Things to look for in a bad school

[Miguksaram]

Since we are all about stopping the BS in the martial arts what would you advise a friend, relative potential customer what to look for in spotting a bad school. (Please note: I am not looking for "If it says Wing Chun, BJJ, Taekwondo, etc... it's not a good school" I don't need this to be a style bashing thread we have plenty of those already.)

Jeremy M. Talbott
http://www.koreanma.homestead.com/index.html
http://www.martialscience.homestead.com/home.html

[jkd_fighter]

if there is a black belt club, non-contact sparring, unrealistic self-defense, wrongfull claims.

ya ya ya know what i'm sayin'-j roc

[Kempocos]

One indication I feel is if the head instructor will not provide thier instructors contact info so you can verify rank claimed.

Of course this hurts, after all it is not basket weaving.

[I Give BJJs]

a "Master" who never teaches......

[myk hendrix]

Not allowing you to view classes.

That *really* gets up my date !

[Dibble]

A mandatory "contract" that means you have to pay for x months even if you stop going.

[myk hendrix]

...or instructors that never roll/spar with their students !

grrrrr !

[Blad3]

no sparrign is kind of the main one. But that doesn't make it bullshido :D it's just not a very good MA school.

[Deadly ESS]

I agree with dibble.

CONTRACTS.

Why would you need a contract, if your dojo dosen't suck.

[Blad3]

no, short term contracts are fine - it;s when they want you to sign up for a entire year - monthly contracts for a ogood school usually mean unlimited training for a whole month, they're fair contracts, conveiniant and encourage you to go. However, if you are made to sign up for a year, and you don't like it - you can't quite :(

No sparring though, is the be all of end all - no sparring means a poor quality school in my opinion, which could quite possibly mean that the teacher is afraid of moves which don't work or he/she genuinely believes the moves are too dangerous.

As I said, constant sparring is a must really - apart from being effective it;s the most fun aspect of any martial art (even when you do get hurt.)

[Deadly ESS]

Long term, 6 mo.+ are what I was refering to.

1 month is more of a payment than a contract, but I will agree with you in that respect.

I also agree with your position on sparring.

[Blad3]

yeah, sparring is a must - which art do u take Deadly ESS?

[Deadly ESS]

vale tudo, mostly. some mt, some kempo.

I'm not top notch or anything like that. I train with friends and family.

I do have a ton of real life experance, unfortunatly.

[Robert]

I am all for sparring. I think that there are plenty of schools that have sparring that are not good schools.
The definition of a good school is not going to be the same for everyone.
What you should do is ask the person what they want out of a school(self defence, phisical fitness, fighting, competition, looking like the guys in movies), everyone has different goals. After you have found out what they want, shop around, find all of the schools that meet their criteria, then compare and contrast.
The old addage, "you can't judge abook by its cover" apply's here. If you want to find the best school you have to do your research.
Simply saying that a school is bad because it does not have a fighting team or actually wants to charge money is silly.
Talk to the students, ask them questions about how they see their school.
Every school has its strengths AND weaknesses.

Bottom line is a bad school is a school that does not offer you a way to reach your goals.

Robert

[matzahbal]

I'm gonna have to disagree on the "not watching a class" one, but only on the condition that if you want to watch you're watching while you're doing the class. Making somebody do instead of watching helps nail alot of questions, and gives the person a first hand experience. That's like going to a car dealership and watching somebody else test drive a car.

On that same note, be wary of schools that only allow you try a private class instead of a group class, all those free privates do is alot the instructor to sell you on what you think you want and then be dissapointed around group class time. Remember even in a school that teaches privates, at least 75% of the time you're there you should be doing group classes. At one school I use to go to and help teach at we had plenty of students that only did a privates once a week and maybe a group class here and there, and they were very "soft" compared to somebody who went to group regulary.

I agree very very a school where the head instructor won't provide claims to rank like Kempocos pointed out.



"But some apes they gotta go, so we kill the ones we don't know" - 'Ape shall never kill Ape' by The Vandals