PDA

View Full Version : Just Say "NO" to Ignorance



Pages : [1] 2 3 4 5

Sheol
4/13/2003 2:18pm,
Everyone is never going to agree on everything, but I believe that the vast majority of us are tired of the idiotic speculation that pervades the various media outlets and pretentious 'alternate' news sites that share the innate arrogance borne from ignorance of the truth. At fault are the legions of posturing editors and writers whose works reflect a focus on entertainment and ideological pandering rather than any sincere effort to simply bring the undistorted facts. However, the core of the problem is the audience itself. The audience is both the customer AND the product for any media organization, be it the L.A. Times, CNN, Al Jazeera, or Alternet. They are not merely attempting to serve their audience, but they are also seeking to further their own goals, be it to sell ad space or promote ideology. All of it relies upon the willingness of the audience to accept their so-called news reporting... and most members of their audience do exactly that.

What if the audience was to reject those editorials passed off as news or the slanted wording scripted for the talking heads? What if the audience rejected the dishonest substitution of opinion for fact? What if the audience voiced their own opinion by cancelling their subsciption, changing the channel (or turning off the television), and letting those so-called news organizations know how little they think of their programming? What if the audience hit them where it hurts... their sponsors, whether commercial or political? What if the audience held those organizations responsible for the synthesized drivel? Then maybe, just maybe, we will start seeing some objectiveness and honest behaviour.

I don't object to the opinions of journalists. There's nothing wrong with their having and voicing them. I do object to attempts to pass off opinion as fact and ideologically slanted views as objective reporting. That kind of behaviour is dishonest and I have no tolerance for it. Hopefully, the rest of you are as well. Editorials and opinion articles belong in their appropriate section. They shouldn't be passed off as 'honest', factual reporting.

PizDoff
4/13/2003 2:39pm,
"Everyone is never going to agree on everything"
i disagree (lol)

What if people knew what sensationalism meant?



--
Hard work, Patience, Dedication.
The more you sweat in training, the less you bleed later.
"Just one more........rep!!! ARGH!!!" *Collapses*

J Zen
4/13/2003 3:35pm,
Contrary to what people believe, the media gives the audiences what they "want to see", not what they ought to see (objective information). News media is a business with money-making as its primary motive, frankly I can't see how they will change and devote their resources and efforts to truth-findings. It doesn't help either that most people tend not to expose themselves to media for the purpose of education (as much as they like to think that they are) - they are simply seeking an outlet of information that further reinforces their views. We are more likely to seek evidence that prove us right rather than ones that prove us wrong (which is how objective science ought to be pursued). Ignorance is part of our nature and will probably always be somewhat influential in the formation of our perception. After all what really counts for us is not "what is", but "how we want to see it". I am not really convinced that by rejecting certain views or information that you deem "ignorant to the truth" can get rid of one's ideological bias since we are just ending up rejecting one interpretation of facts in favor of another interpretation of facts. Beside, I have yet to see a single news media that can really be considered "objective" or "ideologically neutral". It just wouldn't seem to work, people want to take side and identify themselves to a particular ideology.

Shura
4/13/2003 3:39pm,
Everyone is entitled to broadcast their opinion, though that doesn't justify out right lying.
people just have to take everything they hear with a pinch of salt, and never rely on a single source for information.

By the way, anybody seen that site www.welovetheiarqiinformationminister.com
I didn't get the name right, but search for it anyway
I had iraqi tv on the last few weeks, and that guy was hilarious


Now doesn't that make you feel better?

PizDoff
4/13/2003 4:04pm,
"Contrary to what people believe, the media gives the audiences what they "want to see", "
absolutely

--
Hard work, Patience, Dedication.
The more you sweat in training, the less you bleed later.
"Just one more........rep!!! ARGH!!!" *Collapses*

Boyd
4/13/2003 4:52pm,
Everyone is never going to agree on everything, but I believe that the vast majority of us are tired of the idiotic speculation that pervades the various media outlets and pretentious 'alternate' news sites that share the innate arrogance borne from ignorance of the truth.

I'm mad as Hell and I'm not gonna take it anymore!

They don't call it the Nazi PARTY for nothing!

FingerorMoon?
4/13/2003 5:46pm,
No

--------
Don't view the glass as half empty, view it as half full of ****.
--------

The Wastrel
4/13/2003 5:59pm,
Jzen,
I don't think that Sheol is talking about something as simple as "bias" or competing versions of truth, or anything like that. What journalists do is craft "stories" that interest people; that sounds innocuous enough, but life, events, etc. do not come together as stories. Not to sound like a pomo theorist here, but the drive towards construction of narratives can do a lot more to obfuscate truth than simple misreporting of facts can. You can take a good handful of verifiably true information and construct some narrative out of it that is completely false. That's a little closer to what I see going on. That sort of thing can be a lot more difficult to identify when it does occur, because the *facts* are all there, but it's the linkages and the elisions that make all the difference. Anyone remember a few weeks ago when I pointed out that the media was crafting a story about unanticipated and skillful resistance from Iraqi forces frustrating the invasion? The war was days old. Days. All the information employed in the story was correct, impossible to point out as false, but the lie was GLARINGLY obvious.

As for the "take it with a grain of salt" crowd, isn't that sort of Sheol's point, but without resorting to cliches?

**The most miraculous power that can verifiably be attributed to "chi" is its ability to be all things to virtually all people, depending on what version of the superstition they are attempting to defend at any given moment.**

poet
4/13/2003 6:02pm,
Boyd -
"I'm mad as Hell and I'm not gonna take it anymore!"
Peter Finch - "Network" Good movie.

But if all of us (most on this forum anyway) see the slants in each media, is their biased reporting really effective?
Do we just not trust all media like we do politicians?

Dispite the media's obvious short commings, would you rather have more information (even slanted) or less?

"I do not agree with what you have to say but, I will defend to the death your right to say it."
-Voltaire

The Wastrel
4/13/2003 6:19pm,
Less frequent, more quantity. More time to digest before we discover that something has to be recanted.

**The most miraculous power that can verifiably be attributed to "chi" is its ability to be all things to virtually all people, depending on what version of the superstition they are attempting to defend at any given moment.**

poet
4/13/2003 6:26pm,
W -
"More time to digest..."

Some won't digest and create stones. :-)

"I do not agree with what you have to say but, I will defend to the death your right to say it."
-Voltaire

PizDoff
4/13/2003 6:34pm,
please man, i just had dinner...

WAstrel where did you learn that word elisions? I had to go look it up lol

--
Hard work, Patience, Dedication.
The more you sweat in training, the less you bleed later.
"Just one more........rep!!! ARGH!!!" *Collapses*

patfromlogan
4/13/2003 10:13pm,
Lack of skill and blathering by talking heads is not a serious issue. Ownership is a serious issue. That one man owns over 1,200 radio stations is a serious issue. That the TV networks do not report the news about the FCC is a serious issue. That a major weapons/nuclear conglomerate such as G.E. owns a TV network (NBC) lends credence to the assumption that we will not hear anything critical of those industries on that network. That the networks are pushing the position that the FCC should abandon the media ownership regulatory scheme in its entirety is a serious issue. That the little guys, the independent TV station groups argue that such a move would quash media competition and limit public discourse is a serious issue.

Monopoly capitalism doesn't operate in a way to insure that the information needed to make decisions in a democracy. That is the serious issue.

http://www.forbes.com/home_europe/2003/01/06/cx_pp_0106media.html
"Powell and his team have been studying media ownership at the behest of an order by the U.S. Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia, indicating that the regulations may need revision. The court in the past two years has considered several cases challenging federal regulations. The rules in question prohibit broadcasters from owning TV stations that reach more than 35% of the national market, limit the ownership of newspapers and TV stations in the same markets, and--the mother of them all--prevent media companies from owning more than one of the big four broadcast networks."

Democracy is on the line, guys, and guess who keeps winning. HINT....it's called by us commies the RULING CLASS.


>>>Always walk on a bright, wide road. If you choose to live with your right posture, you don't have to go on a dark road or a malodorous place. Oyama

patfromlogan
4/13/2003 10:19pm,
The FCC is considering easing existing rules that limit the number of local TV and radio stations that a single company can control.

Minority station owners are an endangered species pursued by large corporate predators who consume the single and small stations. Public interest demands and public interest requires the protection of stations who stand alone like the dots in a Pac Man game destined to be gobbled up by media conglomerates.

Hitler would have loved the conglomerate position.

>>>Always walk on a bright, wide road. If you choose to live with your right posture, you don't have to go on a dark road or a malodorous place. Oyama

The Wastrel
4/13/2003 10:37pm,
Media anti-trust is a SERIOUS problem. No doubt of that. But Pat, consider what state-owned media CAN mean, and you will realize that there is no clear answer. Of course, NPR is nothing like NK's state media.

**The most miraculous power that can verifiably be attributed to "chi" is its ability to be all things to virtually all people, depending on what version of the superstition they are attempting to defend at any given moment.**

The Wastrel
4/13/2003 10:37pm,
Pat,
How can you be a communist? This is a serious question.

**The most miraculous power that can verifiably be attributed to "chi" is its ability to be all things to virtually all people, depending on what version of the superstition they are attempting to defend at any given moment.**