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Cdnronin
4/01/2006 3:03pm,
Thought it would be a good idea to break off the video clips from the other thread to concentrate on them separately and leave the history alone.
http://video.tinypic.com/player.php?v=sg74mp

http://www.zippyvideos.com/4085184044519816/fsd-intro/

http://www.zippyvideos.com/3556767234519866/grappling-intro/

http://www.zippyvideos.com/8533047494519886/takedown7/

http://www.zippyvideos.com/4350292464519946/takedown12/

I would like to see a technical breakdown of the techniques, preferably from someone with a Wing chun background, as well as commentary on general effectiveness, possible counters, etc.

Askari
4/01/2006 3:11pm,
Hi CDNRonin,
I previously posted the follwing other thread. I will take the time to go through each of these videos. For you now that there is a place for them.

So lets do an analysis of that Phon Sao Video shall we?

Partner A is the initial Attacker,
Partner B is the initial defender.

Partner B (The short guy on the right with the yellow belt) nods his head to let his attacker know that he is confident and that now is the time to attack.

Partner A (That's the bigger guy on the left) throws a fully extended punch that stops well short of Partner B's head. Contemptously waiting until after the punch comes to a complete stop, Partner B then raises his hand in some sort of blocking motion, perhaps intended to be a Bong Sao that rolls to a Ton Sao, only perhaps visualizing that he is swating a fly.

Partner B then traps the fully extended arm that is still sitting with the fist in front of his face (using what vaguely like a Wing Chun Pak Sao, but low end) of Partner B and throws a punch that also stops fully extended about a foot short of Partner A's head. Partner A does a very soft Pak Sao (after the punch has already stopped) that Partner B will then Chin Sao around, but man that is a sloppy Chin Sao.

Partner B looks away from his attacker and proceeds to attempt to trap the forearms of his partner A downwards (these would usually be called a Chin Sao and a Gum Sao in Wing Chun) then to flick his fingers around the kneck of Partner A in what looks like an attempt at a series of edge of hand blows. Since Partner B is not in any way comparable to a Carl Cestari, Partner A suffers no damage.

View This Video (http://video.tinypic.com/player.php?v=sg74mp)

illegal entry
4/01/2006 3:17pm,
http://www.zippyvideos.com/8533047494519886/takedown7/


Very good takedown, if you don't mind the fact that the plonker is standing still with his right hand in the other guys face for about 4 seconds, AFTER THAT the other guy reacts, twists the guys wrist a little without any reaction or any sign of a defense/counter from him, and suddenly the attacker falls over, voila!



http://www.zippyvideos.com/4350292464519946/takedown12/


Here's a good idea! Lets punch the air, stand still after we've extended our arm, with our chin up in the air in a perfect position for someone to pull it back!

I'll just quote GoldenJonas for this one:

"Score:

Submissions - 0
Submission Attempts - 0
To Deadly For "Actual" Use Techniques - 10
Chance of getting stomped by anyone who is NOT in a vegitative state - 100%"

Cdnronin
4/01/2006 3:21pm,
Very good takedown, if you don't mind the fact that the plonker is standing still with his right hand in the other guys face for about 4 seconds, AFTER THAT the other guy reacts, twists the guys wrist a little without any reaction or any sign of a defense/counter from him, and suddenly the attacker falls over, voila!



Here's a good idea! Lets punch the air, stand still after we've extended our arm, with our chin up in the air in a perfect position for someone to pull it back!

I'll just quote GoldenJonas for this one:

"Score:

Submissions - 0
Submission Attempts - 0
To Deadly For "Actual" Use Techniques - 10
Chance of getting stomped by anyone who is NOT in a vegitative state - 100%"
So, are you saying, no?

It is Fake
4/01/2006 3:27pm,
I like how the anti-grapple and wrist-locks are spoken in the same sentence as BJJ.

The fact that he is trying to imply a connection between his **** and BJJ is outrageous.

Now this is entertainment.

illegal entry
4/01/2006 3:28pm,
I'm in no way good at grappling as such, but from looking at those clips, they show all the stuff against someone who stands about and does absolutely nil to resist it. And honestly, how good does dodging a cross, going behind the guy, and pulling his chin backwards to make him fall over sound to you? If someone tried that I'd just try to elbow the _ing _unner in the face when I pull back my right hand. Compared that to different Judo throws or say a double leg takedown... So pretty much, No, it isn't effective. Sure, it might work in some way, but then again there's ALOT of things that would work much better then those two takedowns you linked.

TKD Black Belt
4/01/2006 3:34pm,
Very good takedown, if you don't mind the fact that the plonker is standing still with his right hand in the other guys face for about 4 seconds, AFTER THAT the other guy reacts, twists the guys wrist a little without any reaction or any sign of a defense/counter from him, and suddenly the attacker falls over, voila!

As I said on an earlier thread, this is the same move Fedor uses except that when Fedor does it it looks like a double leg!

TKD

I'm working on a Brokeback Kung Fu thing right now but can't figure out how to call Fang Shen Do (hmm what about Fang Shen Doo Doo?) ghey without just coming out and saying it.

illegal entry
4/01/2006 3:44pm,
As I said on an earlier thread, this is the same move Fedor uses except that when Fedor does it it looks like a double leg!

So Fedor actually got all his wins and became the Pride Champion thanks to _ing _un? Interesting.

TKD Black Belt
4/01/2006 4:23pm,
Absolutely although some credit is given to Fedor's background in Sambo, BJJ, Kickboxing and wrestling, it is actually his _ing _un training.

Here is an excellent example of very high end _ing _un!

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1499390000238023472&q=fedor+and+randleman&pl=true

Christmas Spirit
4/01/2006 5:06pm,
Absolutely although some credit is given to Fedor's background in Sambo, BJJ, Kickboxing and wrestling, it is actually his _ing _un training.

Here is an excellent example of very high end _ing _un!

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1499390000238023472&q=fedor+and+randleman&pl=true


That is some DAMN GOOD _ing _un .

Thank you so very much for sharing it . I know understand why they drill instead of spar .

Stringfellow
4/01/2006 6:56pm,
Well now, to be completely fair (yeah, leave it to me to ruin everybody's fun - I know), these clips are from an instructional video, where the guy is being cooperative.

That said, anyone want to give pecentages on each technique working on an uncooperative opponent? I mean, if we're going to pick these apart, let's be specific, eh.

Christmas Spirit
4/01/2006 7:21pm,
Well now, to be completely fair (yeah, leave it to me to ruin everybody's fun - I know), these clips are from an instructional video, where the guy is being cooperative.

That said, anyone want to give pecentages on each technique working on an uncooperative opponent? I mean, if we're going to pick these apart, let's be specific, eh.

http://video.tinypic.com/player.php?v=sg74mp

Phon Sao #15
extremely low %

Throw a left cross with that first crappy floppy right jab , instead of using it to slap at the little fellows guard .

OR

Cover up , then clinch the little fucktard , throw him down and kick him in his face for slapping at you when you have a 50 lbs and a number of inches on him .

OR

Throw a second and/or third strike driving through his feeble guard .

TKD Black Belt
4/01/2006 8:37pm,
BFM no worries, as you can see the man they call Kevin of Randleman was able to properly use 'anti-grappling' in his fight against _ing _un Supreme Soke Fedor.

TKD

Stringfellow
4/01/2006 9:15pm,
http://video.tinypic.com/player.php?v=sg74mp

Phon Sao #15
extremely low %

Throw a left cross with that first crappy floppy right jab , instead of using it to slap at the little fellows guard .

OR

Cover up , then clinch the little fucktard , throw him down and kick him in his face for slapping at you when you have a 50 lbs and a number of inches on him .

OR

Throw a second and/or third strike driving through his feeble guard .

Now we're talking. :eusa_clap

Christmas Spirit
4/01/2006 9:21pm,
http://www.zippyvideos.com/8533047494519886/takedown7/

Takedown 7
LOW %

again you throw punches in bunches ... defense falls to crap .


the wristlock ... well it could work against a severely drunk attacker ... who is frail .. and limp wristed when he/she punches with single hand strike . The lock also hinges on catching and trapping the arm well enough to control the wrist by the palm and back of hand . You then have to move forward into the attackers space to set/sink the lock in . During this time you are going to eat a hook or cross .

* groans *

I don't want to watch it anymore to pick it apart . It sucks ... I mean just look at those vids .. christ almighty what the **** are they thinking ?

Askari
4/02/2006 12:28am,
To be completely fair, a Pak Sao (which is very similiar to a A boxing parry (http://www.boxing4free.com/theparry.html)) is a very effective way of dealing with a jab.

There are a couple of Pak Saos contained within that Phon Sao Video. Just to take the time and wade through that amount of crap to get that one good nugget seems to me a like taking the long trip to the supermarket, instead of going to the one just across the street.

There probably are a fair number of fairly effective techniques completely hidden within Fang Shen Do -- that is, even hidden from the guys in the video as they dont seem to have a clue as to how to parry a punch.