Fang Shen Do

[Crazy Mount]

Sure. Just bring me an FSD tee-shirt, will ya?

And don't sue me if you fall whilst riding.

Awesome! I have 3 FSD t-shirts. I'll even throw in 2 black muscle shirts, a FSD bag, sweater, and jacket!

[TheDingo]

Awesome! I have 3 FSD t-shirts. I'll even throw in 2 black muscle shirts, a FSD bag, sweater, and jacket!

I can add 3 t-shirts myself (2 regular, one BBC with the black trim on the arms...), I don't see anything wrong with giving to charity. :icon_geek

It's either that or they'll become the I'm working on something greasy/muddy shirts.

It's not like I'm going to wear them in public now that I am no longer a member. Heck I dislike even having a Nike logo on a t-shirt.

[It is Fake]

I have; and truthfully toe to toe the main sifus aren't bad. They're fast and pack a powerful punch. The shit they teach in class is useless even to them because I've never had any of them use a phon sao or any sort of trapping hands on me. They basically practise hard combinations over and over that are relatively effective. They boast being able to flow - meaning if one thing doesn't work then use another. Makes sense right? Not totally, because the minute you go to the ground their flow resorts to bites, eye and nut strikes simply because they don't know how to grapple. This is ok but when you're sparring with them you don't bite or strike them, out of courtesy. Once I was grappling with a sifu and while rolling around on the floor, he in the weaker position motioned to bite. I mean his teeth were on my shoulder but he didn't sink them in. Of course it was enough to make me react and give up my superior position. However, I felt that fuck if I knew our sparring would come to this then I can bite back. I wouldn't have reacted to his bite; instead I would have smashed his face in with my elbow or ripped his ear off with my teeth. Of course I would never do this when grappling with my instructor, but here in lies where they have the advantage. All the students there know that the sifus will go full out. The sifus think a student is measuring them up and should never be able to win. So what happens if you connect with a sifu, well he hits you back with full intensity to knock you out and display that you'll lose. At this point you have a choice: One, is to up your intensity and dish it back which the end result is a full fletched street fight. Or two, which is to take the abuse and shy away or bow down to how mighty and superior they are at fighting. Needless to say, the students usually go with option two. Hell, why would they go with option one. Even if they win a street fight against their sifu, they lose because they then would then have to leave the school and lose all the money they've invested there. The students out of respect always under-rate themselves against the sifus and instead try to beat the other students.


When it comes to sparring you best just ignore the sifus and say that they're too good for you. Or if you want, beat the shit out of them and leave. If you stay you'll get punished later. If you're going to beat them I would recommend taking them to the ground because they really lack skill there. If you stand and strike with them, you will get hit becuase they are decent in that range. Having said that though, a good fighter keeps you in the range he is good at. The sifus can't keep you in that range if you want to go to the ground, and that is their weak point. If you're a talented ground fighter and want to take it to the ground you'll have no problem with the FSD instructors. Hell, I had no ground experience and was able to take and keep them on the ground. Apparently another student with very little BJJ experience took their head instructor down also. Before I conclude I also have to point out that because I've said they are decent strikers doesn't mean they're the best strikers. I'm just saying if you want to stand and strike with them, then you'd better be able to display some good striking skills, otherwise go to the ground.

Yeah but, you do drunken boxing sheesh!!!

[PeterPantsless]

I haven't rolled with any of the original sifus, but I have rolled with some of the Sifu 2.0's. Crazy Mount speaks the truth. Thier ground game is awful. The first time I grappled one, I didn't go full out, for two reasons; I did not know what I was doing, grappling wise, and I didn't want to be disrespectful. We fought to an impasse and then, he told me he could "hold me there all day", if he wanted to. I thought I was holding him! So clearly, he knew as much about grappling as I did.

They are better at stand up. That being said, I would put any instructor I have had since FSD, against them, any day of the week.

Funny story. After training in grappling for a month or so while still training FSD, we did some rolling in class. I was paired with another guy who was a very good grappler. ( having learned it elsewhere of course.) He was schooling me, but I managed to pull guard. The Sifu comes over and starts yelling at him, "Use the eagle claw! There is an eagle claw there! Use it, Use it!! The guy in my guard is passing it pretty good, and clearly does not want to "eagle claw" me. The Sifu keeps yelling, but then turns to "help" another two that almost rolled over him. I look up at my partner, and say, "Don't fucking eagle claw me." He replies, "Like I was going to", and then proceeds to pass my guard and sub me with a keylock.

I should have used an eagle claw. HA!:eusa_danc

[Crazy Mount]

Yeah but, you do drunken boxing sheesh!!!

Ahhhh yes, but I was sober when I took them down. Imagine what I'd do if I was the drunk construction worker going to the bathroom?

[Cdnronin]

I can add 3 t-shirts myself (2 regular, one BBC with the black trim on the arms...), I don't see anything wrong with giving to charity. :icon_geek

It's either that or they'll become the I'm working on something greasy/muddy shirts.

It's not like I'm going to wear them in public now that I am no longer a member. Heck I dislike even having a Nike logo on a t-shirt.

I will generously support any panhandler/squeegie kid I see in a FSD shirt, or anything with the logo. Just being civic minded.

[Crazy Mount]

Oh the mighty eagle claw! I used it once in a real fight actually and was successful with it, although the guy did panic. He really didn't know what to do so I ended up with full mount - one shot and it was over.

[PeterPantsless]

The eagle claw is definately effective, but does it need to be practiced? In grappling?

Anyone can do an eagle claw and anyone can bite. No need to practice.

[Stringfellow]

I know some people have been waiting for it, so I thought that I'd announce the first part of the "exit strategies" is up on the Fang Shen Dont blog. This one's kind of boring - all just legal stuff. Part 2 will deal with the actual leaving part.

[GreenHornet]

about the fang shen dont blog Id like to say that you are doing a great job there stringfellow, and I suggest that any one who is reading this thread go and read it.
http://fangshendont.blogspot.com/

[Askari]

Chopping Wood, Chi Sao and Firewalks

I think this was linked to before but it still has parts that just amaze. Under the title "Chopping Wood, Chi Sao and Firewalks."

[GreenHornet]

what amaze me the most is that this has nothing to do with MA at all...
well Im not that amazed, but I just like to point it out :)

[Doctor X]

Oye.

This thread is a great paradigm for martial arts delusions and exploitation in general.

As for the one wishing to practice FSD, this reminds me of a thread on ANOTHER BOARD [Boo. Hiss.--Ed.] where two sad pathetics spout that they have evidence of sea serpents in SF Bay.

Evidence you ask? What? Like a carcass or film? They have very poor quality video which you can buy--sorry, "obtain" with a fee for shipping, handling and beer of $10--that comes with an "Analysis" performed by creationists. See . . . creationists love challenges to "evilution."

Okay, so how is that relevant?

The thread THERE runs about as long as this one. The issues were handled in one or two pages--do you have real evidence? No? Okay, come back when you do.

So the clowns regurgitate the argument to just argue and feel important. Over and over again.

Thus the situation here: the issue is simple: if you do not wish to heed the warnings of poster who were members of FSD, if you do not wish to heed further evidence, then go and train and come back in six months and let us know.

Yet we have continued argument. We have demands to "know more." We have insults when those familiar with FSD shoot-down the claims. Other than the continued revelations concerning FSD which serve as an object lesson to all, the "back story" is worthless.

Or as a wise man put it. . . .

--J.D.

[Stringfellow]

Oye.

This thread is a great paradigm for martial arts delusions and exploitation in general.

As for the one wishing to practice FSD, this reminds me of a thread on ANOTHER BOARD [Boo. Hiss.--Ed.] where two sad pathetics spout that they have evidence of sea serpents in SF Bay.

Evidence you ask? What? Like a carcass or film? They have very poor quality video which you can buy--sorry, "obtain" with a fee for shipping, handling and beer of $10--that comes with an "Analysis" performed by creationists. See . . . creationists love challenges to "evilution."

Okay, so how is that relevant?

The thread THERE runs about as long as this one. The issues were handled in one or two pages--do you have real evidence? No? Okay, come back when you do.

So the clowns regurgitate the argument to just argue and feel important. Over and over again.

Thus the situation here: the issue is simple: if you do not wish to heed the warnings of poster who were members of FSD, if you do not wish to heed further evidence, then go and train and come back in six months and let us know.

Yet we have continued argument. We have demands to "know more." We have insults when those familiar with FSD shoot-down the claims. Other than the continued revelations concerning FSD which serve as an object lesson to all, the "back story" is worthless.

Or as a wise man put it. . . .

--J.D.

Well, this thread has been different things at different times. It started with a simple query, became a 2-bit expose with my article, then became a real expose as a good number of other former students backed it up, then turned into a verbal brawl as the FSD faithful rushed to its defence, and from there has at various times been a comedy, a rant, and a flame-war. I would argue that throughout all of this, however, it has always been informative and a benefit.

We're always unearthing new information that sheds new and additional light on the Patenaudes and how they conduct their business. Quite honestly, even when I wrote my article I had no idea of the breadth of their activities and I'm thankful to those that have stepped up with their stories. I think one thing that a lot of people don't realize is that it's not just saying "this school sucks". These people have quite a grip on the majority of their students. I've privately been given information by a number of people who have asked me not to share it because they're worried about the Patenaude's tracking them down. That's not reasonable. And while it may seem that we've "tapped out" this vein, I can tell you that there is still much of the story to be told.

I think the biggest value of this thread now is that it's showing these people that the Patenaude's aren't the gods that they thought they were. They're not some elite super-deadly group of martial artists - in fact they're not even very good martial artists. They're just a bunch of people who act tough and are aiming to sell as much snake-oil as they can sell before the jig is up. It is my sincere hope that those that so far have been quiet out of fear will stand up and tell their stories, and that with each additional one it will encourage the next person to tell theirs. No one needs to fear these people.

[Stringfellow]

about the fang shen dont blog Id like to say that you are doing a great job there stringfellow, and I suggest that any one who is reading this thread go and read it.
http://fangshendont.blogspot.com/

Thanks, GH. I created it mostly as an adjunct to this thread - a place where I can put things that either don't really belong or are useful enough to have their own place. That said, I do encourage link and comments (yes, I am a whore).