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Jack Rusher
2/12/2009 10:15pm,
A cool old video showing footage of some of the wrestling styles that were assimilated in the process of creating Sambo:

YouTube - Kurash Chidaoba Khapsagay Gulesh Trinta Sambo (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O1g2-itQs0A)

The only Kurash I could find is the new unified Kurash (as practiced in Uzbekistan), which is meant to be an international sport in which all the related grappling systems from the area can compete:

YouTube - clip présentation du kourach (lutte d'Ouzbékistan) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TaH--CICAMI)

Chidaoba (Georgian folk wrestling):

YouTube - Georgian wrestling (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-VZIjbrYNlg)
YouTube - georgian wrestling (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YXFXLTo7SI0)

I could find no videos of Khapsagai, the wrestling style from Yakutsk, but it looks about how you'd imagine:

http://album.foto.ru:8080/photos/pr0/130523/44493.jpg

Gulesh from Azerbaijan:

YouTube - GULESH (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HqGlufz2bik)
(Might be Freestyle going by the old name)

The only video of Trinta I could locate is of two drunk Moldavians at a lawn party in Italy:

YouTube - moldoveni in italia-trinta (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6yurC8L0mBA)

Unmentioned in the video, but probably of interest, is this clip from Dagestan:

YouTube - dagestan wrestling (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ThRZqXhsNhc)

Examples of Armenian kokh were unfindable.

TheMightyMcClaw
2/13/2009 12:52am,
I've not watched all the videos yet, but I'd like to comment on the Uzbek Kurash one. At first, it pretty much looked like straight-up Ippon judo, complete with rolling uchimata, but then I noticed a subtle difference; it seems like there were a LOT more hip throws were the thrower kept both feet planted (ie, o-goshi, koshi guruma, sode tsurikomi goshi) than I normally see in Judo. I feel like I almost never see judoka in highlight reels who don't have at least one foot off the ground when throwing. :P

theotherserge
2/13/2009 2:23am,
Sambosteve has some vid of the belt-wrestling championships we saw in Moscow '07; I'll bug him to post it here.

Jack Rusher
2/13/2009 10:02am,
it seems like there were a LOT more hip throws were the thrower kept both feet planted

The mechanics of the Central Asian stuff always looks more shuaijiao than judo to me. Something about the power generation and style of base in sambo reminds me of shuaijiao as well, but I need to do some sambo before I'll really understand the similarities and differences.

theotherserge
2/13/2009 5:02pm,
it is from differences in footwork and the looser Judogi vs tighter-fit jacket/vest/no-gi

A good analogy is in Judo you exploit the space between yourself and uki-about the size of a medicine ball-before making contact as you throw. For Sambo, you lock the uki to yourself and fling him like a useless appendage.

Rene "Zendokan" Gysenbergs
2/13/2009 5:33pm,
@ theotherserge,

Did Sambo take over the footwork of Kurdash or Judo or both when performing hip throws?

@ Jack Rusher,

Do Kurdash and Shuai Jiao have the same footwork for hip throws? And what are the other similarities/differences between them?

Thanks.

Jack Rusher
2/13/2009 6:11pm,
Do Kurdash and Shuai Jiao have the same footwork for hip throws? And what are the other similarities/differences between them?

Sadly, I've never met a Kurash player with whom to compare notes. The footwork looks familiar in the videos I've seen in part because they tend to base out while throwing rather than staying up on the toes. The best way to demonstrate what I mean is probably to show you 'pei', a shuaijiao throw that resembles Judo's seoi nage:

YouTube - www.shuaijiao.tv Technique of the Week (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=huRIbKKRA9c)

... you can see some variations on this at around 2:00 of the Kurash video.

theotherserge
2/13/2009 8:11pm,
Initially, one "founder" of sambo was trained in Jiu-Jitsu and a plethora of other styles and the other primarily in Judo. Due to a political rupture, the Judoka was disappeared/made unavailable and a trend to de-Japanifacation spread from there.

Once the Soviets decided to compete in Judo, alot of the Japanese influences came back into training.

So it kind of depended on who you were coached by and if there are any NKVD agents watching you train... ;-)

thaclient
2/13/2009 11:25pm,
Thanks for posting, those are some cool videos. For whatever reason, I find it interesting to see the folk styles of wrestling from around the world

Siniq
2/15/2009 8:53am,
I'l try to embed this, just in case here's the link: http://www.vbox7.com/play:964fef4a
This is bulgarian folk wrestling and I don't think it's influenced anything. Just for the folk wrestling fans.

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Siniq
2/15/2009 7:38pm,
YouTube - Bulgarian Wrestling 3 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oGK68PV6Gis)

1point2
1/05/2010 10:30pm,
It's my osmosis-based understanding that the SAMBO spawning also involved some DNA from Mongolian wrestling. (Please correct me if I'm wrong)

I found some on Tim Cartmell's discussion board (find it at Tim's Discussion Board: Jiu Jitsu/Grappling/Ground Fighting : Shuai jiao )

YouTube- Mongolian / Tuvinian wrestling (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0wB6WISba5M)

It looks pretty damn refined--some very nice pickups, and a smoooooth wrestler's shoulder throw. I noticed that they were very careful not to touch their knees during these techniques, which created some interesting gymnastic positions as they got underneath their opponent/partner.

theotherserge
1/05/2010 10:51pm,
Only the soles of your feet and the palms of your hands may touch the ground. Aaron Fields trained with the Mongolian National Sambo team while he was studying Mongolian wrestling there.

Not exactly WMA, but there is so much crossover in wrestling since it is such an old artform and also the Monglos headed out West to kick some ass and their influence reverberated on after that...

DdlR
1/05/2010 11:06pm,
Not exactly WMA, but there is so much crossover in wrestling since it is such an old artform and also the Monglos headed out West to kick some ass and their influence reverberated on after that...

Russian MA are always going to be a bit of a gray, "yes and no" area re. WMA. Some of the Russian self defense manuals from around the turn of the 20th century through to the end of WW1 are very interesting from the WMA perspective, though; bits of savate, boxing, Greco-Roman wreslting etc.

theotherserge
1/06/2010 12:48am,
Yep, scratch a tartar and you'll find a Hun, or something like that...