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jackal
7/31/2005 8:38am,
Hey all. Was just having a geez at the discussion over whether BJJ is a fad or not and this sparked some thought...

I don't think that grappling is a fad I just think that BJJ owning grappling is a fadWhat are people's thoughts on this?

Note my aim in this thread is not to revisit whether or not BJJ is a fad so please don't waste my time with comments on that topic, if you wanna say something about it go to the thread dedicated to it.

Lampa
7/31/2005 9:23am,
I was under the impression that BJJ "owning grappling" has already started to fade. It was really just a perception of beginners, anyway.

Nothing against BJJ, but it's not like good judo or sambo instructors just stopped producing competant grapplers when BJJ started to get media attention.

king of seals
7/31/2005 9:54am,
In the MMA context, wrestlers are winning.

Captain Spaulding
7/31/2005 10:36am,
Like was said in the thread Sambo vs BJJ, there's a lot of overlap now where there wasn't as much before.

I take BJJ and have been told that up until a few years ago, there was a real prejudice against leg locks; it was seen as a Sambo thing (as well as other, not so positive things). But that this is no longer the case in BJJ, or at least, leg locks are much more accepted and practiced now.

Cross-pollination.

king of seals
7/31/2005 11:22am,
http://bjj.org/techniques/bjjfighter/gi/side/kneebar/tnday40058.jpg

bad credit
8/01/2005 4:11am,
Well, BJJ did revolutionize the MA's and get us away from striking. However, now Shooto grapplers and strikers are winning again after cross-training in BJJ.

Now this isn't an exact quote, but I think Helio Gracie said in an interview once that he was warned by his sons that taking BJJ to the world and teaching it to others would lead to fighters who could beat them. His reply was something about how if you were walking in the desert and saw a man dying of thirst, wouldn't you give him some of your water? Even if it meant giving him the strength to possibly beat you and take the rest of your water? He then said that JiuJitsu was that water.

I'm not a BJJ nutrider by any means, but I think that quote was beautiful. In Bujinkan Budo Taijutsu they teach that training and sparring aren't about proving yourself by beating others, but rather that you should train to be the best, and help your fellow students to the same level, espicially if they are behind. Similar ideas, just different words.

bad credit
8/01/2005 4:13am,
Let me add something; BJJ just had to teach those "behind" them in techniques with some tough love. Namely, armbars and RNC's and ki locks and the mount.

king of seals
8/01/2005 4:14am,
BJJ is now part of almost any MMAist training.

Locu5
8/01/2005 5:55am,
hI! how do ki lock? wiff pix? kkthx!!

Competition is how BJJ and the other grappling arts will evolve. BJJ is still a young art, just wait for the coming lineage wars and McBJJ; I give it 20 years or so.

Cassius
8/01/2005 1:59pm,
One thing I like about BJJ is that we tend to actively seek out Bullshido artists within our circles. Unlike a lot of other arts, it is hard for the instructors to hide behind "t3h d34dly" excuse for not sparring or competing, so there is really just the "we don't compete or train with anyone else because competition is immoral" excuse. On the other hand, there are lots of BJJ schools nowadays that seem to have McDojo practices. This is a shame, but the fact of the matter is that martial artists have to make a living somehow. If contracts keep the art I love alive, then I guess that is a price I will pay. Although paying $55 dollars a month to train 6 days a week is pretty sweet, I don't expect to be so lucky forever.

Back to the subject at hand, I think that as long as BJJ stays fluid, it will always be a competitive grappling art. Last I checked, BJJ was still doing pretty damn well at the ADCC, and wasn't exactly on the shitpile in terms of MMA, either. It's a constantly evolving system. BJJ helped force NHB/MMA to evolve, so it is not rocket science to predict that other arts will force BJJ to evolve. In a lot of cases, they already have. The real question is will BJJ continue to evolve to stay competitive, or will it become static and antiquated? I think the answer is pretty obvious.