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Virus
9/08/2006 11:05am,
Thread over on E-budo regarding the bujinkan's history and possible fraud, corruption, betrayal, drama and a little bit of sex. (ok just kidding about that last one).

http://www.e-budo.com/forum/showthread.php?t=35175&page=1&pp=15

Questions raied by this article include:

Did Takamatsu invent seven of the nine ryu-ha of the bujinkan?

Is Hatsumi a genius manipulator and buisnessman who built a cult around a ninja mythos he knew wasn't true?

Are the bujinkan politics really feuds over who gets a slice of the multi-million dollar (tax free) pie?

The thread was called "The Secret History of the Bujinkan, and how it relates to Pammachon." and was originally posted on a Greek language bujinkan forum by an old-timer in the system. Much heated discussion was generated by this. The reason I found it interesting is that you can find drips and drabs of dirt on the bujinkan's history scatterd about on forums and usenet posts but this is a pretty big airing of dirty laundery and seems to bring together several disparate aspects about the organisation into something cohesive. Now it should be rememberd that little hard evidence is presented, but the story does make a type of logical sence.

Phrost
9/08/2006 11:07am,
Good find. We need a comprehensive investigation and article on the Bujinkan.

shinbushi
9/08/2006 12:09pm,
Good Luck.
The best possibel researcher would be Mongo bewing in Japan and all but, who and where would you go to for information except from disgrunteled Ex-Bujinkan.

Raven_J
9/08/2006 12:10pm,
Wow.... it all makes sense now... I might show my sensei that post.

rw4th
9/08/2006 12:39pm,
Both Hatsumi and Hayes followed the L. Ron Hubbard business plan; start a religion, make money.

Hayes' Quest Center/To-Shin-Do cult is the scariest of both in my opinion though.

eyebeams
9/08/2006 12:46pm,
I wouldn't mind getting my hands on that Ten-Chi-Jin document that is referred to as a legitimate form of training.

Virus
9/08/2006 12:59pm,
I wouldn't mind getting my hands on that Ten-Chi-Jin document that is referred to as a legitimate form of training.

I have a copy. It's nothing special. For instance:

"HIBARI (Skylark)

The attacker steps in with a right high lunge punch. The defender drops forward
and right to a crouching position on his right knee with both hands on the ground. Defender the springs up with a double punch, loops his right arm under the attacker's left, and executes a GANSEKI NAGE forward hip throw with a leg sweep."

A typical technique entry reads like that.

eyebeams
9/08/2006 1:06pm,
Also, somebody might want to save this article somewhere as this stuff has a tendency to disappear.

plasma
9/08/2006 1:13pm,
My Piece:

Togakure Ryu is invented by Takamatsu in the 50s, his scrolls were written by Takamatsu.

Kumogakure Ryu Ninpo - made up
Gyokushin Ryu Ninpo - made up

As for the rest. They have their own lineage Grandmaster, none of them is Hatsumi

plasma
9/08/2006 1:18pm,
I have a copy. It's nothing special. For instance:

"HIBARI (Skylark)

The attacker steps in with a right high lunge punch. The defender drops forward
and right to a crouching position on his right knee with both hands on the ground. Defender the springs up with a double punch, loops his right arm under the attacker's left, and executes a GANSEKI NAGE forward hip throw with a leg sweep."

A typical technique entry reads like that.


Thats is the jist of the document.

plasma
9/08/2006 1:24pm,
During this period, Hatsumi Sensei had determined that hard training does not sell well, and came up with the kata-based, free-variation, no-resistance training that made his fortune and has characterized the Bujinkan since the mid-eighties. Concurrently, he hyped up the ninja image once again, because Steve had proven that it worked, and stirred in all the trappings – the patches, black uniforms, construction worker’s tabi, exotic weapons, talcum powder, etc. Circa 1988-89 Fumio Manaka gave a series of private seminars in the States, for the most part to my own students, in which he presented the individual ryu-ha kata material. It went over really big. That was the final piece of the puzzle for Hatsumi Sensei. The Bujinkan took wing. Bujinkan students did kata, non-resisting, and did continuous henka, just like “The Old Man”. The difference was, the Old Man had a lifetime of serious martial arts training behind him, and he was, well, old.

That paragraph somes up the Bujinkan.

Teh El Macho
9/08/2006 1:24pm,
Both Hatsumi and Hayes followed the L. Ron Hubbard business plan; start a religion, make money.

Hayes' Quest Center/To-Shin-Do cult is the scariest of both in my opinion though.So bujinkaners are like thetan with tabi boots?

plasma
9/08/2006 1:26pm,
In any case, the more serious Shihan in the Bujinkan started to ask themselves… “what da f, homes?” Tanemura Sensei had already bolted out of there, establishing his own organization. Manaka Sensei followed. Several prominent teachers had also quietly resigned in the early 80s (I trained with one in 86, Kobayashi, just before he slipped away; he did not believe that the school should be opened to foreigners, but that is should be kept closed, esoteric, with the teachings only for Japanese). The continuous series of resignations, objections and quiet withdrawals by Japanese and Western students left Hatsumi Sensei in a quandary. What to do? Aha!! As it turned out, in fact Hatsumi Sensei had NOT imparted upon these instructors “the real knowledge” inherent to the Bujinkan (even though some of them had been with him for 35 years), but was in fact waiting to pass it on to the many Westerners now in the organization! Brilliant!! Hence in the last ten years we have seen, and continue to see, an onset of new material based on the secret knowledge of the nine ryu-ha.

lol....nice.

eyebeams
9/08/2006 1:31pm,
Thats is the jist of the document.

Still piques my interest. I follow the Booj stuff mostly because I briefly took instruction from a guy under Hayes who could actually fight. So I do have a few, strictly qualified, positive opinions about the delivery system, though not the implementation, of those arts.

plasma
9/08/2006 1:36pm,
If you read the link in the first post it mentions how orginally BJK training was harsh, hard and brutal. That is was kata-ified for marketing purposes.

plasma
9/08/2006 2:11pm,
Did Takamatsu invent seven of the nine ryu-ha of the bujinkan?




Virus this is never addressed in the article, what it attack is his "ninja" Ryu-ha. Aka the ones I posted above. The other 6 are real ryu-ha taught outside the x-kans. However, Hatsumi isn't the Soke of them.