Fang Shen Do

[It is Fake]

I am a student of FSD, but like stringfellow, I got relly upset at the new program: "Learn the family secrets". When I joined the BBC, many moons ago, I was assured preferentila treatment and they would teach me what wasn't taught to ordinary students.

See, this is the highest form of Bullshido and McDojo. Now, everyone learns at different levels you should never pay extra for faster progression. BBC is a money making scheme.

This is classic Mcdojo.

Family Secrets+Secret Training= Mega-Bullshido. Holding back techniques from "ordinary" students is Bullshido. Assured preferential treatment is Bullshido. Family Secret Techniques is Bullshido.

[Stringfellow]

I mentioned in my article that I thought that if word got out about Fang Shen Do that there might be a bit of an exodus from the school. Well, I've been holding off on this for awhile in case it happened to be a few coincidences, but now I believe that it's genuinely happening, so I'm posting.

I've received messages from a number of people from different FSD schools letting me know that they've left as well. Overwhelmingly they cited the constant demands for more money, the "cultishness" of the organization, and the fact that didn't feel that they were learning anything as the biggest factors. While they come from all different sash ranks, most have been around for at least a year, which bears out my observations about how it creeps up on you over time. The other comment that I got from many was how they wondered if they were the only one or if they were perhaps imagining things, and how my article let them know that they weren't an isolated case.

What's funny, in a sad sort of way, is that these (former) students had so little trust in the school that most of them crafted careful excuses to leave. I have to imagine that as a result, whenever a student quits from now on, the instructors can't help but wonder if it's for the reason the student gives, or it's because they read the article. From what I'm hearing, there is a lot of distrust out there amongst the students, and it's going to take more than a few "we're here for you - talk to us" speeches from the instructors to rectify that. Many have commented on how there has been zero response to the legitimate list of questions that I posted earlier in this thread. Not to put too fine a point on it, but most of the students are quite simply afraid to ask any "controversial" questions themselves. Given the sort of response that's been demonstrated so far, they have good reason.

Oh, and in case you want to read it, here's a link to the article.

[TKD Black Belt]

Stringfellow,

Maybe, ala Ashida Kim, you'll start receiving threatening scrolls. What baffles me, and always has, is that it is so easy to step up and qwell any questions about quality through competition. If you're in the Ottawa area perhaps you can look into a legit instructor, one who teaches out of love not profit.

TKD

"Fighting really is only three steps, find him, hit him, repeat till desired result achieved."

[Stringfellow]

If you're in the Ottawa area perhaps you can look into a legit instructor, one who teaches out of love not profit.

I've already hooked up with a new group and let me say, it's like night and day. No egos, no intimidation, no secrets, no forms - just instruction and sparring.

[Stringfellow]

Anyone else wonder where dictionary69 is? Anyone else think that dictionary69 is an instructor posing as student? Just wondering, because to date I haven't seen a single "real" student post anything positive about Fang Shen Do, and dictionary69 hasn't answered my question about why he/she is an ex-student.

[PeterPantsless]

Yeah, I assumed he was an instructor. I did enjoy how he said FSD instructors can grapple, and there was plenty of grappling in the FSD system, and then made grappling=gay comments in the next sentence.

"I guess you like rolling on the ground with guys too much sweety."

Bravo.
This must be the Fang Shen Do mental range.

[Slug]

too much

I have been in touch with the ex. Wing chun do, modern wing chun, pre fsd person I met at a inosanto seminar. I dropped him an email out of morbid curiosity since I could not believe what I read so far about these people/clan/cult... He didn't get into too much detail, but said he had enough when he was called into a 'special mandatory? seminar' by the schools instructor and that the Sijo himself was going to make an appearance.

Thinking this had anything to do with actual martial arts he atteneded.

The seminar was about signing up and dropping money on some pyramid scheme to sell vitamins and/or supplements...

aint that a kick? :)


Slug

[TKD Black Belt]

Hmm, I tried to find out about FSD at the International Wing Chun Forum and was quickly banned for suggesting that a week's worth of BJJ would be sufficiently equal to a few years of WC. I was only going off of what they said about their own sport.

TKD

[dictionary69]

Dear stringfellow,

Have you lost your mind my friend? You have made claims of cult and many other things but the fact of the matter is that you were a student for about 4 years!! What happened in that time ,nothing good is what your saying but you stayed for 4 years?? I was a student for a few years aswell but I was happy about my training and opposite to you well i asked questions that were on my mind about combat and got the answers from the instructor without hesitation and plenty of one on one training in grappling and sparring and didn't have to pay for these services I guess you were just not up front enough with the instructor that you trained with and that makes you kind of stupid if you ask me for not getting your moneys worth. The reason I quite was that I gained all the confidence and skill that I wanted and could gain and then I saw that I could not go beyond the goals that Iset for myself and that is the only reason I quit. My experience there was a great one because I used the ressources at the school and you could have done the same easily in the 4 years that you were there. You can say all you want about them but the fact of the matter is that you trained for 4 years and then you make all these claims about this and that and you even try to discredit the top instructor wow you really are an asshole and I hope it comes around to you. You sound like a angry little boy that got is toy stolen from him, man get over it!!! I have trained in the same classes with you and well you were the most robotic guy in there and you were training for 4 years and still you were as stiff as a board. The only person you have to blame is you for not using the ressources you had at your fingertips. Well if you have other questions for me well shoot away,

[Lohff]

You sound like a angry little boy that got is toy stolen from him

And you sound like an advertisement for FSD. Can you actually provide some content about what's good in it rather than personal attacks? Notice the other former students saying the same things he's saying? So who's wrong?

And saying that you were in the same classes, and he just didn't get it might be acceptable if he were the only one bitching about the school. He's not.But there is no way YOU could be wrong, is there?

[TKD Black Belt]

dict69:

1.) Why'd you quit? Sounds as though you would have been happy to continue on in FSD.

2.) Would you not be saying that stringfellow had not been there long enough to form an opinion of any quality if his time was say 2 years?

3.) Is it not possible that someone can be involved in an art or style to the exclusion of other styles?

4.) Did you read the whole article? It pretty much answers a large number of questions that you've raised.

5.) In what style are you training in currently? Where did your FSD training lead you?

TKD

[Askari]

Dic-69 wrote:
... then I saw that I could not go beyond the goals that I set for myself and that is the only reason I quit.

This part of your post makes sense to me, in effect you are clearly stating that Fang Shen Do can not help you to achieve the goal of combat effectiveness. So you are agreeing with the other posters who have criticized this cult.

However in one of your posts you stated you "used to be an instructor at the school" what Martial Art are you training now?

Just in case you haven't read it here is a link to the article:Link to Article by Stringfellow

Nice screen name by the way. :happy10: Were you there for the now infamous dog poo sniffing incident? Did you smile after smelling it and look enraptured?

[It is Fake]

Dear stringfellow,

Have you lost your mind my friend? You have made claims of cult and many other things but the fact of the matter is that you were a student for about 4 years!! What happened in that time ,nothing good is what your saying but you stayed for 4 years?? I was a student for a few years aswell but I was happy about my training and opposite to you well i asked questions that were on my mind about combat and got the answers from the instructor without hesitation and plenty of one on one training in grappling and sparring and didn't have to pay for these services I guess you were just not up front enough with the instructor that you trained with and that makes you kind of stupid if you ask me for not getting your moneys worth. The reason I quite was that I gained all the confidence and skill that I wanted and could gain and then I saw that I could not go beyond the goals that Iset for myself and that is the only reason I quit. My experience there was a great one because I used the ressources at the school and you could have done the same easily in the 4 years that you were there. You can say all you want about them but the fact of the matter is that you trained for 4 years and then you make all these claims about this and that and you even try to discredit the top instructor wow you really are an asshole and I hope it comes around to you. You sound like a angry little boy that got is toy stolen from him, man get over it!!! I have trained in the same classes with you and well you were the most robotic guy in there and you were training for 4 years and still you were as stiff as a board. The only person you have to blame is you for not using the ressources you had at your fingertips. Well if you have other questions for me well shoot away,

You thinking that you got everything in 2 years is fine, arrogant but, fine.

1)Instructors get very good at knowing who to approach.
2)Instructors know the difference between a long term and short term student.
3)Instructors now how to keep secrets.
4)Instructors know who and when to divulge secrets.

Apparently in your race to be the best you overlooked many problems.

Read your post you are cursing and yelling like a child.

[Krackie]

To any of the Patenaudes, especially Jacques. Has Jacques Patenaude ever been convicted of assault and/or spent time incarcerated for it, while he has been a FSD/WCD teacher?

[GreenHornet]

I have been in Fang Shen Do for 5 years... yet I quit for the reasons stated by most of the other FSD ex-members.
the school is not all bad, but you got to understand there are too many problems that need to be solved and too many question that are staying unanswered.

I ve been doing kickboxing and BJJ for 4 months now and I really a difference in my fighting abilities: i.e.: I had a hard time to "get in" when sparring and I must admit that I was a little glove shy... now I dont care anymore and I start to come back for more.

you thats the difference between me and you dic69.. I can clearly say what in the field of MA my MMA classes are giving me. you on the other side are telling us about nonsense about self developpement...
its fine if its what you are looking for, but Im looking for MARTIAL arts, which is what Patenaude's Kung-fu states will give you primarly, but doesnt seem to deliver...