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Fairly good example of what wing chun looks like

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    #76
    Originally posted by lightninghands
    why bother going there?

    if he expands, i contract.. if he contracts i expand, i dont hit, it hits all by it self.
    thats identical to the the wing chun saying. loy lau hoi sung, lut sao jik chun

    which means force comes, redirect, force retreats, follow, force detaches, strike.
    See, I have issues with this. Because it's not what happens. It's more like force comes, clinch. All this "redirects, retreats, follow, detaches" is a highly unlikely scenario.

    Originally posted by lightninghands
    all fighitng styles do this in one way or another, wing chun just formally named it. just as all arts acknowledge centerline, but wing chun put heavy emphasis on it.
    i believe it teaches very good principles of fighting in general.
    See, but to be effective you HAVE TO BE READY to sacrifice your centerline to gain position and leverage. Otherwise you end up doing deerboxing.

    Tomas

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      #77
      Originally posted by lightninghands
      i believe (WC) teaches very good principles of fighting in general.
      Which to date have not been employed in an actual fight in the presence of a video camera.

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        #78
        Originally posted by Dr._Tzun_Tzu
        If these chain punches don't hurt, volunter to stand there and take some :)
        Heheh... I'll volunteer to take 10 of your chainpunches, if you volunteer to take a single right cross. I guarantee you'll be knocked out before I am. :icon_tong

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          #79
          While were going there.....WT teaches beginners to start with Chain punching as it is a very quick way to get some self D. Walk into them with chain punches.

          Then add kick and the tan, pak, bong and chi sau into the training ....Eventually the goal is to use Chi sau like moves to set up a good solid hit, "To win with a single blow" is the the old saying...

          So you see alot of beginners and others using Chain punches in the air on the way to target like a shield

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            #80
            you all give me diarrhea. :fart:

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              #81
              Mothman, Did I say right cross was not an effective punch?

              Do we go at the same time or do I go first? Are the torsos and legs invovlved or is it strictly the arms?(Well my arms and your arm) Whats the target?

              I am not volunteering for shit, but some people seem to think the chain punches don't hurt or work....ask Silva if Vitors chain of punches didn't hurt.

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                #82
                Originally posted by Dr._Tzun_Tzu
                Mothman, Did I say right cross was not an effective punch?

                Do we go at the same time or do I go first? Are the torsos and legs invovlved or is it strictly the arms?(Well my arms and your arm) Whats the target?

                I am not volunteering for shit, but some people seem to think the chain punches don't hurt or work....ask Silva if Vitors chain of punches didn't hurt.
                Vitor didn't employ chain punches, you fucking idiot. You people are really fucking pathetic if you have to turn to a BJJ blackbelt and boxer for the only supposed evidence of wing chun, which he never studied, working in a real fight.

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                  #83
                  Originally posted by drummerboy
                  Grond: sprawl is maybe not the best example of positional dominance, at least not in the sense BJJ teaches it. Positional dominance means that your primary goal is to attain a dominant position BEFORE you apply submission. If you watch the anti-grappling vids, what people do: they punch and eyepoke while being mounted, they try to apply submissions from and punch from inside the guard. They launch attacks without gaining positional dominance first.

                  Positional dominance in judo means that before you attempt a throw, you have to establish a dominant grip. If you work with good players you see that once they get the grip, it's over.

                  Positional dominance in striking arts is tough, that's why it's mostly trading punches. The range is too volatile, so even if you are able to gain dominant position for a moment, you are not likely to keep it.
                  (without taking anything away from striking arts, that's just the nature of the beast)

                  Tomas

                  Let me clarify my use of the phrase positional dominance. I wasn't aware of the specific defenitions you're using but I think they fall under the one I was thinking of, that certain positions of your body relative to your opponent allow for greater control of their body and easier access to do damage to them.

                  Its probably true that positional dominance is harder to achieve in striking, because both players don't necessarily want to stay at the same range as in judo or bjj, but positional dominance is still just as important.

                  Some examples: Using footwork to get around or to the side of your opponent, so that they can't defend themselves as well, or using footwork to sweep them or compromise their balance, with the same result. In boxing, manuevering them into a position where your strikes have a better chance of connecting, or where you can trap their hands although this is pretty hard to pull off.


                  Which anti-grappling vids are you talking about dude?

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                    #84
                    Originally posted by Dr._Tzun_Tzu
                    Mothman, Did I say right cross was not an effective punch?

                    Do we go at the same time or do I go first? Are the torsos and legs invovlved or is it strictly the arms?(Well my arms and your arm) Whats the target?

                    I am not volunteering for shit, but some people seem to think the chain punches don't hurt or work....ask Silva if Vitors chain of punches didn't hurt.
                    It's really sad that you have to highjack Vitor Belforts boxing for your wicked purposes.

                    Tomas

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                      #85
                      Originally posted by grond
                      Which anti-grappling vids are you talking about dude?
                      For example the one at the beginning of this thread. Look at the mount escape.

                      Tomas

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                        #86
                        So he didn't use rapid puches one after another?

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                          #87
                          Originally posted by drummerboy
                          For example the one at the beginning of this thread. Look at the mount escape.

                          Tomas
                          Oh, that stuff. I thought most(not all) of that video was a bit silly, the groundwork no exception.

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                            #88
                            Originally posted by Dr._Tzun_Tzu
                            So he didn't use rapid puches one after another?
                            That does not mean they where WC style "chain" punches.

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                              #89
                              Originally posted by Dr._Tzun_Tzu
                              So he didn't use rapid puches one after another?
                              Where did you ever see anyone say that, and I quote, rapid punches one after the other don't work?

                              What Vitor used to win that fight was boxing modified for MMA. If you watch his body mechanics, you will see him throwing jabs and crosses, where the jabs are used to reset while the crosses diliver the power shots. It look NOTHING like a chain punch in the WC/WT/VT/VC/whatever sense of the word. Nothing.

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                                #90
                                Heheh... ditto what Hapko said...

                                I throw flurries of straight punches all the time... does that make me a Wing Chunner?

                                When do I get my membership card? :laughing6

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