42 years ago today

[patfromlogan]

They thought the demonstration was over, stiudents were leaving for class. When the National Guard reached the top of the hill they turned and opened fire.

We've been on the topic of racism and the Kent State Massacre is famous and Jackson State (Mississippi) killings, a week later, are almost unknown. Of course it was Blacks who were killed at Jackson State.

In Jackson State the police killed 2 and a dozen students were hospitalized. A federal investigation revealed that ambulances were not called until after the officers had picked up their shell casings.

on Kent State; http://www.may4archive.org/survivors.shtml

Jackson State: http://blackagendareport.com/content...wo-mississippi

Picture of a student dorm at Jackson State

[Tom .C]

Has there ever been anything about America that you would find satisfactory?

[mike321]

Interesting piece of history that I never knew about. The link was not great but google is my friend. So do you have any thoughts on this?

[mike321]

Interesting piece of history that I never knew about. The link was not great but google is my friend. So do you have any thoughts on this?

Directed at OP

[Bneterasedmynam]

Has there ever been anything about America that you would find satisfactory?

There's never been anything about anything that he has found satisfactory.

[patfromlogan]

Has there ever been anything about America that you would find satisfactory?

I love my country, I hate the way it's going toward oligarchy and fascism. Remember I was in Vietnam until the Robert McNamara fired Dad for telling the truth to the Joint Chiefs. Remember too that my family were drinking buddies with the later head of CIA William Colby, recently murdered. I learned young to see through the bullshit.

Here's one for yah,

[patfromlogan]

Interesting piece of history that I never knew about. The link was not great but google is my friend. So do you have any thoughts on this?

To be fair, racism is a factor in why Kent State is more remembered, but also (1) it came first and (2) there's that iconic photo. By the time Jackson State happened, Kent State had already produced a massive response (an enormous nationwide student strike, huge and violent demonstrations, etc.) In all the chaos, Jackson State kind of seemed like just one more thing. And the Jackson State students were much more violent. And they were in Mississippi, where media was scant as compared to Ohio.

[patfromlogan]

There's never been anything about anything that he has found satisfactory.

You can kiss my ass.

That said, having visited or lived in much of Europe and Asia, I do like the fact that a family from India can immigrate to the US and quickly become American, whereas if one of us moved to India we'd never be seen as Indian.

I like it that I can speak out in the US. The problem is, however, if I speak well and gain power they will shoot me. I fear for Ron Paul. When I was a young man they shot my heroes.

See, when Kent State happened I was doing time, solitary, and they'd just announced that not only did the US have a secret war in Cambodia, but that we'd already dropped more bombs on Cambodia THAN GERMANY RECEIVED IN THE ENTIRE WWII. So I kinda got a bad attitude.

[mike321]

I love my country, I hate the way it's going toward oligarchy and fascism. Remember I was in Vietnam until the Robert McNamara fired Dad for telling the truth to the Joint Chiefs. Remember too that my family were drinking buddies with the later head of CIA William Colby, recently murdered. I learned young to see through the bullshit.

Here's one for yah,

Any ideas for stopping the oligarchy and facism trend you see? I think government influence over is increasing and wealth is concentrating so I see your point. I have not heard any good ideas to stop this trend.

[Styygens]

I like it that I can speak out in the US. The problem is, however, if I speak well and gain power they will shoot me. I fear for Ron Paul. When I was a young man they shot my heroes.

So I kinda got a bad attitude.

Really? I never would've guessed.

[mike321]

Any ideas for stopping the oligarchy and facism trend you see? I think government influence over is increasing and wealth is concentrating so I see your point. I have not heard any good ideas to stop this trend.

Edit: I think government influence over BUSINESS is increasing.

[Eddie Hardon]

The photo of Jackson State, wow, the number of bullet holes. Presumably the National Guard ran out of bullets...

Colby murdered? I thought he died of natural causes in his canoe?

[Colin]

Edit: I think government influence over BUSINESS is increasing.

Disagree.
More like:
Big Business > Government > Small business;

where > represents a dick in the ass.

[Cullion]

Big Business & Central Government tend to have a revolving door between them.

Is Donald Rumsfeld an 'entrepeneur', or a 'public servant' ?

Why, he's a little of both, and yet absolutely neither.

Former Goldman Sachs partners working in finance ministries & former Defence ministers taking seats on the board of aerospace contractors don't get hung up on this 'public/private' thing, and neither should you.

It comes down to this: Who is stealing, and who is being stolen from?

[patfromlogan]

hmm, a bit of a rant, but back to topic soon?

Really? I never would've guessed.

Year I could agree that there's been no real conspiracies. After all, I (could) still believe in America and I believe President Johnson:

"My fellow Americans: As President and Commander in Chief, it is my duty to the American people to report that renewed hostile actions against United States ships on the high seas in the Gulf of Tonkin have today required me to order the military forces of the United States to take action in reply.

The initial attack on the destroyer Maddox, on August 2, was repeated today by a number of hostile vessels attacking two U.S. destroyers with torpedoes. The destroyers and supporting aircraft acted at once on the orders I gave after the initial act of aggression. We believe at least two of the attacking boats were sunk. There were no U.S. losses.

The performance of commanders and crews in this engagement is in the highest tradition of the United States Navy. But repeated acts of violence against the Armed Forces of the United States must be met not only with alert defense, but with positive reply. That reply is being given as I speak to you tonight. Air action is now in execution against gunboats and certain supporting facilities in North Vietnam which have been used in these hostile operations.

In the larger sense this new act of aggression, aimed directly at our own forces, again brings home to all of us in the United States the importance of the struggle for peace and security in southeast Asia. Aggression by terror against the peaceful villagers of South Vietnam has now been joined by open aggression on the high seas against the United States of America.

The determination of all Americans to carry out our full commitment to the people and to the government of South Vietnam will be redoubled by this outrage. Yet our response, for the present, will be limited and fitting. We Americans know, although others appear to forget, the risks of spreading conflict. We still seek no wider war."

Me and about 50,000 dead American soldiers suckered for that one. You know, from 1975 to 1980 just as many Vietnam veterans died from suicide. PTSD was bad from WWII, but way worse from Vietnam, and I believe finding out that it was all bullshit, that we were the "bad guys," that the US military service men who were in South East Asia had been telling the Pentagon to back Ho Chi Minh since the 40s, wtf?, it just goes on and on and on and it's the same bullshit now. Put that in your fucking history books, suckers.

Having had friends die for lies has given me a shitty attitude.

Wanna have fun? Google LBJ + Brown and Root + Halliburton or even more fun heroin + Brown and Root or Lady Bird Johnson + or Mary Pinchot Meyer + LSD + JFK or George de Mohrenschildt or Lady Bird Johnson + Bell Helicopter. *edit, and good old Billy Sol Estes should be in there, maybe + murder? And Suite 8F Group, can't forget them wonderful guys.

The one that really is getting to me is that as far as I can get it, most of the people around Martin Luther King said that gun fire noises came from some nearby bushes. Bushes that were quickly cut down and removed.