PDA

View Full Version : BJJ/Judo Teach Sub-Optimal Striking. Bullshido arts or not?



Pages : [1] 2 3 4

PirateJon
2/09/2006 4:15pm,
Both judo and bjj teach a form of striking which is very limited compared to MT/Boxing/krotty.

Does this make those arts bullshido? If not, why not?

plasma
2/09/2006 4:17pm,
By that same logic Boxing is Bullshido because it doesn't teach grappling.

Bullshido is making false claims of effectiveness. If a BJJ instructor said that BJJ is the best striking art, that would be Bullshido. But BJJ isn't bullshido becuase it doesn't include an array of strikes.

dramaboy
2/09/2006 4:19pm,
One word: Judo chop. TWO words, that is...

:icon_cool

Tomas

Darkpaladin
2/09/2006 4:20pm,
Both judo and bjj teach a form of striking which is very limited compared to MT/Boxing/krotty.

Does this make those arts bullshido? If not, why not?

I don't know, I'd put money on a BJJ striking arsenal against a krotty striking arsenal anyday. It's hard to do a spinning reverse knife fist strike from the bottom of the mount.

Cassius
2/09/2006 4:23pm,
BBC members: http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?p=871396#post871396

Read through the last few pages of that to get a context of what PirateJon is talking about.

plasma
2/09/2006 4:24pm,
I don't know, I'd put money on a BJJ striking arsenal against a krotty striking arsenal anyday. It's hard to do a spinning reverse knife fist strike from the bottom of the mount.

Ok (same logic) so its bullshido cause it doesn't include weapons.

Because as art doesn't include something doesn't make it bullshido, making false claims does.

God fucking damn.

Roidie McDouchebag
2/09/2006 4:35pm,
Why didn't you make a poll!?

So, to answer the question.

It isn't Bullshido, because it's not crap.

If you had experience with it, it would be worth giving you a more detailed answer, but seeing as you don't know what you're talking about and insist on asserting illogical poo, you get a stupid answer to your stupid question.

PirateJon
2/09/2006 4:51pm,
Why didn't you make a poll!?

So, to answer the question.

It isn't Bullshido, because it's not crap.

If you had experience with it, it would be worth giving you a more detailed answer, but seeing as you don't know what you're talking about and insist on asserting illogical poo, you get a stupid answer to your stupid question.

**** I didn't even know I made two threads.

:bbd:

Ted Deadly
2/09/2006 4:51pm,
From now on, Muay Thai will be known as 'Gracie Boxing', a wholly owned subsidiary of BJJ.

Hannibal
2/09/2006 7:47pm,
Oh please.

Grappling arts like Judo,BJJ,wrestling,sambo etc are just that. Grappling arts. Their fantastic at what they do and their purpose is not really to make their students hardcore strikers. Learn grappling from the grapplers, learn striking from the strikers.

As for calling bullshit on bjj or judo, that is nonsense. Both arts have been tried and tested in full contact tournements and have a solid track record for turning out good fighters.

DCS
2/09/2006 7:56pm,
BJJ striking is great for what it does. I was taught to set up takedowns with simple, effective strikes, borrowed from other arts. This has been proven to work. On the other hand, elbowing the grappler in the spine is proven NOT to work.

Unless you're a girl. (http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?t=19892&highlight=Erin+Toughill)

MONGO
2/09/2006 8:04pm,
BJJ striking is great for what it does. I was taught to set up takedowns with simple, effective strikes, borrowed from other arts. This has been proven to work. On the other hand, elbowing the grappler in the spine is proven NOT to work.

Your argument that an elbow to the spine doesn't work on a trained grappler but the BJJ striking methods will work on a trained striker, or anyone with training?

I don't think that any of the striking methods in BJJ are as good as Boxing, MT, KK or any of that stuff.

And since JFS's ground grapple bullshit isn't as good as BJJ or Judo it is bullshit so......would that make BJJ bullshit if it is held to the same standard?

:5wow: I am amazed at the stupidity of your argument.

eyebeams
2/09/2006 8:08pm,
Both judo and bjj teach a form of striking which is very limited compared to MT/Boxing/krotty.

Does this make those arts bullshido? If not, why not?

When we get to "suboptimal," we have to define terms. I'd say it's:

* A technique that is inferior to another technique that serves the same purpose.

Royce threw lots of lazy side kicks in early UFCs. I don't think they were supoptimal at all, because they were an effective tool to set up his takedown. He proved it. Smilarly, if you can show that a technique used within its preferred strategy is inferior to another technique used for the same or a similar strategy, you've proved sub-optimal technique.

MONGO
2/09/2006 8:20pm,
The fact of the matter is that if someone wanted to learn how to box from me, they would be sorely disappointed in the quality of my skills and teaching ability. Every system has its strengths and its weaknesses, even BJJ. The irrational nutriding aside, I would not expect to learn to much skill in striking from Judo or BJJ so I would take it upon myself to go cross train. That doesn't mean that Judo or BJJ is BS.

I have no problem with JFS being exposed as Bullshit but some of the arguments that were posted up were stupid.

The staff all expected everyone to side with them without everyone else having the facts. I think that the sane thing to do was to stay moderate until the facts came in.

Cause there definitely wasn't any convincing arguments either way until the evidence came in.

MONGO
2/09/2006 8:30pm,
The problem with that was that I am not sure that anyone had responded to what was actually going on in those pictures. I read you label them as the anti grapple and all that **** but there was nothing convincing.

I am trying to say that the lack of information in this whole fiasco was appalling until the end. There was little info to back up the claims that were made on either side and how could anyone actually expect to make an informed judgement off of the bullshit that was posted in the investigation or any of your arguments.

And that whole post you quoted was just trying to illustrate how stupid your argument was. I by no stretch of the imagination feel that an elbow to the spine is the anti grapple and I agree with the claims made by Anthony now only after seeing all of the evidence.

MONGO
2/09/2006 8:56pm,
I know what it looks like, I have no problem seeing that in most places that it could be construed as crappling but there was none of the other info to add a context to what was being shown. For all I know, it could have degenerated into something else.

Its logical for others not to pick a side unless there is all the facts.

Your convincing argument was that he don't know the grapple and still pictures show him doing the grapple. The entire thing ended up like a popularity contest without any factual basis until now.

To most of us that didn't have all the info, it looked like a war between assholes. You and Anthony against JFS, no real reason to be too convinced that either side was logical or had any particularly extensive MA education to side with out of good faith.