fee was for.

[Shawarma]

And please tell us that you didn't pay it.

[lubomir]

another ex-FSD member

I am a former FSD member. This discussion, and especially some of the comments by FSD owners, shows that it is high time this school is being exposed in a public forum.
I joined FSD without any previous MA experience; so, I can't compare it to other schools. To me, one of the main issues is the money: FSD operates like a shady car dealership. First you sign your contract, then you gradually find out what it really costs. They are misleading students about the true costs. When you sign up for the black belt club (BBC), you are given a contract which tells you how much it will cost you to get a black belt. The sifu actually decides how many months it will take you and then calculates the cost. Then, come December, they tell you there is an annual admin fee, $97, which was never mentioned in the contract. Then you take the obligatory stick fighting test, only to find out that there is a $75 fee for that. Once you get your green sash, you learn that there are major testing fees ahead.

It is important to know that Jacques Patenaude learned a few tricks from Anthony Robbins, a so-called personal motivator who charges big money "teaching"people how to become rich. That's what he seems to be after. The ones who get really screwed are those who buy his franchises. They are tied to him and won't get out without major losses.

The comments by Pat Marcil about what a great deal they are offering are missing the point: if you have a job, family, other interests, you just won't go to class 5 times a week; hardly anybody does that. So, you end up paying $165 for two hours per week, one third of which is just simple fitness stuff (warm-up, stretching, stations).

The "Inner Circle" is a money-grab and an insult to all BBC members. You thought you are getting the real stuff? No, another $97 per month will get you that!!! Scott Hill, I know you are a decent person: but how are you going to defend this one?

The other issue is JP himself. I should have become suspicious long ago when I read one of his announcements which stated that modifications to the sash-system are a step forward towards FSD's domination oover martial arts in Canada! I never saw him do anything except hand out sashes and give abusive and aggressive pep-talks. He denounced other martial arts as "f...ing shit", told stories about bar fights, boasted that soon he is going to buy himself a chopper and that the great thing about his line of work is that you get to work out and people bow to you. That was when he lost me. He could have been a true role model to all of us, but perhaps he is just a biker with a black belt who learned from Anthony Robbbins how to set up an AmWay-type business and make money ("the Secret of Money Magic" - that's the title of one of his seminars!).

It is too bad. Some of the sifus are really great guys and they could have created something really good.But the big honcho has set up a system that is meant to make him rich. Yes, that is very much like a religious sect or cult. At the Training Camp, he started by having us wash each other's feet as a gesture of humbleness. The irony is: JR hasn't understood his own teaching, because he sure ain't humble. It is all about greed. But, eventually, that 's what is going to bring him down. Too bad. With a bit of humbleness, they could have been "truly" successful.

[PeterPantsless]

Washed each other's feet, huh... Yikes..
Welcome Lubomir. Good post.

I'm hoping more people who are currently in FSD will post, and give us thier thoughts, pro or con.

[Ozzy]

Hello Shawarma & Peterpantsless:

Just to answer your questions I haven't paid the $570 yet, but I'm sure the collections agency will be sent after me as this is what they did to another student who didn't pay. From what I heard though, the courts said that he/she didn't have to pay and the collections agency stopped harrassing them.

The fee doesn't concern me too much though as I have pretty good lawyers on my family side. I'm just waiting to hear them reply again and see what kind of action they're going to take.

As far as what I owe:

$250.00 dollars is for a sash test that they said I didn't have to pay for because when I joined the BBC I recieved a sheet saying that all tests were included. But now since I quit they say I owe them for it. The funny thing is that I never recieved my new sash or the certificate to say I even took the test.

$200.00 dollars is a cancellation fee

and the rest is 10% of what's supposedly remaining on my contract. This makes no sense to me though as I actually have all my receipts which clearly state that I've paid my contract in full. I'm not sure where they're are getting that. Maybe I need to take all my receipts down to them to prove it.

I just hope we don't need to squabble over a few hundered dollars. It really won't break them or me and it'll leave such a sour taste in my mouth of them if it hasn't already done so. I'd rather not spend any more of my time debating it with them, but as I said before, I'll wait and see what their next response is. They know I'm the type of person that would just rather pay it and not have to worry about it anymore as I value my time, but I won't pay for anything that I don't rightfully owe, and I refuse to be bullied. Time will tell, but I'm sure I'll let you know whatever the course of action will be.

[Shawarma]

Pay nothing, if only to keep your self-respect and to set a precedence for other people in your position not paying such bullshit fees.

[Ozzy]

Having said that though I have to say that the money part doesn't bother me as much as sijo's words did. I kind of expected the money thing as they always pull bill out for me to pay, but I didn't expect sijo to speak to me that way. I don't care who you are; you don't treat people that way especially if you really don't know them. (By this I mean the comments - unfulfilled, man of no action, unhappy, afraid to find out what I'm made of etc)

[Das Moose]

[PeterPantsless]

I would guess that those insults stem from, money lost. You were another potential franchise. We have heard on this forum about schools getting taken away from owners, and a serious lack of blackbelts. Losing you is probably much more than losing a good student, they are losing a cash cow.