PDA

View Full Version : First day of rolling in BJJ



Pages : [1] 2

infinite su 47
12/21/2006 10:17pm,
I started BJJ a couple of days ago and decided to go to my first open mat tonight.
This was my first time really sparring and it just so happens that my old HS gym teacher has been training at this school.

So we rolled and i got his back rather quickly...but i couldn't get RNC in well enough to choke him out. I don't know if it was just the fact that he was much stronger then me and was defending it well?....or if i was doing something wrong?.... or it might have been the fact that he has really short neck? Pretty chunky guy probably around 5'7 210 lbs, me 5'11 145 lbs (yes i know, plz don't criticize my size).

Getting his back felt really easy and this is why it pissed me off so much...I felt like i had everything in place except for the fact that i had trouble getting under his chin and finishing the choke. Any pointers from the BJJ guys?

ViciousFlamingo
12/21/2006 10:49pm,
First of all, check out Stephan Kesting's short lesson on finishing the RNC (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6415236617134943507&sourceid=docidfeed&hl=en).

That should help you tighten up applying the RNC. However, in my own limited experience, I've found that finishing the RNC is only part of the problem. If you can only use one move to attack, and your opponent knows it, he'll be able to defend it really well.

So, learn three or four more basic, high-percentage attacks from the back. This will be slightly easier if you're training in a gi, but not totally. If you don't have preferences for the attacks, here are some suggestions (although I'm sure there are some attacks that I haven't included).

Learn a collar choke (http://www.aesopian.com/20/basic-rear-collar-choke/) (or two). If you're doing no-gi, learn to do the air choke (http://www.mmalibrary.com/tech_display.asp?id=134) with the forearm. (Not a bad idea to learn otherwise, too.)

Learn the transition from choke to armbar (http://www.mmalibrary.com/tech_display.asp?id=74). (The tutorial uses a collar choke, but you can make it work easily no-gi. Also, be sure to check out the chokes shown in the tutorial, they're good to know.)

Learn the transition from choke to triangle (http://www.mmalibrary.com/tech_display.asp?id=75).

Go back, drill the position, drill the attacks, drill and drill again. As you're drilling and rolling, keep flowing from attack to attack, don't get stuck.

And don't worry! This is your first day rolling! Mat time cures all worries BJJ-related (with the exception of bacterial and fungal infections). You've had a good experience. My first day, I tapped like a friggin' typewriter, and that was just the first half-hour.

pauli
12/21/2006 11:22pm,
Getting his back felt really easy and this is why it pissed me off so much...I felt like i had everything in place except for the fact that i had trouble getting under his chin and finishing the choke. Any pointers from the BJJ guys?don't be surprised if a more experienced student let's you get into a good position so you can both work it. i was in the exact same position as you wednesday, except i wasn't pissed off and the guy i couldn't choke (or get both hooks in on) was a black belt, so it wasn't terribly surprising.

also, you can always ask your partner "what was i doing wrong?"

ViciousFlamingo
12/21/2006 11:29pm,
don't be surprised if a more experienced student let's you get into a good position so you can both work it. i was in the exact same position as you wednesday, except i wasn't pissed off and the guy i couldn't choke (or get both hooks in on) was a black belt, so it wasn't terribly surprising.

also, you can always ask your partner "what was i doing wrong?"

Yeah, forgot to mention that. Experienced students will give up things to let you into their game to let you work things, or to work on things themselves.

Oh, and change the "can always ask" to "should always ask". I forget the thread (do a search on newbie tips for bjj), but it's really, REALLY helpful to ask for advice. Experienced students will always know what you're doing wrong, but often they won't say it because they feel uncomfortable telling you because they think it might make them seem arrogant. Make it easier on them by asking them constantly for advice, or what you did wrong, or whatever. Ask questions like you're back in elementary school.

pauli
12/21/2006 11:38pm,
Ask questions like you're back in elementary school.the best question i've ever been asked on the mats: "have you ever eaten a bug?"

pauli
12/22/2006 12:02am,
"i can't say that i have."

infinite su 47
12/22/2006 2:37am,
Thanks for the advice.

slideyfoot
12/22/2006 4:08am,
Welcome to Bullshido!

I'd strongly advise you to read the following threads:

First Day Lesson ( http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showpost.php?p=1232603)
Fundamental 5 ( http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showpost.php?p=1019474)
Maximizing what you get out of rolling ( http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showpost.php?p=1253088)
Protecting Yourself During Sparring ( http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showpost.php?p=1234198)
Training, Stagnation and Tapping ( http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showpost.php?p=974042[/url)

I'm a noob myself (started about a month and a half ago, just got my first stripe), and found those very useful. Also, if you can manage :20bux:, I find the training logs section is very motivating, both in terms of writing my own log and reading others.

Punisher
12/22/2006 4:58am,
Your first day of rolling went a lot better than mine. I got paired with an asshole blue belt who heard I have black belts in two types of kenpo and wanted to make an example of me. After tapping me quickly a couple of times with an armbar and a triangle he got my back and proceeded to try and choke me out.

It seemed to piss him off that I was able to defend enough that he couldn't get that on me too. When we done I had a busted lip from his forearm sawing across my face as he was trying to secure the choke. Afterward he just said "good choke defense" and walked away.

infinite su 47
12/22/2006 4:29pm,
It seemed to piss him off that I was able to defend enough that he couldn't get that on me too. When we done I had a busted lip from his forearm sawing across my face as he was trying to secure the choke. Afterward he just said "good choke defense" and walked away.


I felt like that was me trying to put the choke under his chin just squeezing his face. Other then throwing punches to the side of his head (which is not legal in BJJ) what else can i do for him to extend his neck so i can sink it in? i had my legs hooked...mb extend my legs?

Punisher
12/22/2006 4:41pm,
I felt like that was me trying to put the choke under his chin just squeezing his face. Other then throwing punches to the side of his head (which is not legal in BJJ) what else can i do for him to extend his neck so i can sink it in? i had my legs hooked...mb extend my legs?


I'm not qualified to answer your question, but in my instance it seem like the blue belt was digging his forearm in to by mouth to get me to raise my chin so he could slip under and get the choke. Knowing how much trouble I was in, I just bared down, took the pain, and pushed my chin to my chest further.

My best guess on how to get someone to raise their chin is to apply pressure higher up on the head where you would have more leverage or to momentartily let go and reattack with the other arm or a different angle.

slideyfoot
12/22/2006 4:45pm,
Other then throwing punches to the side of his head (which is not legal in BJJ) what else can i do for him to extend his neck so i can sink it in? i had my legs hooked...mb extend my legs?

Best thing to do is ask your instructor to show you next time you're in class (after all, you're paying him/her :icon_wink), or one of the senior belts. You can get useful supplements to your training on the internet - asking questions on forums like this, videos, technique archives like Lockflow etc - but the only way you're going to get a technique right is by first getting someone experienced to demonstrate, then drilling it on the mat.

jnp
12/22/2006 5:37pm,
Best thing to do is ask your instructor to show you next time you're in class (after all, you're paying him/her :icon_wink), or one of the senior belts. You can get useful supplements to your training on the internet - asking questions on forums like this, videos, technique archives like Lockflow etc - but the only way you're going to get a technique right is by first getting someone experienced to demonstrate, then drilling it on the mat.
This is a damn good response for a beginner. I'm not really surprised because Slideyfoot comes off as intelligent when posting.

There are a number of techniques to cause your opponent to raise his head, ranging from brute force (non-choking hand across forehead, force head back, quickly insert choking arm under jaw) to more technical tactics that involve deception.

The problem is that there are literally hundreds of other factors involved. Is your choking arm in good position? Do you even understand the RNC in the first place? Did you stretch him out to make his defense weaker? Consequently the person most qualified to assist you is your instructor. There is no substitute for actually being a few feet away from you and the ability to point out your mistakes.

The further you progress in grappling the more you will understand it's the small details that separate a great grappler from a lousy or even mediocre one.

UpaLumpa
12/22/2006 5:47pm,
Your first day of rolling went a lot better than mine. I got paired with an asshole blue belt who heard I have black belts in two types of kenpo and wanted to make an example of me. After tapping me quickly a couple of times with an armbar and a triangle he got my back and proceeded to try and choke me out.

It seemed to piss him off that I was able to defend enough that he couldn't get that on me too. When we done I had a busted lip from his forearm sawing across my face as he was trying to secure the choke. Afterward he just said "good choke defense" and walked away.
Maybe he was just impressed you weren't a complete bitch.

NunOnBreak
12/23/2006 12:48am,
Your first day of rolling went a lot better than mine. I got paired with an asshole blue belt who heard I have black belts in two types of kenpo and wanted to make an example of me. After tapping me quickly a couple of times with an armbar and a triangle he got my back and proceeded to try and choke me out.

It seemed to piss him off that I was able to defend enough that he couldn't get that on me too. When we done I had a busted lip from his forearm sawing across my face as he was trying to secure the choke. Afterward he just said "good choke defense" and walked away.

Doh. I was that jerk when we were rolling in my Kajukenbo class the other day. The guy I was rolling with is a kenpo brown belt so he is good at the kicks and punches I have never done since I come from a Judo background. It felt good submitting him repeatedly despite his weight and strength advantage.

I think my sensei was watching because he didn't hold back at all when we switched partners and it was our turn to roll.

Punisher
12/23/2006 3:27am,
I can see the need to humble or even potentially weed out assholes. In my case I wasn't bragging or boasting about my background or trying to come off as hot ****. Quite the opposite. I was asked if I had previous martial arts experience when I signed up, and I was truthful. I believe my exact answer was "Yeah, I have a black belt in a couple of types of karate, but no grappling experience so that's not going to matter here."