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EmperorCesar
1/11/2007 1:22am,
This is a list that Bruce Lee wrote on the Pros and Cons of the many martial arts Bruce looked into back in the day. This list is taken from the book "Jeet Kune Do Bruce Lee's Commentaries on the Martial Way". Keep your "Bruce Lee was teh best" and "Bruce Lee was teh fake" arguments out...

Pros and Cons

Western Boxing
Pro 1. Efficient footwork
2. Variety of punches: Jab-Hook-Cross-Uppercut
3. Shoulder/chin protection (plus all purpose parry and block stance)
4. Conditioning
5. In-Fighting
6. Head and body movements
Con An evaluation:It has its set of restrictions and is designed to defeat an adversary in a certain manner.

Wrestling
Pro 1. Leg Tackle
2. Uncrispy, economy rush
3. Protective shell while moving in
4. Strangulation
5. Holds, locks
6. Ground fighting
Con Need to add: Hair pulling, Groin grabbing, eye poking(front), Shin pinching (Study especially the old-time illegal holds.)

Karate
Pro Tool Development: Balance, Form
Con Need to stress greater mobility and aliveness
Pro Front Kick, Snap, Thrust
Con Need to modify upward snap- compare with savate

Tae Kwon Do
Pro 1. Kicking flexibility
2. Turning heel kick
3. Head ram
Con 1. Lacks contact
2. Lacks broken rhythm and aliveness
3. Lacks variety

Judo
Pro 1. Balance
2. Osoto
3. Foot-sweeps
4. Mat Work
- Locks, Chokes
Con Need to add:
-Hair pulling, groin grabbing, eye poking, Shin pinching
Note: Study a few practical throws

Muay Thai/ Thai Boxing
Pro 1. Elbows
2. Knees
3. Actual combat
Con 1. The punching is not of high caliber: the "left jab" is poor, the "uppercut" almost nonexistent, the "hook" is inadequate
2. Gloves prevent the use of the finger jab and the palm smash
3. Lead foot attacks lacking; no shin/knee lead attack and groin attack
4. No grappling tactics
5. No "under belt" tactics
6. Scientific economical structure is lacking. Plus lack of sophistication in cadence, timing, broken rhythm.
7. No hair pulling or scratching

Wing Chun
Pro 1. Teaches the economy of straight line
2. Nucleus fighting
3. Chi sao- two halves of one whole
Con 1. Over simplification
2. Lacks variety

Tai Chi
Pro 1. Esoteric
2. The flow

Gung Fu Styles- Northern Styles
Pro 1. Palm Strike
2. Variety to liberate
Con 1. Needs to add power
2. Needs to be more compact

Western Fencing
Pro 1. Skillful use of front lead (study auxiliary supplemented guarding hand in each position)
2. Timing and cadence
3. Foil
4. Saber
5. Epee

Kendo
Pro 1. The Zen approach
2. The determined clash
3. The footwork

Aikido
Pro 1. The flow
2. The two halves of one whole
3. The footwork
Con 1. Needs to work on idea of adding uncrispyness to snap (in their concept of flow)


There. Thats the list. (Takes cover)

meggaman7
1/11/2007 1:34am,
"Muay Thai con: no underbelt tactics"? Kicks to the legs/shins didn't count?

bob
1/11/2007 1:38am,
He meant groin kicks. Also the punching criticisms is somewhat out of date, though it may have been valid at the time. But no grappling in MT? WTF?

BlackStalyon
1/11/2007 1:46am,
That was not as bad as I thought it would be. I don't like his contradictions when he praises aliveness and contact but denounces the lack of eye gouging, groin attacks, the "dirty" attacks.

"Scientific economical structure is lacking. Plus lack of sophistication in cadence, timing, broken rhythm. " ---From the Muay Thai section, I also find this to be completely false.

feedback
1/11/2007 1:55am,
What the hell is a shin pinch? Try and pinch my shins, they're made of goddamn granite.

EmperorCesar
1/11/2007 1:57am,
What the hell is a shin pinch? Try and pinch my shins, they're made of goddamn granite.

I asked myself that question several times while posting this... I have no clue what hes talking about

bob
1/11/2007 2:40am,
What the hell is a shin pinch? Try and pinch my shins, they're made of goddamn granite.

I'd say he means a heel hook.

Joyseau
1/11/2007 2:46am,
Where did you find this list?

Foreman
1/11/2007 3:43am,
I think a shin pinch is the same thing as a lethwei pinch.

rw4th
1/11/2007 3:46am,
He couldn't find any cons for Tai Chi?

alex
1/11/2007 3:53am,
funny, since when he wrote that groin attacks were still legal in muay thai Diesel Noi, a fighter in the 80s, was famous for breaking balls. my guess? he didnt know what the **** he was talking about.

Godhand
1/11/2007 8:21am,
The Muay Thai Bruce Lee was exposed too at that time was rubbish according to Dan Inosanto, who certainly deserves some credit for popularizing the art in the US. Most of Bruce Research was gained from books, crappy photos, or watered down techniques hed been shown by people who had dabbled in the art. Also, back then, alot of Muay Thai DID have crappy hand work and was more traditional and less mobile than it is now.

OnceLost
1/11/2007 8:33am,
Could anyone speak to how much actual experience BL had with the other styles he evaluated?

jubei33
1/11/2007 8:42am,
yeah i wonder if this was just his 'work in progress' that was accidentally published to finish his book. Seems like a pretty incomplete analysis even for some of the arts that he wrote the most on.

OnceLost
1/11/2007 9:02am,
If that was a posthumous publication, he may never have intended to share his 'working notes.' Not that I'm defending him, but he could have heard about muay thai, written a couple of notes and decided to look into it more later...

sempaiman
1/11/2007 9:31am,
He forgot good old fashion fisticuffs.