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Hyperion
8/30/2006 12:43am,
I guess I should post an introduction here so that everyone can read it once and forget about it.

I have been training in Taekwondo for the past two years. Yes, I understand that most people here think that it's the worst style ever because they saw some guy from a mcdojo get his ass kicked because his instructor never bothered to actually teach him how to fight. People who tell me that I'm a ***** and Taekwondo isn't a real martial art because we don't fight hard should also remember to add that I'm either making up or imagining the bruised sternum, busted achilles tendon, concussion, countless dislocated toes, etc.

Anyways, I originally started training in taekwondo as a way to deal with a neurological condition, and it definitely helped. I meant knowing that I had to train harder than others, but the flip side was that once we strapped on the gloves and stepped onto the mat, none of it mattered. My first sparring match, I told the guy not to go easy on me...wound up eating a roundhouse kick to the head. Kept fighting. Definitely solidified myself as the black sheep of the department in college when I'd sit through poli-sci classes with bruises up and down my arms and shoulders from blocking axe-kicks the night before.

As I see the martial arts, we train to fight. I agree that it's about fighting, because it would be fairly stupid to spend hours practicing punching and kicking, getting kicked in the head and pulling and straining every muscle in your body otherwise. There are easier ways to impress chicks and there are easier ways to seek enlightenment. That being said, I do strongly believe that discipline is an essential part of becoming a better fighter. Every military force in the history of civilization has stressed the importance of discipline, as has every competent military writer from Sun-Tzu to Clausewitz.

Discipline can be as simple as working out when you'd rather be partying, and as hard as knowing when it's simply not worth fighting. It can be as important as keeping calm under pressure and remembering your training, to as trivial as keeping your uniform clean and folded.

Respect is important because people will teach you if you respect that they have been doing this since before you were born, and if you sit down and shut up, you might just learn something. I don't bow to Master Y. just because he runs the school, I bow to him because I respect the fact that he is a helluva lot better than I am and I want to learn how he does it so that I can become better.

Honor is important because nobody likes assholes. Oh, they might fear you, they might not want you to kick their asses, but they're not going to like you and they're not going to trust you. Plus, if you're any good at fighting, you can afford to be nice to people and act honorably, because who's going to **** with you? That really screws with people's heads, too:

"You wanna fight?"

"What do I have to prove by fighting you, there's no honor in beating the weak."


Oh, and during the day I advise physicians. They think it's amusing that after helping them extend people's lives, I go off to work on finding more efficient ways to end them.

Moleculo
8/30/2006 1:09am,
People who tell me that I'm a ***** and Taekwondo isn't a real martial art because we don't fight hard should also remember to add that I'm either making up or imagining the bruised sternum, busted achilles tendon, concussion, countless dislocated toes, etc.


fighting hard and fighting well are not the same thing.

Moleculo
8/30/2006 1:13am,
Oh, and during the day I advise physicians. They think it's amusing that after helping them extend people's lives, I go off to work on finding more efficient ways to end them.
So you think that TKD is the most efficient way to kill someone?

Wow.

inimitable_1
8/30/2006 1:18am,
Well.. yeah that was a huge introduction/lecture... but welcome to Bullshido

Hyperion
8/30/2006 2:26am,
fighting hard and fighting well are not the same thing.

Yes, I know that. Getting hurt is part of what motivates one to learn to fight well, no? My main point was that too many people hear "taekwondo" and assume that you don't actually fight, or that it's somehow sanitized and safe.



So you think that TKD is the most efficient way to kill someone?

Wow.

Did I say that it was the most efficient way to kill someone? I said that at night I work on becoming more efficient, although even then it was a joke, contrast to my day job. Besides, the point of fighting isn't necessarily to try to kill someone. It would be unfortunate if that occurred, although clearly there are situations where it would be necessary and justifiable (self-defense, defense of others).

alex
8/30/2006 3:37am,
I have been training in Taekwondo for the past two years. Yes, I understand that most people here think that it's the worst style ever because they saw some guy from a mcdojo get his ass kicked because his instructor never bothered to actually teach him how to fight. People who tell me that I'm a ***** and Taekwondo isn't a real martial art because we don't fight hard should also remember to add that I'm either making up or imagining the bruised sternum, busted achilles tendon, concussion, countless dislocated toes, etc.
good for you, i know rugby players who have had concussions. doesnt mean they know how to fight.


Anyways, I originally started training in taekwondo as a way to deal with a neurological condition, and it definitely helped. I meant knowing that I had to train harder than others, but the flip side was that once we strapped on the gloves and stepped onto the mat, none of it mattered. My first sparring match, I told the guy not to go easy on me...wound up eating a roundhouse kick to the head. Kept fighting. Definitely solidified myself as the black sheep of the department in college when I'd sit through poli-sci classes with bruises up and down my arms and shoulders from blocking axe-kicks the night before. dude you are just so fucking tough. would you autograph my tits? tip- im betting no one in your poi-sci class could give 2 shits and probably wonders what that dork whos mum beats his ass is doing showing his bruises off.


As I see the martial arts, we train to fight. I agree that it's about fighting, because it would be fairly stupid to spend hours practicing punching and kicking, getting kicked in the head and pulling and straining every muscle in your body otherwise. There are easier ways to impress chicks and there are easier ways to seek enlightenment. That being said, I do strongly believe that discipline is an essential part of becoming a better fighter. Every military force in the history of civilization has stressed the importance of discipline, as has every competent military writer from Sun-Tzu to Clausewitz. don't you hate people who just write **** for the sake of writing ****? and anyway its already been ascertained on this site that people only do tkd for the chicks.


Discipline can be as simple as working out when you'd rather be partying, and as hard as knowing when it's simply not worth fighting. It can be as important as keeping calm under pressure and remembering your training, to as trivial as keeping your uniform clean and folded. getting drunk and rowdy is a special part of MA training not to be discarded, unlike the boxing wraps and shorts festering in my bag


Respect is important because people will teach you if you respect that they have been doing this since before you were born, and if you sit down and shut up, you might just learn something. I don't bow to Master Y. just because he runs the school, I bow to him because I respect the fact that he is a helluva lot better than I am and I want to learn how he does it so that I can become better. well thats one thing i can agree with, bowing and scraping to people just because they have a darker belt is moronic


Honor is important because nobody likes assholes. Oh, they might fear you, they might not want you to kick their asses, but they're not going to like you and they're not going to trust you. Plus, if you're any good at fighting, you can afford to be nice to people and act honorably, because who's going to **** with you? That really screws with people's heads, too:

"You wanna fight?"

"What do I have to prove by fighting you, there's no honor in beating the weak."


Oh, and during the day I advise physicians. They think it's amusing that after helping them extend people's lives, I go off to work on finding more efficient ways to end them.

trust me, no one thinks you are a badass because you wear pyjamas and dance around pretending to be a korean pretending to be japanese.

Lv1Sierpinski
8/30/2006 4:21am,
dude you are just so fucking tough. would you autograph my tits? That's what I love about being down here...you just don't get enough American guys talking about their tits.

Welcome.

alex
8/30/2006 4:22am,
well you know hobbit females havent got much in the chest region so we just talk about our own tits

Hyperion
8/30/2006 5:50pm,
Hey, I was just tryng to point out that your idiotic notions of TKD need some adjustment.

I'm smart enough to judge Muay Thai on the skills of actual Thai fighters, which I respect immensely, and not dumbshit pricks like you.

I mean, I don't go around talking **** about how Muay Thai is just a bunch of pimply faced virgin Lord-of-the-Rings watching fuckwads with penis envy just because of your picture, do I? That would just be stupid. Clearly there are many skilled practitioners of Muay Thai out there (and they're a lot of fun to watch), so I'm not going to judge them by your stupidity.

Oh, by the way, isn't this the Noob forum? Not that I really care, post whatever flames you want and put your stupidity on display in bright neon letters.

I'd write more, but Wednesday's sparring night.

G8
8/30/2006 6:02pm,
I have been training in Taekwondo for the past two years. Yes, I understand that most people here think that it's the worst style ever because they saw some guy from a mcdojo get his ass kicked because his instructor never bothered to actually teach him how to fight. People who tell me that I'm a ***** and Taekwondo isn't a real martial art because we don't fight hard should also remember to add that I'm either making up or imagining the bruised sternum, busted achilles tendon, concussion, countless dislocated toes, etc.


many of the posters here bust on TKD not because we've seen a youtube video or two but because we've trained extensively both in it and other styles. yes, you can hurt and get hurt sparring TKD, of course, and I've known TKD students who were pretty tough--but that doesn't change the fact that it trains numerous suboptimal techniques in suboptimal fashion, or the fact that anyone who fights strictly according to its precepts will get his ass handed to him by a cross-trained fighter 9 times in 10.

alex
8/30/2006 6:03pm,
relax man, im just talking ****. if you get antsy over that you wont want to step far out of newbie town. you have to admit that your first post did come across as a BIT of a "Jake the muss" intro- people who talk about being tough guys (and actually mean it) aren't very well recieved here.

Hyperion
8/30/2006 8:30pm,
No worries, I was ragging on you too a bit...it just came out a little less than coherent since I had like 5 minutes in between working on DNR requests and sparring.

I didn't want to come off as a tough guy, I just didn't want a million people telling me "hey, you guys don't really fight" or something like that, or assuming that I was training at a Mcdojo. That's what I like about what you guys are doing, because crappy training masquerading as Martial Arts hurts us the most.

Anyways, yes, you guys are right that olympic style Taekwondo involves suboptimal techniques. I sometimes forget that a lot of people train only in Olympic Taekwondo. We do train in that stuff, but like tonight's match, we did what we call "traditional" sparring rules. I guess we use "sport" and "traditional" in the opposite of how you guys means it.

Anyways, when we go traditional, we use leg kicks, punches to the head (although not full contact to the head when we're just practicing), sometimes we'll go freestyle and allow grabs and holds, depending on what we need to work on.

The kiddies still do Olympic style, and we sometimes will if it's a larger group, especially mixed gender. But yeah, tonight I forgot and blocked a leg kick with my lead hand (because Olympic style you would do that) and was reminded of why that is a bad idea. You guys didn't think that we weren't aware of the limitations of the olympic-style, did you?

alex
8/30/2006 8:32pm,
i remember learning to block leg kicks with a downward block in kung fu... that was a painful lesson when i switched to MT

Hyperion
8/30/2006 10:33pm,
Yeah, but what I love about sparring is that those lessons tend to stick. What's interesting about traditional taekwondo sparring, though, is that even when you add the leg kicks and head punches, and the slight changes in stance that it requires, the style is still taekwondo, and you see that it really is a useful style if applied correctly. There's still the speed, the quick movements and fast kicks that come flying in from all angles. The close-in action gets a little more interesting, leg kicks being countered with axe kicks, front kicks become knee strikes, roundhouse kicks become leg kicks. Fun stuff.

alex
8/30/2006 11:55pm,
how on earth do you counter a leg kick with an axe kick? i mean, maybe if the leg kick was the slowest thing since a man covered in honey tried to run across the desert...

G8
8/31/2006 11:21am,
Anyways, yes, you guys are right that olympic style Taekwondo involves suboptimal techniques. I sometimes forget that a lot of people train only in Olympic Taekwondo. We do train in that stuff, but like tonight's match, we did what we call "traditional" sparring rules. I guess we use "sport" and "traditional" in the opposite of how you guys means it.

Anyways, when we go traditional, we use leg kicks, punches to the head (although not full contact to the head when we're just practicing), sometimes we'll go freestyle and allow grabs and holds, depending on what we need to work on.

The kiddies still do Olympic style, and we sometimes will if it's a larger group, especially mixed gender. But yeah, tonight I forgot and blocked a leg kick with my lead hand (because Olympic style you would do that) and was reminded of why that is a bad idea. You guys didn't think that we weren't aware of the limitations of the olympic-style, did you?

Suboptimal techniques and training in TKD aren't limited to Olympic style, sorry. You still spar out of back/side stances, right? You're still taught chambered punches from the horse stance, reverse punches, knife hands, rising blocks etc., right? I don't care how hard you spar or under what rule set, training that **** is a waste of time, and employing it in any context other than a limited-contact, no-takedowns-allowed match against another TKDer is a good way to get your ass kicked.