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What's this about Krav Maga?

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    What's this about Krav Maga?

    I was using the heavy bag tonight at my uni gym, and I see there's a guy there with 4 oz MMA style gloves hitting the bag. Not bad, a little wild and lacking in technique, but he isn't bad at all. After I work the bag a bit he walks over and asks where I train, I told him straight blast gym. I asked where he trained, he told me that he trains at a Krav Maga school nearby. I was curious about krav maga, since I've heard a lot about it (mostly bad) but have never really seen a class or anything. He said it was 40$ a month and close by, so I was kind of interested in checking it out as a place to train. I go back to punching, and wanders by my bag again and starts talking about krav maga again. I likened SBG earlier to Team Quest though not as "focused" and now he was saying that randy couture, chuck lidel, and both shamrock brothers standup games were entirely krav maga. He said that the shamrocks even had their own krav maga schools as well. Now I was like WTF, that doesn't sound right at all. I didn't say anything though, I just smiled and said "oh I didn't know that."

    So now I don't know if I should check out this school or what, since it sounds like they enjoy stuffing their students chock full of lying goodness. But as I said, I don't know anything about krav maga really, so it might be worth checking out.
    Tough is not how you act, tough is how you train.

    #2
    I wouldn't attribute that comment to his school just yet. Some people make up these fantasies all on their own.

    Krav Maga is so different from place to place. I don't think any one organization has a copyright on the name so a lot of people are exploiting it. I think you can get certified in KM just by going to a seminar these days. I've even seen hybrid places that teach Kung Fu/Krav Maga and stuff like that. WTF? I think a lot of people are using it as a marketing tool since it was featured in that terrible J. Lo movie.

    I have a friend that takes KM in nYc and the stuff he's shown is pretty good. I've watched a class and they have it organized where lower belts do the very basics with no contact but once you reach orange or so sparring is introduced and they do it all the time. HARD. They do it this way, the instructor explained, so as not to scare the new people away.

    What I didn't like about it is the mentality. They talk self-defense and taken people out and really have a military mind set. (Kill or be Killed.) I think that was unhealthy.

    Go check it out and write a review! That'll be interesting.

    ----

    You at the SBG where Matt is? I'm jealous. Matt's got a seminar in nYc this weekend that I'm headed to! Can't wait.

    Comment


      #3
      Yeah Krav Maga is the Israeli form of military self defense, from what I've heard. Basically since it's for the military and special forces, it's highly based on vital points, and killing your opponent. I don't know much about the marketed KM though.

      Comment


        #4
        Killing your opponent... With what? Your bare hands? If it's for the military, why don't they spend more time learning to kill their opponent with guns? This sort of thinking really irks me.

        I highly doubt Krav Maga knows of a better way to kill an opponent than with some sort of choke hold. I know Krav Maga is mainly striking based, so the concept that it teaches how to kill an opponent sounds very fishy to me. It can be difficult to beat someone to death with a baseball bat, let alone your bare hands. Then, if you throw into the equation the fact that your opponent will likely be bigger than you, it becomes even more difficult to kill him with strikes.

        Bottom line: Any martial art that professes to teach it's students efficient ways to kill people with their bare hands, other than with a choke hold, is most likely BULLSHIDO!

        Comment


          #5
          This question is for KM practitioners (or anyone who knows about KM)

          What are the principles behind your art? If you don't have "principles", then is your art merely a collection of responses, ie if A does this then you do this, etc. If this is the case then would the difference between good and bad KM (quality of the individual's movements aside) simply a matter of how many different techniques/responses you can remember? Is there something unique that when I see a guy fight using KM that I will automatically go "That guy used KM techniques/principles"? Or would it look just like anything else? If it's just like anything else....then what's different about KM then?

          Thanks.

          Comment


            #6
            There's a couple of different international organizations.

            The one which was begun by Imi Sde-Or, and his student Darren R. Levine can be found at www.kravmaga.com - the Israeli Krav Maga Association. Darren Levine is one of two holders of the "Founders Diploma of Excellence", along with Eyal Yanilov, who currently runs the International Krav Maga Association (www.krav-maga.com), which mostly handles the training in Israel proper.

            I currently train Krav Maga with Sifu's who have modified the curriculum with Brazilian Jiu Jitsu. Most of what we learn are counters to every day situations. A woman tells off a guy, walks away, he grabs her wrist; you're putting your wallet back in your pocket when a guy grabs your wrist; you punch out a guy, and his big buddy bear hugs you from behind and lifts you off the ground; same situation, but his buddy came from the side and now has you in a headlock.


            There are 3 versions of it: Military, municipal (police and such), and civilian, given the different needs of each category for defense and risks of specific hazards.

            As for it being based on "killing your opponent", that's not entirely accurate. It's about coming out of any situation alive and as unharmed as possible. One technique for dealing with a knife assailant is blinding him with a fire extinguisher, then running like hell. We've been told over and over again that if you're wearing good shoes and you have no one else to defend, the best way to survive an assailant with a knife is to stun or distract them and run like hell while yelling for help.

            It's practical self-defense.

            Comment


              #7
              As for understanding the principles of the art, I recommend heading over to a large bookstore and browse this book:

              http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...books&n=507846

              Krav Maga: How to Defend Yourself Against Armed Assault
              by Imi Sde-Or, Eyal Yanilov

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by Strat_Tones
                Killing your opponent... With what? Your bare hands? If it's for the military, why don't they spend more time learning to kill their opponent with guns? This sort of thinking really irks me.

                You can learn to use firearms through Krav. You don't learn to do that with your bare hands. How silly. Although the place I did Krav could use a major overhaul it was not like that.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by jaychiu
                  What I didn't like about it is the mentality. They talk self-defense and taken people out and really have a military mind set. (Kill or be Killed.) I think that was unhealthy.
                  Yeah, I've never seen it myself but word through folks I know(a couple of former SF/Ranger buddies) is that in some krav schools it's a very serious "close with and kill the enemy" or "terminate the target" kind of deal. I've seen types like that in the FMAs too. That's all fine and dandy until you actually do close with and kill the enemy and end up doing the jailhouse rock for 15-20.
                  "We spoke to them in the only language they understood: the machine gun"

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by Hawkeye
                    Yeah, I've never seen it myself but word through folks I know(a couple of former SF/Ranger buddies) is that in some krav schools it's a very serious "close with and kill the enemy" or "terminate the target" kind of deal. I've seen types like that in the FMAs too. That's all fine and dandy until you actually do close with and kill the enemy and end up doing the jailhouse rock for 15-20.
                    That civilisation may not sink,
                    Its great battle lost,
                    Quiet the dog, tether the pony
                    To a distant post;
                    Our master Caesar is in the tent
                    Where the maps are spread,
                    His eyes fixed upon nothing,
                    A hand under his head.


                    - W.B. Yeats

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Krav Maga is a lot like RBSD but most US schools don't even have resistance drills.

                      *giggle*
                      MY NAME IS ANTAGONY I SUCK AT COMBAT SPORTS KTHX

                      "blahblahblah, but I don't think I'm going to train tonight."
                      "Fag."
                      "Well if that were true, then I'd really REALLY want to come train!"

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by Hawkeye
                        Yeah, I've never seen it myself but word through folks I know(a couple of former SF/Ranger buddies) is that in some krav schools it's a very serious "close with and kill the enemy" or "terminate the target" kind of deal. I've seen types like that in the FMAs too. That's all fine and dandy until you actually do close with and kill the enemy and end up doing the jailhouse rock for 15-20.

                        Yes, this happens a lot on the FMA. There are some people around who carries enough cutlery to kill an army on ninjas...
                        Myself, I only carry one small knife, mostly for opening boxes, and I have yet to stab someone badly.
                        Canuckyokushin:

                        These women can do back flips right over my head and still land on there feet .GRrrrrrrr!

                        feedback:

                        THAT'S NOTHING, I USED TO KNOW SOME 12 YEAR-OLDS WHO COULD FIT INSIDE A SUITCASE AND STAY ALIVE FOR 7 OR WAS IT 6 HOURS

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Don't get me wrong, I carry a shitload of stuff on me or in my car at any given time. The barong, the karambit, a couple of blades, a louisville slugger and sometimes the 1911 depending on where I'm going. I live in a bad area of a run down New England mill town, so fuck it, it's better to be judged by twleve then carried by six. But I don't have this mindset that I'm gonna kill the next guy that calls me piece of shit or an asshole. Some folks just take it too far.

                          Ya gotta find some kind of balance.
                          "We spoke to them in the only language they understood: the machine gun"

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by samurai_steve
                            There's a couple of different international organizations.

                            The one which was begun by Imi Sde-Or, and his student Darren R. Levine can be found at www.kravmaga.com - the Israeli Krav Maga Association. Darren Levine is one of two holders of the "Founders Diploma of Excellence", along with Eyal Yanilov, who currently runs the International Krav Maga Association (www.krav-maga.com), which mostly handles the training in Israel proper.

                            There are 3 versions of it: Military, municipal (police and such), and civilian, given the different needs of each category for defense and risks of specific hazards.
                            Click to read ->The krav maga mess in Israel

                            As for it being based on "killing your opponent", that's not entirely accurate. It's about coming out of any situation alive and as unharmed as possible. One technique for dealing with a knife assailant is blinding him with a fire extinguisher, then running like hell.
                            Gee, that's cute, let's hope the victim has a fire extinguisher on hand whenever they're confronted with a knife. :qshatter:

                            We've been told over and over again that if you're wearing good shoes and you have no one else to defend, the best way to survive an assailant with a knife is to stun or distract them and run like hell while yelling for help.
                            Wouldn't it make a get deal more sense to eliminate the attacker, then there would be no need to run away screaming your head off like a little girl?

                            It's practical self-defense.
                            Hardly. Folks, look for my upcoming expose' on "gun defenses of krav maga" at the 'Techniques and Tactics' section of Bullshido. You'll understand as I do why this mcdojo makes zero practical sense.
                            Last edited by Kungfoolss; 10/22/2004 1:16pm, .
                            Kungfoolss, Scourge of the theory-based stylists, Most Feared man at Bullshido.com, and the Preeminent Force in the martial arts political arena

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by Jolly_Roger
                              Yes, this happens a lot on the FMA. There are some people around who carries enough cutlery to kill an army on ninjas...

                              Sorry man, what's FMA?

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