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Virginia set to ban "assault" weapons

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    Originally posted by ghost55 View Post

    Sorry I'm less online than I used to be. Spending more time at the gym instead. Anyways, yes. Felons that have completed the terms of their sentence should be able to own and concealed carry firearms.
    Are you kidding?

    Comment


      Originally posted by W. Rabbit View Post

      Are you kidding?
      No. I'm serious. After you "pay your debt to society" you should have all of your rights fully restored.

      Comment


        Originally posted by ghost55 View Post

        My opposition to red flag laws is also deeply rooted in 4a.
        I understand.

        Comment


          Originally posted by ghost55 View Post

          No. I'm serious. After you "pay your debt to society" you should have all of your rights fully restored.
          I think it just depends on "the debt". There are a lot of people who should not get access to firearms, post-conviction.

          Comment


            Originally posted by W. Rabbit View Post

            I think it just depends on "the debt". There are a lot of people who should not get access to firearms, post-conviction.
            If they can't be trusted with a gun why the fuck are they running around in public? You think you need a gun to kill people?

            Comment


              Originally posted by ghost55 View Post

              If they can't be trusted with a gun why the fuck are they running around in public? You think you need a gun to kill people?
              "A well regulated Militia"....

              Washington, annual address to the Senate and House of Representatives on 8 January 1790
              Among the many interesting objects, which will engage your attention, that of providing for the common defence will merit particular regard. To be prepared for war is one of the most effectual means of preserving peace.

              A free people ought not only to be armed but disciplined; to which end a Uniform and well digested plan is requisite: And their safety and interest require that they should promote such manufactories, as tend to render them independent on others, for essential, particularly for military supplies.

              The proper establishment of the Troops which may be deemed indispensible, will be entitled to mature consideration. In the arrangements which may be made respecting it, it will be of importance to conciliate the comfortable support of the Officers and Soldiers with a due regard to economy.

              Comment


                Originally posted by W. Rabbit View Post

                "A well regulated Militia"....

                Washington, annual address to the Senate and House of Representatives on 8 January 1790
                That's not a good argument for creating a large number of lifetime second class citizens.

                Comment


                  Personally I think there aught to be a tax reduction incentive for completing a marathon but the gubmint don't care what I think.
                  "Pave the way for the little guy, Caligula!" Harry Solomon, September 28, 1999

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by W. Rabbit View Post

                    Are you kidding?
                    Whether or not that is legal varies from state to state. In Idaho, there is a list of felony convictions that are allowed to own firearms.

                    for example:
                    https://legislature.idaho.gov/statut...H3/SECT18-310/

                    Upon final discharge, a person convicted of any Idaho felony shall be restored the full rights of citizenship, except that for persons convicted of treason or those offenses enumerated in paragraphs (a) through (ii) of this subsection the right to ship, transport, possess or receive a firearm shall not be restored. As used in this subsection, "final discharge" means satisfactory completion of imprisonment, probation and parole as the case may be.
                    (a) Aggravated assault (18-905, 18-915, Idaho Code);
                    (b) Aggravated battery (18-907, 18-915, Idaho Code);
                    (c) Assault with intent to commit a serious felony (18-909, 18-915, Idaho Code);
                    (d) Battery with intent to commit a serious felony (18-911, 18-915, Idaho Code);
                    (e) Burglary (18-1401, Idaho Code);
                    (f) Crime against nature (18-6605, Idaho Code);
                    (g) Domestic battery, felony (18-918, Idaho Code);
                    (h) Enticing of children, felony (18-1509, Idaho Code);
                    (i) Forcible sexual penetration by use of a foreign object (18-6608, Idaho Code);
                    (j) Indecent exposure, felony (18-4116, Idaho Code);
                    (k) Injury to child, felony (18-1501, Idaho Code);
                    (l) Intimidating a witness, felony (18-2604, Idaho Code);
                    (m) Lewd conduct with a minor or child under sixteen (18-1508, Idaho Code);
                    (n) Sexual abuse of a child under sixteen (18-1506, Idaho Code);
                    (o) Sexual exploitation of a child (18-1507, Idaho Code);
                    (p) Felonious rescuing prisoners (18-2501, Idaho Code);
                    (q) Escape by one charged with, convicted of or on probation for a felony (18-2505, Idaho Code);
                    (r) Unlawful possession of a firearm (18-3316, Idaho Code);
                    (s) Degrees of murder (18-4003, Idaho Code);
                    (t) Voluntary manslaughter (18-4006(1), Idaho Code);
                    (u) Assault with intent to murder (18-4015, Idaho Code);
                    (v) Administering poison with intent to kill (18-4014, Idaho Code);
                    (w) Kidnapping (18-4501, Idaho Code);
                    (x) Mayhem (18-5001, Idaho Code);
                    (y) Rape (18-6101, Idaho Code);
                    (z) Robbery (18-6501, Idaho Code);
                    (aa) Ritualized abuse of a child (18-1506A, Idaho Code);
                    (bb) Cannibalism (18-5003, Idaho Code);
                    (cc) Felonious manufacture, delivery or possession with the intent to manufacture or deliver, or possession of a controlled or counterfeit substance (37-2732, Idaho Code);
                    (dd) Trafficking (37-2732B, Idaho Code);
                    (ee) Threats against state officials of the executive, legislative or judicial branch, felony (18-1353A, Idaho Code);
                    (ff) Unlawful discharge of a firearm at a dwelling house, occupied building, vehicle or mobile home (18-3317, Idaho Code);
                    (gg) Unlawful possession of destructive devices (18-3319, Idaho Code);
                    (hh) Unlawful use of destructive device or bomb (18-3320, Idaho Code);
                    (ii) Attempt (18-306, Idaho Code), conspiracy (18-1701, Idaho Code), or solicitation (18-2001, Idaho Code), to commit any of the crimes described in paragraphs (a) through (hh) of this subsection.
                    (jj) The provisions of this subsection shall apply only to those persons convicted of the enumerated felonies in paragraphs (a) through (ii) of this subsection on or after July 1, 1991, except that persons convicted of the felonies enumerated in paragraphs (s) and (t) of this subsection, for any degree of murder or voluntary manslaughter, shall not be restored the right to ship, transport, possess or receive a firearm, regardless of the date of their conviction if the conviction was the result of an offense committed by use of a firearm.
                    (3) A person not restored to the civil right to ship, transport, possess or receive a firearm may make application to the commission of pardons and parole to restore the civil right to ship, transport, possess or receive a firearm. The commission shall not accept any such application until five (5) years after the date of final discharge. The commission shall conduct the proceeding upon such application pursuant to rules adopted in accordance with the law. The commission shall not restore the right to ship, transport, possess or receive a firearm to any person convicted of murder in the first degree (18-4003, Idaho Code), murder in the second degree (18-4003, Idaho Code), or any felony enumerated in paragraphs (a) through (ii) of subsection (2) of this section, upon which the sentence was enhanced for the use of a firearm during the commission of said felony.
                    (4) Persons convicted of felonies in other states or jurisdictions shall be allowed to register and vote in Idaho upon final discharge which means satisfactory completion of imprisonment, probation and parole as the case may be. These individuals shall not have the right restored to ship, transport, possess or receive a firearm in the same manner as an Idaho felon as provided in subsection (2) of this section.
                    History:
                    [18-310, added 1972, ch. 336, sec. 1, p. 858; am. 1981, ch. 182, sec. 1, p. 318; am. 1982, ch. 368, sec. 6, p. 924; am. 1991, ch. 202, sec. 1, p. 481; am. 1993, ch. 120, sec. 2, p. 309; am. 1993, ch. 184, sec. 1, p. 465; am. 1998, ch. 171, sec. 1, p. 592; am. 2003, ch. 113, sec. 1, p. 356; am. 2003, ch. 253, sec. 1, p. 653; am. 2004, ch. 166, sec. 1, p. 541; am. 2016, ch. 296, sec. 8, p. 836.]
                    Falling for Judo since 1980

                    "You are wrong. Why? Because you move like a pregnant yak and talk like a spazzing 'I train UFC' noob." -DCS

                    "The best part of getting you worked up is your backpack full of irony and lies." -It Is Fake

                    "Banning BKR is like kicking a Quokka. It's foolishness of the first order." - Raycetpfl

                    Comment


                      Originally posted by ghost55 View Post

                      No. I'm serious. After you "pay your debt to society" you should have all of your rights fully restored.
                      Going to prison is no guarantee of reform, though. The recidivism rate should suggest that...

                      And of course, felons gonna felon, and if they want a firearm, they can get one easily.

                      Red Flag laws, I agree, serious 4A issues there, and due process as well. The potential for abuse by LEO and citizens is HUGE.

                      Civil Protection Orders/restraining orders (civil) get abused all the time.

                      *edit* just getting charged with a misdemeanor domestic battery fucks with your 2A rights.
                      Falling for Judo since 1980

                      "You are wrong. Why? Because you move like a pregnant yak and talk like a spazzing 'I train UFC' noob." -DCS

                      "The best part of getting you worked up is your backpack full of irony and lies." -It Is Fake

                      "Banning BKR is like kicking a Quokka. It's foolishness of the first order." - Raycetpfl

                      Comment


                        Originally posted by BKR View Post

                        Going to prison is no guarantee of reform, though. The recidivism rate should suggest that...

                        And of course, felons gonna felon, and if they want a firearm, they can get one easily.

                        Red Flag laws, I agree, serious 4A issues there, and due process as well. The potential for abuse by LEO and citizens is HUGE.

                        Civil Protection Orders/restraining orders (civil) get abused all the time.

                        *edit* just getting charged with a misdemeanor domestic battery fucks with your 2A rights.
                        The rate of re-offending in this country is more an indictment of the prison system than it is of the people that end up in it.

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by ghost55 View Post

                          The rate of re-offending in this country is more an indictment of the prison system than it is of the people that end up in it.
                          I think it has more to do with increasingly oppressive law. Criminals always gonna crime. Less law, less crime. /troll
                          Consider for a moment that there is no meme about brown-haired, brown-eyed step children.

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by submessenger View Post

                            I think it has more to do with increasingly oppressive law. Criminals always gonna crime. Less law, less crime. /troll
                            I mean overcriminalization as a trend definitely isn't helping...

                            Comment


                              Originally posted by ghost55 View Post

                              That's not a good argument for creating a large number of lifetime second class citizens.
                              ​​​
                              My point was that "regulation" is right there in the text, right? And regulation of anything is a sticky subject...economy, marriage, abortion, and of course killing machines.

                              So to me, someone who supports both gun rights and civil compromises with non owners, especially those who live in fear of them (because I have empathy for their not completely baseless fears), regulating firearms goes hand in hand with the right to bear them, and that falls to the individual states, and democracy requires the law follows the will of the voters.

                              In VA, that means the voters want checks and red flags. The Dems want more than that, but the big peaceful turnouts showed them the voters have guns too. Abuses are always going to happen which is why, I hope, the VA legislature hammers out common sense versions of these bills... not necessarily what the Democrats want, either (most VA voters are not Dems and are by no means anti-gun, which I'm sure Cassius knows, because VA is littered with them).

                              Case in point, I am gun safety nut since the age of 12, because by 12 I was hiking mountains of NEPA with a .35. To hunt in PA I needed to take safety training for months. I could argue the 2A says I don't need no stinking courses or permits, but PA state law says otherwise and the Game Wardens enforce it.

                              Now, you could call me a bootlicker for following the rules, but they're in place to save lives and they do every year. 250 square inches of bright safety orange visible 360 degrees at all times you on hunting during firearm season. You think it's not a big deal until your buddy starts shooting at you, thinking you're a big turkey.
                              Last edited by W. Rabbit; 2/14/2020 3:28pm, .

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by W. Rabbit View Post
                                My point was that "regulation" is right there in the text, right?
                                Do you know what that term meant, in that context at that time?

                                Comment

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