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Glizy
9/08/2004 6:02pm,
I'd like to see what kind of kung fu training has gone bad, what does it lack? What doesn't it have? There are lot in other arts too but what makes Kung Fu different from the others?

What is wrong? What can be improved upon? How can the nature of kung fu be less bashed on as we minimize whats for competition and whats out there to promote the fighting spirit of the TCMA.

Questions and Answers upon all kung fu would be welcome.

We can critique every little thing on this thread :).

Shuma-Gorath
9/08/2004 6:11pm,
Insecure practictioners, for one.

WhiteShark
9/08/2004 6:18pm,
Add alive training and lose the colonial Chinese costume. Problem solved.

Solid
9/08/2004 7:12pm,
Add more boxing and karate, throw in some grappling, don't use heirarchical terms, sweat more and lift weights. Then kungfu would be pretty good.

Oh yeah, and throw out all the kungfu.

JKing
9/08/2004 7:35pm,
Why add karate?

Solid
9/08/2004 7:37pm,
Originally posted by JKing
Why add karate?

Good point

Dejavu
9/08/2004 7:59pm,
I'll just put it in one word:

Aliveness.

That is mostly what is inherently wrong with Kung Fu. The Chinese thingy is just cultural. Its just like wearing a yarmalka to someone's bar mitzvah.

Or was I the only one that did that?

Mr. Mantis
9/08/2004 10:54pm,
One thing that is missing is reality. You have to be strong. Infallable technique and speed will not save you.

Good kung fu is hard to find.

Mark Su Kow
9/09/2004 1:05am,
Forgive me I need to spout off for a sec. We use a lot of Kug Fuish movements and techniques in our Shorin Kempo. It has been my observation that by itself in today's world of MMA and NHB old style cookie cutter Kung Fu will not hold up. If you were to fight say only Tiger, or Crane form in their true sense, the moment you were taken down there goes the effectiveness of the form. Now, it is my opinion; like anything KF must evolve and incorperate defenses against the shoot and ground game. Mystical powers, Death Touch and No Hit K.O. F-all that, propaganda to create fear and to control the uneducated and unknowing. We have taken the 5 animal forms and adapted them into a MMA evolved state. There is no way I am going to use Rooted Stance in the clinch, or I would have to kick my own ass if I stayed in Fighting Horse any longer than a heartbeat. I feel that this forum which I love and am happy to be a part of has a very bias view of KF. I can't help but feel you are putting today's standards on a set of ancient ideas. If this were the 1300's and we were fighting people that just popped out of the rice patty I believe you could kick much butt in twisted tree or cat stance but today plain and simple. NO WAY. I realize Kempo is not true Kung Fu but, that is where our roots are from. Like I said before it is an evolved form. The Oregon Throwdown is this Sunday and the video will be posted I will dip my fights heavily in the Kung Fuish stuff so you guys can see that it is not completely useless. I can only pray that there is not a blockage in my Chi that day. MOX MOX is going to do the technical posting so there is added pressure for him to come through. OK guys and gals fire away...

Mox_Mox
9/09/2004 1:10am,
Great that's all I need, pressure. I'm not going to get a good nights sleep for weeks.

Mark Su Kow
9/09/2004 1:10am,
I knew I could count on you!

MUT
9/09/2004 3:41am,
Originally posted by Glizy
I'd like to see what kind of kung fu training has gone bad, what does it lack? What doesn't it have? There are lot in other arts too but what makes Kung Fu different from the others?

What is wrong? What can be improved upon? How can the nature of kung fu be less bashed on as we minimize whats for competition and whats out there to promote the fighting spirit of the TCMA.

Questions and Answers upon all kung fu would be welcome.

We can critique every little thing on this thread :).

It needs more aliveness in its training.

It needs more conditioning.

It needs to stop spouting bullshit about chi this and chi that.

It needs to crosstrain with some decent grappling.

Halogen
9/09/2004 5:58am,
The problem: Not enough sparring and competition.

The remedy: More sparring and competition.

wingchunnewbie
9/09/2004 6:20am,
Originally posted by MUT
It needs more aliveness in its training.

It needs more conditioning.
[/B][/QUOTE]

There are good CMA clubs that already do plenty of this. 'External' chinese MA have always used exercises like pushups and weight training. The awkard stances (like horse stance) aren't really there to be drilled for use in fighting, they're isometric exercises. I appreciate that modern physiology has discovered many more efficient methods of getting stronger, but I like a lot of the traditional stuff because it doesn't require any equipment, and you can clear your mind and meditate a little whilst doing it.



It needs to stop spouting bullshit about chi this and chi that.

Agreed. There's a close correlation between the instructor repeatedly claiming that physical conditioning is unnecessary when 'Qi' is properly used, and the class being full of fat middle-aged hippies who never hit each other.



It needs to crosstrain with some decent grappling. [/B]

To be fair, that applies to Kyokushin, Western Boxing and MT as much as it does to most CMA styles.

kaliblokeuk
9/09/2004 6:29am,
Originally posted by nedhinkly
troll

Pot. Black. Name calling??

I think the problem with kung fu is one of numbers. Too many people claiming its the best art there is with nothing to back it up.

I have trained with some WC guys who were pretty badass, but that was (as with most things) down to their training (hard).

MUT
9/09/2004 7:31am,
Originally posted by wingchunnewbie
It needs more conditioning.


"There are good CMA clubs that already do plenty of this. 'External' chinese MA have always used exercises like pushups and weight training. The awkard stances (like horse stance) aren't really there to be drilled for use in fighting, they're isometric exercises. I appreciate that modern physiology has discovered many more efficient methods of getting stronger, but I like a lot of the traditional stuff because it doesn't require any equipment, and you can clear your mind and meditate a little whilst doing it."

True there are good CMA clubs..but few and far between. now that we are onto the topic...what are some more external kf styles?



"Agreed. There's a close correlation between the instructor repeatedly claiming that physical conditioning is unnecessary when 'Qi' is properly used, and the class being full of fat middle-aged hippies who never hit each other"

*Laughs and points at fat middle-aged hippies*



"To be fair, that applies to Kyokushin, Western Boxing and MT as much as it does to most CMA styles. [/B][/QUOTE] "

Yes but you have more boxers/thai boxers willing to crosstrain then kung fu people. Once again this is mainly due to BS instructors claiming that chi>>>>>>>>>t3h grappl3


But you do make fair points mate.