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View Full Version : Where do you draw the line?



arkanscott
9/04/2007 3:08pm,
I hope I am dropping my first question in the right fourm. If not, feel free to move me.

My question is "where do you draw the line" on McDojo/Bullshido and marketing? True, "Little Ninja's" reeks of bullshido (and is considered a red flag) as does multiple HOF inductions and that sort of thing. But, I know for a fact that the place here in town is legit...at least their MMA program is...not sure about the rest. Their program is led by a level 8 under Gokor/Gene Lebell and a Gracie purple belt. His fight team dominates MMA competitions in the area. He has sent fighters to the UFC. Etc. Etc. But the dojo he teaches at offers XMA, "Little Ninja's", the owner is in a handfull of HOF's etc. etc. Is his a McDojo? I say "no", it is only marketing.

I am about to start training there and have complete confidence in the Gokor system the teacher. I currently train in Judo and Combat Hapkido. Judo is Kokodan under a 6th Dan. From reading the fourms, Combat Hapkido is, at best, borderline bullshido. But, riddle me this. The class is free. It is active. It is live. The teacher says things like, "This is a wrist lock, we are teaching it under the scenero of 'if someone grabs your hand', but realize, that this is not a real world application of the techinque. A real world application is in a clinch or a similar situation." etc. etc. The guy who teaches it is very legit and has added BJJ to it (he's a black belt). One part of the class is "standing" the other is ground and the final is randori. Again, his class is free, he has mutual respect from the Gokor guy and the Judo guy. But, he teaches an art that is considered by many, exp. in the Hapkido world, watered down and Bullshidoish. He is a McDojo? I say "no", he is teaching an effective system in an effective manner for a very fair price (free).

Again, my question is this, most martial arts studios are a business. In order to remain in opperation they must get people in the door. In order to get people in the door, they must offer things like XMA and "Little Ninjas" and sometimes they must do things like join martial arts HOF's and send Philip Porter money to be recoginzed, etc. etc. In short, there are legit martial arts studios that still have the red flags but are teaching legit fighting arts in a safe and effective way. Sometimes, they are just ingaged in marketing. My belief is that if they are not ripping you off and the class is live and their fight team succeeds in competition, then it is probably legit. Comments?

Bizzaro Root
9/04/2007 3:14pm,
If your guys has a blakc belt in bjj, I doubt he would teach combat hapkido for free. He could be teching bjj for atleast $100 per student per month. unless I mis-read and your not saying
The guy who teaches it is very legit and has added BJJ to it (he's a black belt).

kismasher
9/04/2007 3:15pm,
Where do you live in ArkansasScott and how about a link to the school...otherwise, please read the stickies and kick it in newbietown for a while.

arkanscott
9/04/2007 3:37pm,
First: Bizzaro Root, he taught for a while at the same school where the Gokor guy teaches. I don't know what he charged. He teaches a small private class as a hobbie.

Second: kismasher, I want to remain annoynomus (sp?) until I get my feet wet. I don't really comfortable providing a link to the dojo right now. I simply put the reference there as a personal antidote to lead into my "where do you draw the line" question/comment. If newbietown is where I belong, then that is where I'll head. But I do think that the question is worth a comment before I move on. Where do you draw the line? By "you" I mean "you", for me it is money and the legitness of the art and the "liveness" of the class.

P.S. How bout them hogs!!! and Don't you think McFadden should play QB full time?

kismasher
9/04/2007 4:08pm,
Personally, I judge McDojoism/Bullshidoism on a case by case basis based on my own personal opinion and on the usual criteria set forth here on Bullshido. I am not an expert in any facet of the martial arts nor do I claim to be.

I live in Fayetteville and study JJ & Judo under Steven Gourley at the Fayetteville Boys and Girls Club. (for now)

As for the McFadden comment, I'd prefer him to be a running back and our team develop a real QB. Too bad we just lost perhaps the best QB prospect to come to the school to USC because Nutt is a douche bag. 3 passes to the WR's may beat Troy but it won't fly in Tuscaloosa in 2 weeks.

arkanscott
9/04/2007 4:14pm,
The entire Nutt family is the worst thing to happen to the state of Arkansas since Faubus. I can't believe (actually, I can) that he ran Mustain off (as well as the top three HS recruits this year). My McFadden comment was really a joke...but not really. Sadly, I think he is the best QB on the team. I am terrified about the possiblity of Nutt having him shag punts.

Anyway, nice to meet ya and sorry about choosing to remain annom. My brother is in politics and he doesn't like me revealing too much on the internets.

kismasher
9/04/2007 4:16pm,
orly?

is your name Roger?

arkanscott
9/04/2007 4:18pm,
lol, no Billy actually. It's Georgia politics.

in sorte diabol
9/04/2007 5:38pm,
greetings.but i must say i dont know about the "hogs".for me itts the queens for me.i like my teams dumb and confounded when they play.its easier to make beer bets that whay.but the only 3 sports are hockey,drinking,tkd...sorry cheap shot.as for mcdojos,for me i go by my gut feelings.look at his training hall.is it clean,tidy.now small dojos with older equipment is fine if the instruction is good.do a background check.criminal and lineage.if he sezs hes with a outfit,check it out.also try the b.b.b.better buisness burea.see if their members or if the are check for complaints.lastly if the contract reminds you of buying a frickin car run, run very frickin fast.after all they do have to make money and it doent have to be crappy instructors or mcwannabes.just ask for private rates for classes,sometimes there not much more then the reg.good luck. cheers.

kismasher
9/04/2007 8:32pm,
greetings.but i must say i dont know about the "hogs".for me itts the queens for me.i like my teams dumb and confounded when they play.its easier to make beer bets that whay.but the only 3 sports are hockey,drinking,tkd...sorry cheap shot.as for mcdojos,for me i go by my gut feelings.look at his training hall.is it clean,tidy.now small dojos with older equipment is fine if the instruction is good.do a background check.criminal and lineage.if he sezs hes with a outfit,check it out.also try the b.b.b.better buisness burea.see if their members or if the are check for complaints.lastly if the contract reminds you of buying a frickin car run, run very frickin fast.after all they do have to make money and it doent have to be crappy instructors or mcwannabes.just ask for private rates for classes,sometimes there not much more then the reg.good luck. cheers.


first off, what the **** is hockey?

second, paragraphs are your friend (and mine, and everyone else on here.)

"Hogs" refers to the nickname for the Arkansas Razorbacks, a college team. College football reigns supreme in the American South.