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My Experience with a TMA'er

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    My Experience with a TMA'er

    Due to popular (and in my opinion, sensible requests, slight modifications have been made in regards to the use of the phrase "TMA'er").

    I would like to present the community with the following (hopefully) amusing story.

    First my a lot of people I started in TKD. Fortunately, my instructors spent all of their free time doing jiu-jitsu and one had an amateur kickboxing background. Being a decent sized individual (6'6", 230lbls) and very athletic (ex-college basketball player) after about 6 months of TKD I was mopping the floor with the school. My instructors invited me to start training with them and I never took a TKD class again.

    About a year ago, I had started learning the ground-game...I was fortunate to learn from some KOTC fighters and some other experienced BJJ guys. However, my business became ungodly busy and I only started rolling again about a month ago...I consider myself a poor white belt.

    Right now I train 3 times a week with a blue belt and a guy who is at a good white belt level I've been told. They treat me like a little school girl, but I'm learning. Last Saturday, the blue belt brings a "friend" to play with me. I walk into the school and some 20 pound over-weight schmuck is running around doing breakfalls and somersaults all over the place...I'm immediately like...uh-huh.

    I do warm up stretches and then proceed to go work on kicks on the bag...muay-thai kicks. This guy then walks over and starts doing textbook, point sparring kicks....barely moving the bag and making sure I notice him by making a nice "kiaaa" on every kick.

    We start rolling and I'm just practicing "flowing" with the blue belt. This jackass the blue belt brought starts spouting off..."You have to flow like water" and "Remember Bruce Lee said you have to flow like water". If he said it once, he said it 20 times. Finally the blue belt says, OK, you play with him the rest of class and goes to roll with the other guy we normally train with.

    Before we start, I politely inquire about this guys background. His reply, "I'm a 2nd degree BB in WTF TKD and I have a 1st Degree in some Hawaian Ryu Taekwon-jitsu" shit. Not only that, but according to him, his Grandfather learned this stuff in Hawaii during WWII and taught his father who is now a Grandmaster with his own school in Atlanta. Also, the Hawaain stuff is 30% groundfighting, but that is his specialty and that he's "really good" at groundfighting. Ok.

    So we start to roll...without going into detail....after 45 minutes I submitted him over 20 times...including...armbars, kimuras, keylocks, RNC's, and an ezekial choke (no-gi). High-lights included him tapping out to me because I was holding my knee on his stomach while about to pull a spinning armbar and the grand finale (with the others watching)...him tapping out to a triangle that "I didn't really have" but he thought his jaw popped.

    I should also mention that he is a big proponent of something called RATS (Rapid Attack something or other) and he couldn't understand why his Wing Chun hand trapping didn't keep prevent me from pulling him down in the guard.

    Normally I don't gloat because I realize how little I know and how bad I suck at what I do know...but to me this guy was the definition of a McDojo, Brainwashed, Bullshido jackass...hell I thought he was going to pass out halfway through and offered to stop and let him get water...his reply, "I'm old school...I don't stop until class is over". *shakes head*.

    Sorry if this was boring, but I think I was more frustrated by a real life experience with someone this deluded by McDojo TMA's than anything.

    Gringo Grande
    Last edited by Gringo Grande; 4/27/2004 9:36pm, .
    MMA Record vs Llamas 0-1-0
    (The Llama bit my junk but the ref didn't see it).

    That reminds my of some TKD kid that goes to my school, but only does the cardio kickboxing classes. He always stay to do the same point hitting shit to the heavy bags. Not that I'm any good either... Heh.
    "Prison is for rapists, thieves and murderers. If you lock someone up for smoking a plant that makes them happy, you're the fucking criminal." - Joe Rogan

    El Guapo says dance!


      Gainesville huh? They have really good bud over in Gainesville.
      Fury's Edge


        I wonder if he learned anything or was at least humbled by this. Also, welcome to Bullshido, Gringo Grande.


          "Not only that, but according to him, his Grandfather learned this stuff in Hawaii during WWII and taught his father who is now a Grandmaster with his own school in Atlanta."

          I'm in Atlanta you gotta find out who this guy is.


            Whiteshark, the guy who owns the school invited him back to roll with us this Saturday...I was like, "WTF?". He replied, "You are the most patient person I've ever met in my life...I wasn't even rolling with him and I wanted to kill that mother fucker...I invited him back so I could choke him out this weekend". So if he comes back, I'll make sure I find out for you.

            Ippatsu, that was the most frustrating thing...I really don't think the guy "learned" anything. Although I had about 6" of height on him...he probably was close to me in weight. Actually the last thing I remember him saying was, "How tired he was before we rolled" and that he "had worked all night and had only gotten 6 hours of sleep". Unfortunately though, as you read around the Internet and meet people in RL, most TMA'ers refuse to accept that there may be a more effective method...which I understand b/c people hate to admit they are wrong or their way isn't the best.

            I mean hell, I'll tell anyone that if your goal is a little exercise, to increases flexibility, to have a little discipline and do a MA for the "fun" or "sport" value of it...or to just do something with your family...a McDojo is the way to go...I'll send them to a friends ATA School. I think a lot of the annoyance/frustration with the MMA'ers vs the TMA'ers is that the TMA'ers insist what they teach is "effective self defense" and are unwilling to acknowledge that a cross trained fighter is in all likelihood a more effective fighter.

            What I think the TMA'ers don't realize is that 99% of the population would continue to do TMA's even if all they said was, we will help you get fit, increase flexibility, help you be disciplined and let you do sport sparring. The reason? Peope are inherently lazy and aren't willing to take the bumps, bruises (both physcial and mental) to become a true fighter. The McDojo's really have nothing to fear but they continue to advertise as "t3h d34dly in th3 str33t" which is frustrating as hell to the MMA'ers. I had an 11 year old kid try and convince me the other day that all the flips and shit he had learned from Mike Chat at an XMA clinic would be effective in a fight. Now I'm not going to tell this kid he's a dumbass, but inside I'm like...I hope you don't get pounded one day trying to do a 540 to someone in a fight.

            Sigh. [/rant]

            Gringo Grande.
            PS: Been a long time reader (about a year), just figured this was the first decent thing I've had to add to the forums.
            Last edited by Gringo Grande; 4/27/2004 7:32pm, .
            MMA Record vs Llamas 0-1-0
            (The Llama bit my junk but the ref didn't see it).


              Welcome Brother!

              Great story!
              Originally posted by Sifu Rudy Abel
              "Just what makes a pure grappler think he can survive with an experienced striker. Especially if that striker isn't following any particular rule set and is well aware of what the grapplers strategies are".


                gringo grande - what's up, fellow gainesvillian? where do you train? unified training center? i have many questions for you - i've been thinking about adding some ground shit to my repertoire... so i can diversify and be bad at two things.
                Originally posted by Hedgehogey
                Originally posted by Kidspatula
                Bleep bleep blip bloop


                  this is kinda bs my friend,
                  i mean, we ve all had experiences somewhat similiar to this, but it has nothing to do with "tma's".
                  tae kwon do is not a traditional martial art and is not trained in any way for fighting which most tma's where, and if you go to a good school, still are.
                  . ive never done any tma s just bjj and some boxing, with a level that sounds similiar to yours, though im smaller.
                  but i damn well know that there are some filipino,thai and chinese motherfuckers that can rip my head off, i've met some.
                  people jumping around in pajama's instead of training equals bad fighters. but that doesnt mean bjj is the end all be all.


                    "had only gotten 6 hours of sleep"

                    do any other college students find that hilarious?


                      Gringo: I'm happy you nailed the cocky bastard.
                      That being said, he doesn't exactly represent all TMA'ers, does he?
                      I've met just as many fanboys that think a couple of months worth of MT constitutes the same cocky attitude.

                      It's not style specific, man. He was just a moron.
                      video game reviews


                        Osiris, Osiris....tsk, tsk...I don't think anywhere I demonstrated some insane amount of pride in my accomplishment. Actually I do believe I stated about how little skill I actually possess. If anyone wants to give me credit for my shitty groundfighting skills than so be it. I believe I also stated I was more frustrated with this guys attitude than anything. If any point was made, it should have been "Tall dork with below average BJJ skillz > multiple black belt with attitude claiming mad McDojo skillz which I feel makes this an appropriate post. Kungfu Colin aptly states something that I should have included in my post...that there are fanboys and nuthuggers in ALL aspects of the martial arts...just TMA'ers seem to be a bit worse :).

                        I'm sorry that you seemed so threatened by my "l337" groundfighting skills and in ending, all I have to ask of you is, "What's a Nubian?". Bonus points if you know what movie that is from.

                        Gotta love it, 4 posts on a forum and already someone throwing their weight around looking for a flame will have to forgive me if in my advanced age I'm not quite so wreckless or interested in such an idle waste of time. You posted your comment, I think you misinterpreted the intent behind my post...a shame since in the past year I've generally enjoyed your comments for the most part.

                        Bad News...yes I have had my ass handed to me by a couple of the guys from the UTC. You want to ask for the F2 Arena inside...the guy who started it now lives in Orlando and I believe is a purple belt under Mauricio (sp?). There are a couple of blue belt level guys who teach there now who both have strong wrestling backgrounds...ask for Jason or Jason. I've only been there a couple of times...the last was a year ago...I've been training privately with another guy from there. The one guy, Jason Dolder has had a couple of KOTC fights and got screwed in his fight vs "Wildman"...he's a class act though and won't say anything about it. They are very $50 for unlimited classes...or something around there.

                        Gringo Grande
                        MMA Record vs Llamas 0-1-0
                        (The Llama bit my junk but the ref didn't see it).


                          Originally posted by Gringo Grande
                          "What's a Nubian?"
                          Chasing Amy. Sadly I didn't even need to think about it.
                          Seriously, most likely grabbing somebodies crotch like that is only going to make your situation much, much worse. Unless the person doing the gullotine has no pants on, then it's okay as long as they bought you dinner first. - Kidnemo

                          I don't know about angels, but it's fear that gives men wings - Max Payne


                            Hook, line and SINKER.
                            "Prison is for rapists, thieves and murderers. If you lock someone up for smoking a plant that makes them happy, you're the fucking criminal." - Joe Rogan

                            El Guapo says dance!


                              Gringo Grande :

                              Your story mostly needs to be Modified from calling the guy a "TMAer" so repeatedly to calling him a Bullshidoka or a McDojoer . There are plenty of TMA schools where ppl train till they Bleed , and Failure is not an Option , Im sure that if the guy found himself in Albert Mady's school , or in joe Lewis' gym , or in Liang Shou You's Gwan then he would have found himself getting Roundkicked , Hooked , or tossed onm his skull all day , respectively .

                              My point ? Pusies are Pussies , man . And Idiots are Idiots . If he didnt learn anything the frst day , keep bringing him back until he either quits or does . If he learns youll have another good Training Partner around your size to work with . I wish I had more where I live .



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