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Raging Monkey
7/06/2008 10:00pm,
Just got back from a 3 day vacation... I don't have the patience to wade back into this mess.

Dsimon3387
7/06/2008 11:37pm,
Now, if you won't answer the questions from Askari, let me ask them instead, as I as well as interested in the reply (just close your eyes and pretend it's me...):



For me this code back to post #40 in this thread which sums your arguments and Rory's. I find it improbably that a small splinter group (and you referred to them as that -- indicating that it might be a lineage thing) a) has the authority (and this supports you) or b) may actually have been given the authority and may be more than a few people learning from B&W films since even their students got SJJK membership certificates, or are they just that easy to get?


I think the first questions you ask are legit because you are trying to summerize whether there is a lineage split. Ok fair enough

But the last question is phrased in a derogatory way (see bold) and is totally irrelevant. Yes Bill is haughty at times but the mods are also trying to get people to realize that it works both ways. When you make a statement like this to a Koryu member you are talking about their family. Especially a small Ryu-ha. Phraseology like this comes off as ignorant and course.

The truth is that the Soke (I don't like this term but will use it) determines how the art is transmitted and it is none of anybody's concern but the Soke's how he chooses to transmit the art.

This question is a jab. The way the Soke chooses to transmit the art has nothing to do with this dispute. The issue is whether the art was transmitted to this other gentleman or not.

It is Fake
7/06/2008 11:41pm,
Dsimon have you read the thread? If so, address the questions or chill. This is getting ridiculous. I don't care if you have empathy for the guy. He has spent a hundred posts insulting everyone and now you are going to chastise someone? Please, seriously stop.

He insulted Iama Douchebag's Japanese. I didn't see you make any type of remark against that.

Dsimon3387
7/07/2008 12:01am,
Dsimon have you read the thread? If so, address the questions or chill. This is getting ridiculous. I don't care if you have empathy for the guy. He has spent a hundred posts insulting everyone and now you are going to chastise someone? Please, seriously stop.

He insulted Iama Douchebag's Japanese. I didn't see you make any type of remark against that.


IIF nobody is insulting anyone. I don't have empathy, as I am not Koryu. I do have some sympathy knowing certain ways Koryu people think about what they do.

Look if you think the way the art is transmitted is an issue that needs addressing, then we can agree to disagree. I don't and I am expressing that in a nonpartisan fashion, meaning that if Bill brought it up I would say the same thing.

Dave's Japanese is a complicated issue, I will diplomatically leave it at that suffice to say if he was personally insulted I would like to let him know I feel bad that he was agreived haha! :eusa_sile

It is Fake
7/07/2008 12:06am,
Notice I said nothing about Koryu, nor transmission, nor anything of the sort.

I asked you to stop fanning the flames by pointing out the " derogatory statements" of one person and completely ignoring someone else.

DerAuslander
7/07/2008 11:26am,
I wasn't talking to you, Douche. The universe is only Doucheocentric in YMAS & Douchido (oooo...I like the sound of that). My posts were directed toward those who felt the need to explain why Mr. Williams was the way he was. In the end, all of that is irrelevant. We do what we do, and in my case, we look dead sexy while we're doing it.

Rock Ape
7/07/2008 1:12pm,
Matt, just side lining for a sec,

Where in Iraq does Mr. Miller operate? I'm due there soon and would like the opportunity to meet him if possible.

PM me if you'd rather provide that info off forum.

Thanks

Dave

Jim_Jude
7/07/2008 4:06pm,
I would doubt that. Look at Judo, Boxing, Wrestling. There seems to be a lessening or absence of bullshit in arts that stress competition and quantifiable results.

I would think there will be some mysticism about the Gracies in 200 years, but in an age of verifiable fight records, and video proof it will be hard for them to mythos achieved by grandmasters dead and gone.

Look at Matt Furey & Tony Cecchine, the questionable Mark Hatmaker, among all of the other frauds I can't bother looking up at the moment. There's bullshit everywhere.

A.M.
7/07/2008 5:20pm,
This is gold.

Its a Comic Book addvert for Sosuishi-Ryu, using the name YUBIWAZA. This is prime Martial Silliness from the Golden Age! Click on the image and a full-sized version pops up.

http://cagle.msnbc.com/hogan/webextras14/martial_arts_ads/thumbs/Yubiwaza1tn.gif (http://cagle.msnbc.com/hogan/webextras14/martial_arts_ads/Yubiwaza1.gif)

Now remember that Nelson J. "Mitch" Fleming was the Sosuishi-Ryu representative in the US during the 1960s, and is the source of the schism that we are exploring.




Next up:

Really? Really Really?

Then why was SJJK advertising in the back of a comic book?

Why are the nobodies on this thread having to present history for people supposedly in the know of SJJK?

I love the two free gifts in the ad "How To Overcome An Inferiority Complex " and "How to Do Strong Man Stunts With Ease"

Rock Ape
7/07/2008 5:21pm,
Yes, I must remember to poke my enemy in their eye with my invincible yubiwaza.

It is Fake
7/07/2008 5:25pm,
Alright you guys know I'm going to move these posts. Let's not get into nit pick category.

Kid Miracleman
7/07/2008 10:48pm,
Such an enticingly horrible wall of textiness! My eyes... ze goggles do nutzing!

youngri
7/07/2008 11:48pm,
Has anyone read the book?

Just curious, seeing as I ordered it a few days ago.

If so, what did you think of it?

Cheers

Askari
7/08/2008 6:32am,
Strikes me as a jealous dude who has been told that he has the real sosuishi-ryu realising that someone from a different lineage has made money and got some minor fame by writing a book.
Sour grapes.

I may go and order the book to see what all the fuss is about.

No such thing as bad publicity, after all.
I may as well, the book is only 12 bucks on Amazon (http://www.amazon.com/Meditations-Violence-Comparison-Martial-Training/dp/1594391181/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1215516592&sr=8-1) after all.
http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51svGgEFvuL._SL500_AA240_.jpg

sochin101
7/08/2008 6:48am,
If this was a subtle troll to get us to buy the book... bravo...

if this was thread was intended to discredit Rory Miller, it seems to have failed to convince the martial arts historians here, the researchers, the koryu guys and the casual reader wondering "WTF?".
Multiple fail, NYBUDOKA.

ignatzami
7/08/2008 6:56am,
296 posts.... Jesus.

These guys could show Wing Chun how to have a lineage war.

DOH! 297!