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TCDD
6/18/2004 1:22pm,
and yes i did a cursory search before I posted this

HAving been training for a fair old while and nearly always in the Uk I have never come across training 'contracts' where you have to sign up for a certain amount of time for a cost, but from reading posts, people who train in the USA seem to think it is commonplace

just wandering if anyone knows how this situation has come about and what exactly it offers, you/us as students (on top of the usual insurance/membership)

does it just tie your hands as to what else you can train in and with who?

Kempocos
6/18/2004 1:31pm,
It is not a " train here only contract" it is a " will pay for a years worth of classes" contract. It is very hard to cover the bills of rent, insurance, bookkeeping and make a profit. I know profit should not be the case, but only those who do not support a family will say that. contracts are used so the owner of the school can budget the costs. I personally like them and the school wrere I train does not have them. However there nis a billing company and they bill my credit card every month. This is good because rather than do the billing my instructor can keep training as well. The better he is the better he trains.

Blad3
6/18/2004 1:39pm,
I trained, in England, at a JJJ place which required a yearly contract. If you dislike it after a certain amount of time you cannot quite. Beside the fact that the training was terrible, it was an excellent experience, showing why a martial art like that doesn't work.

Yearly contracts are seldom for schools that aren't Bullshido's, it's obvious contracts are just to take your money, despite the fact that you might not want the product (the martial art.)

Antagony
6/18/2004 1:44pm,
I personally have seen contracts more commonly at TMA schools. The MMA gyms I've checked usually OFFER contracts, but they aren't require. If you were to do a contract with the MMA gym, you get a reduced rate.

I also concur with Kempocos.

bushi51
6/18/2004 2:30pm,
The same goes for every BJJ school I have seen or investigated. If you do not want to sign a contract it costs you crazy money a month.

TCDD
6/18/2004 2:43pm,
thats the other thing that confuses me, I dunno what the reason is, but damn, MA seems to be expensive in the US (either that or I go to cheap places)

the going rate over here probably translates at about half to two thirds of the price you seem to pay (very roughly ive never paid more than $10 for 2-2.5 hrs of training, except seminars)

WhiteShark
6/18/2004 3:45pm,
Insurance is astronomical in the states.

katana
6/18/2004 3:53pm,
Here's why:

http://www.overlawyered.com/

Peter H.
6/18/2004 4:12pm,
MA insurance is not that bad. I pay $450 a year for $50k of personal injury per student and $50k or property damage, for upto 30 students, if I need insurance over that, I have to pay and extra $8 a student a year. My car insurance costs more than that and I get a lot less for my money.

oldshadow
6/18/2004 4:45pm,
In the schools I have taught they have short-term contracts like 6 weeks. We also had a system to make monthly no contract payments. The longest contract we had was 1 year. Of course the longer contract was at a better over all price. There a lot bills to pay when you run an school/gym.

Phrost
6/18/2004 4:55pm,
There's nothing wrong with the use of contracts. Suckering people into excessive contracts at ridiculous prices is the problem.

It's just a lot harder to rip someone off if you have nothing to ensure they have to pay you month after month.

FCTKD
6/18/2004 6:04pm,
Our contracts are just to set an agreed price for training for a period of time, but if you want out you can leave.

Blad3
6/18/2004 8:45pm,
Yearly contract - wether it's 50 dollars a month or 200, they're simpyl not fair - beacuse you have to pay even if you want to quit or don't like it.

katana
6/18/2004 9:05pm,
Originally posted by Blad3
Yearly contract - wether it's 50 dollars a month or 200, they're simpyl not fair - beacuse you have to pay even if you want to quit or don't like it.

I think the approach I like the best are schools that allow you to do month-to-month but also give appropriate discounts if you pay for 3-6-12 month stretches up front. This allows people who don't have the commitment or desire to only pay for what they want or can afford, but allows people who are willing to stick with the training to get a discount without getting too badly burned if they do decide to bail out.

At the end of the day it's perfectly fair for an instructor to make a living and try to ensure they have some type of steady income. My biggest issue with contracts are those that are done through the hard-sell with the knowledge that most people signing them won't stick around.