Fang Shen Do

[Stringfellow]

Dear stringfellow,

Do you really think this will affect the school? As I read the pages on these threads all that I see is a few people keeping it alive. I think there is about 10 in there that just want to pump up the numbers and I have read some pretty silly stuff on here. I still speak to some of the instructors at the school and with over 2000 students I don't that 10 unhappy boys is that bad. As for your training at the school well martial arts is not for everyone and I really think that you should retire and I really hope you are getting better because you will need it very soon.

There are far more people reading this thread than are participating in it (net-savvy people call it "lurking"). As I write this there have been over 18,000 hits on this thread - somehow I don't think that there are 10 unhappy boys out there hitting "refresh" over and over again. I have personally spoken with a number of people who are following this thread with interest, but refrain from posting themselves. They each have their own reasons for not doing so and that's perfectly acceptable.

Remember, I'm not trying to convince anyone to quit Fang Shen Do - I just want them to be aware of what they're getting into. The fact that there are students that are leaving the schools tells me that they already had their doubts - they just needed to know that they weren't the only ones. Potential new students that take the time to Google for Fang Shen Do will also have an opportunity to make up their own minds, as both the offical site and the Bullshido article appear one after the other on Google's first page of hits for Fang Shen Do. Most telling however is the silence that has answered my rather straightforward questions about Fang Shen Do - it is deafening and speaks more loudly than any other response could.

[TKD Black Belt]

Am I to assume that it is the term Fang Shen Do that creates the google hit? If so I appologize for ever shortening Fang Shen Do to FSD as Fang Shen Do should be given the correct amount of respect garnered by all martial arts, Fang Shen Do not excluded.

TKD

[Askari]

TKD, well, some people do miss-spell it as Feng Shen Do when conducting their searches. They should know that the proper spelling is Fang Shen Do. Of course the founder originally called it Jacques Patenaude Kung-fu.

Of course links to the original thread also really help in finding all the necessary information.

[TKD Black Belt]

http://www.bullshido.net/modules.php...article&id=224

Like this?

[Cdnronin]

So, if the article on JACQUES PATENAUDE FANG SHEN DO is #2 on Google hits due to the over 7500 hits on it, what would happen if the name of this thread was changed to, oh I don't know, something like JACQUE PATENAUDE FANG SHEN DO?
I mean, if this thread has over 18,000 hits of people looking for information on JACQUES PATENAUDE FANG SHEN DO, what would that do for the Google rankings?
Something to consider.

[Askari]

New Information List

So in the last two days we have had some new information surface.

1) An anecdotal comment that one of the Fang Shen Do instructors (Pat Marcell) was beating up on a drunk construction worker when the construction workers friends came in to help, Marcell ran away.

2) A very detailed question about Jacques Patenaude having been convicted of assault and/or spent time incarcerated for it, while he has been a FSD/WCD teacher.

3) A Fang Shen Do Instructor posing as Dictionary-69 posted the following threat to Stringfellow:

Dic 69 wrote:
As for your training at the school well martial arts is not for everyone and I really think that you should retire and I really hope you are getting better because you will need it very soon.

We have also detailed the midnight training and the google victory of Bullshido as well.

The three above points unveiled very recently are very telling as they show a culture of violence and abuse. Criminality and a desire to cover up the cult aspects of their so called Martial Art.

If anyone has greater detail, even the year that Jacques Patenaude was convicted or charged, we can continue the investigation.

[BoardHitBack]

I've just spent a real long time reading thru this entire thread and I'm horrified at those members/sifu of FSD's attempts to justify the quality of their system with bs, unsubstantiated assertions and general shit slinging towards those critical of their misguided beliefs.

Let's recap- no evidence for their MMA competitive claims, no qualifications for SIJO JP posted, and no answers to why there is such a disparity between acquired skill and time and money spent in training (according to those sources who changed to other methods). Explanations for the treatment of those leaving the flock or diverging from the party line have not been given. Insults and accusations have been thrown but a reasonable defence has not been forthcoming. I doubt FSD reps will ever show up in TKD_BB's neck of the woods...as much I as hope they do.

Dear stringfellow....
As for your training at the school well martial arts is not for everyone and I really think that you should retire and I really hope you are getting better because you will need it very soon.

The differrence between the kind of person dic(k)69 is and the kind stringfellow is that stringfelllow didn't dignify that pathetic attempt at intidimation with a response in kind. Hejust ignored that weak-ass shit. stringfellow- good (sm)article, made even better by the reaction it has provoked. Have you considered posting it to other media, local papers, Canadian MA magazines etc.?

As for dic(k)69- your first post on this thread came across as a screaming rant from an aggressive, abusive fucknut with serious delusions- something your posts all have in common. As it is widely reported by former students SIJO JP often comes across as an aggressive, abusive fucknut with serious delusions - perhaps we have been graced with the presence of the great holy and powerful SIJO. The only thing that would amaze me if that were true is that I haven't been slapped with 100 dollar bill for the *privilege*. Fuck you very much, good night. :thebirdma

[TKD Black Belt]

The sarcasm is strong with BoardHitBack do you suppose he's ready for advancement into the higher levels of Sarcastic-Fu?

TKD

[BoardHitBack]

Only to the first demi-stripe of the first stripe of the first ranking of the lower-higher ranking of Sarcastic-Fu to be sure........now who do I make the blank cheque out to?

[Askari]

Me too, Me too, Do they give out 10th dans?

Or do I have to buy mine from the same place that Jacques Patinaude bought his?
USMAA

He's about 1/3rd of the way down

Fang Shen Do:
Jacques Patenaude, 10th Degree, Soke and Founder

Cost was about $50 for the rank.....

[TKD Black Belt]

Hey Askari, what if say there was a fighter with a 1-0 record, no BJJ rank (which would be fair) and maybe some TKD experience. Do you think FSD would consider him a fair candidate for a sparring session?

I think I could scrape together the pennies for a trip out to Ottawa for 'a month's free lessons'. You want to video tape?

TKD

[nvrBit]

There are far more people reading this thread than are participating in it (net-savvy people call it "lurking").

As a 'lurker' I would like to say I very much appreciate this article and thread.

Maybe it is getting so many hits on Google because FSD just papered the Ottawa area with flyers offering 'One Month Free' with 'no strings attached'. The same offer is on their web site.

Before taking them up on this great sounding offer (though I am not so naive to think it really had no strings... i.e. would eventually come with a hard-sell) I seached for "Fang Shen Do".

Alarm Bell #1
I was disturbed that the results and especially the first few hits made it instantly clear that FSD was a 'made-up' form of MA offered at these local studios only. There wasn't a variety of hits and information from around the world as you would get if you searched for something like 'Wing Chun' for example.

Alarm Bell #2
The only 'independent' source for information (hit #4) was in an MA forum at bullshido.net.

Alarm Bell #3
Your well written article and the response it received. The most damning responses and comments came from within the FSB organization itself.


I was neither familar with MA nor Bullshido when I searched for FSD but read through the various threads in great detail.

After reading your first article I was convinced not to follow through and try the 30-day Free offer.

But it was the responses from current students, instructors and one of the founder's sons that convinced me that what you wrote was for the most part true and reassured me that staying far way is the best decision.


Just one of many thankful 'lurkers'

[schadenfreude]

As a 'lurker' I would like to say I very much appreciate this article and thread.

Maybe it is getting so many hits on Google because FSD just papered the Ottawa area with flyers offering 'One Month Free' with 'no strings attached'. The same offer is on their web site.

Before taking them up on this great sounding offer (though I am not so naive to think it really had no strings... i.e. would eventually come with a hard-sell) I seached for "Fang Shen Do".

Alarm Bell #1
I was disturbed that the results and especially the first few hits made it instantly clear that FSD was a 'made-up' form of MA offered at these local studios only. There wasn't a variety of hits and information from around the world as you would get if you searched for something like 'Wing Chun' for example.

Alarm Bell #2
The only 'independent' source for information (hit #4) was in an MA forum at bullshido.net.

Alarm Bell #3
Your well written article and the response it received. The most damning responses and comments came from within the FSB organization itself.


I was neither familar with MA nor Bullshido when I searched for FSD but read through the various threads in great detail.

After reading your first article I was convinced not to follow through and try the 30-day Free offer.

But it was the responses from current students, instructors and one of the founder's sons that convinced me that what you wrote was for the most part true and reassured me that staying far way is the best decision.


Just one of many thankful 'lurkers'

Lost another loan to ditech. :)

Good luck on your search.

[Stringfellow]

As a 'lurker' I would like to say I very much appreciate this article and thread.

Maybe it is getting so many hits on Google because FSD just papered the Ottawa area with flyers offering 'One Month Free' with 'no strings attached'. The same offer is on their web site.

Before taking them up on this great sounding offer (though I am not so naive to think it really had no strings... i.e. would eventually come with a hard-sell) I seached for "Fang Shen Do".

Alarm Bell #1
I was disturbed that the results and especially the first few hits made it instantly clear that FSD was a 'made-up' form of MA offered at these local studios only. There wasn't a variety of hits and information from around the world as you would get if you searched for something like 'Wing Chun' for example.

Alarm Bell #2
The only 'independent' source for information (hit #4) was in an MA forum at bullshido.net.

Alarm Bell #3
Your well written article and the response it received. The most damning responses and comments came from within the FSB organization itself.


I was neither familar with MA nor Bullshido when I searched for FSD but read through the various threads in great detail.

After reading your first article I was convinced not to follow through and try the 30-day Free offer.

But it was the responses from current students, instructors and one of the founder's sons that convinced me that what you wrote was for the most part true and reassured me that staying far way is the best decision.


Just one of many thankful 'lurkers'

Wow. With that post, nvrBit, you've make all of the toil and struggle of writing that article (and make no mistake, it was not an easy one to write) worthwhile. Thank you.

While the absolute best outcome that I could have hoped for from the Article is that the Patenaudes actually listen and take the necessary action to "fix" Fang Shen Do, their responses (as you read) make it pretty clear that it is not going to happen. Given that, seeing someone like you whose interest was piqued by their slick marketing (and make no mistake - they are quite good at marketing) take the time and effort to do a little research and discover the truth before it's too late is the best that I could really hope for. Congratulations.

As for what you may eventually take up as a martial art and which school you'll choose to attend, I'm sure that you'll find plenty of advice here - all you need to do is ask.

[Stringfellow]

stringfellow- good (sm)article, made even better by the reaction it has provoked. Have you considered posting it to other media, local papers, Canadian MA magazines etc.?

Thanks! As for posting elsewhere, I haven't really thought of it. I'm certainly not opposed to it, so long as Bullshido.net gets proper credit and have no problems with it either. If you know such people, feel free to contact them about it. Hell, I'd love to see it plastered up on poles near any FSD school for all of the students to see, especially the "junior" ones that haven't yet signed up for the BBC. I suspect that the vast majority of them don't know about the article - the schools are pretty good at controlling information and if you're drinking the kool-aid you wouldn't want to spread the word yourself.

Speaking of which, if you happen to be a relatively new student and are reading this, please post with your thoughts. No names or specific schools need be mentioned. I'm curious to get a junior's perspective, since most of the people that I've heard from have been in for at least a year.