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Cannon_6
5/28/2009 11:36am,
The JJ BB got mugged in Harlem, then killed one of the muggers. He was convicted of murder yesterday.

Note: He didn't choke the guy; he stabbed him... 15 times.

Oops: The guy he killed wasn't a mugger, he was a "Good Samaritan" trying to help him.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/ny_crime/2009/05/27/2009-05-27_maurice_parks_found_guilty_in_stabbing_death_of _good_samaritan.html

Kintanon
5/28/2009 11:39am,
The comments on that story make me want to vomit up a lung....

Cannon_6
5/28/2009 12:02pm,
The comments on that story make me want to vomit up a lung....
Dude, NEVER read the comments in a tabloid. They'll make you crazier than the people who wrote them.

The Question
5/28/2009 12:15pm,
Note: He didn't choke the guy; he stabbed him... 15 times.

l (http://www.nydailynews.com/news/ny_crime/2009/05/27/2009-05-27_maurice_parks_found_guilty_in_stabbing_death_of _good_samaritan.html)

BJJ wins again?

joecos
5/28/2009 12:19pm,
BJJ wins again?


NOT BJJ -- the school this guy goes to is mainly Hapkido, with some traditional/American JJ.

Links:

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/2008/01/12/2008-01-12_subway_conductor_who_fought_off_muggers_.html

http://www.happykicks.com/

Eddie Hardon
5/29/2009 6:09am,
The JJ BB got mugged in Harlem, then killed one of the muggers. He was convicted of murder yesterday.

Note: He didn't choke the guy; he stabbed him... 15 times.

Oops: The guy he killed wasn't a mugger, he was a "Good Samaritan" trying to help him.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/ny_crime/2009/05/27/2009-05-27_maurice_parks_found_guilty_in_stabbing_death_of _good_samaritan.html

Did I read it correctly? He'd previously killed a bloke in 1994?

He beats off 3 muggers but stabs one to death (even worse, a likely Good Samaritan)?

Why did he have a knife? A lack of confidence in his Empty Hand Technique (Ok, that bit was probably a bit tongue-in-cheek). Even so, I'm not sure that this is a nice bloke at all....one wonders did he go looking for trouble between 1994 and to-date.

Cannon_6
5/29/2009 11:01am,
Did I read it correctly? He'd previously killed a bloke in 1994?

The January 2008 story says, "...the conductor shot and wounded a mugger in 1994..."

I'll bet this guy has all of the "Death Wish" movies on DVD, right next to his "Kung Fu Theater" collection.

Matt Phillips
5/29/2009 11:07am,
Lets not forget good ol' Rafiel Torre who at least had the class to use BJJ to get the job done.

Deputy District Attorney affirms Brazilian Jujitsu chokehold used to kill... - No BS Martial Arts (http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?t=26054)

Mata Leao FTW!





Too soon?

Cannon_6
5/29/2009 11:50am,
Lets not forget good ol' Rafiel Torre who at least had the class to use BJJ to get the job done.

I think class is in the eye of the beholder. This dude's knife might have been, like, totally sweet.

mike321
5/29/2009 5:01pm,
One interesting comment made me think: why weren't the muggers charged with murder also? You break into a house and things go wrong you can get charged with murder even if you don't participate in the violence.

Josh_Grant
5/29/2009 5:44pm,
One interesting comment made me think: why weren't the muggers charged with murder also? You break into a house and things go wrong you can get charged with murder even if you don't participate in the violence.

Unfortunately, that's just the legal system.

Here's the thing. He was apparently a black belt who used a knife to "defend" himself against a handfull of muggers. The law doesn't look kindly on Black belts...It's kind of scary trying to arrest someone who can kick your ass in a New York second. I seem to remember at one time Black Belts had to register themselves with the police department...

Anyways, it's about the judicious use of lethal force. The aggressor is usually judged by the amount of damage done. For instance:

I once had a student (massage therapy, not martial arts) who was a black belt in some form of Karate. He was leaving a movie theatre at night with his wife, when some guy stumbles out of the bar next door, obviously strung out on something more than alcohol (according to his account anyways). This guy follwed them to their car in a dark parking lot and grabbed my student from behind.

All he did was a simple elbow/backfist combo and knocked acouple of his teeth out. A well meaning bouncer from the bar came running up- yelling, but not identifying himself as a bouncer, got popped also- but not to nearly the extent.

Long story short, the police were called and my student- not the original agressor- got aressted. He was made to pay all this guys dental bills and spend a couple of days in jail. Why?

Because the amount of force used to end a potentially bad situation was far greater than the actuall threat- according to the judge. So he was a black belt with something to prove and not a man protecting his wife.

The original agressor walked away with his dental bills paid, but no jail time- even though he originally committed the assault (by grabbing my student). He was the "victim" because he got hurt.

The bouncer didn't even bother to try. Hazzard of the job.

Somehting we as martial artists have ot be aware of. The old saying "better judged by 12 then carried by 6" is no longer an appropriate philosophy. We have to be careful how much force we use to protect ouselves. We can end up the ones going to jail for defending ourselves.

Whats really bad is when our martial arts instructors- in my case, my Kenpo instructors- teach us a devistating combination of 4-10 moves in response to a simple punch to the head and we believe that we will be fully justified in using them, because, well, you know, we were the ones attacked.

These skewed beliefes will ultimately get us arrested and put into a small pen, located in a large house, filled with people who willingly and wantingly used way to much force to accomplish their goals...

Josh

Lu Tze
5/29/2009 6:25pm,
Unfortunately, that's just the legal system.

Here's the thing. He was apparently a black belt who used a knife to "defend" himself against a handfull of muggers.Except that he didn't kill any of the muggers, they had all run off. He killed someone else.

He chased an innocent guy down, and committed a fucking frenzied knife attack.

Oh, if you care to read further this apparently isn't the first time he's done this either.

Josh_Grant
5/29/2009 6:29pm,
Except that he didn't kill any of the muggers, they had all run off. He killed someone else.

He chased an innocent guy down, and committed a fucking frenzied knife attack.

Oh, if you care to read further this apparently isn't the first time he's done this either.

With all that being said, my point still stands: he used excessive force in "defending" himself and that's why he was convicted.

Josh

Lu Tze
5/29/2009 6:36pm,
Fair enough. Although the police treated this as unrelated (or at least incidental to) the mugging, hence the murder charge.

Petter
5/29/2009 8:07pm,
Somehting we as martial artists have ot be aware of. The old saying "better judged by 12 then carried by 6" is no longer an appropriate philosophy.
Sure it is, but people have to read what it actually says. It’s not saying “It’s okay to respond with any level of force to any threat”. It’s saying “if you are faced with an immediate lethal threat, then you may use lethal force”. This does not constitute (and the saying does not condone) escalating the level of the encounter, and to the best of my knowledge, the law in most or all civilised places does allow the use of lethal force when and only when faced with a direct, unavoidable lethal threat.

sambosteve
6/01/2009 12:43pm,
The 2008 article said he wounded two of the original attackers...who were in police custody. Anyone know if they ever went to trial? I know the bloggers said they got off, but is there any credible info on that?

Unfortunate as it is, the conviction is solid IMO.

I had a student who was attacked with a box cutter alone on the subway once. He managed (thankfully and luckily) to restrain the guy and get the box cutter. Rather than make sushi of the attacker, he restrained him until the next train stop when my student got off the subway car and left the guy on the floor. He had him mounted (knee on belly with the othe knee pinning the blade arm). He bashed the guy in the face until he dropped the cutter on his own. My student picked it up and left when the subway car doors opened. Left the guy on the floor.